15 reasons Macs are still better than Windows PCs

Dan Warne
14 November 2008, 10:19 PM


With Windows 7 coming up, it's time to yet again ponder on whether Microsoft has the upper hand in operating systems. Here's 15 reasons it doesn't.



A journalist colleague of mine recently put this question out there:

"I'm sure I'll either get ignored or flamed for this but what's with all the pro-Mac stuff at the moment? It seems as though everyone […] is either using or recommending Macs these days.

I'm not wanting to start a flame war here but I'm genuinely interested in why this general shift has occurred.

Do people think Vista is truly that awful that they can't use it or even recommend a normal Windows desktop/notebook? I use it every day and I admit I don't like it much either but I don't think it's that bad that I'd jump to using or recommending a Mac instead..."

I long ago stopped actively seeking out Mac vs PC discussions (partly because Macs are now PCs -- so the argument is more about Mac OS X vs Windows vs Linux than a proprietary Mac architecture vs an x86 PC architecture), but I still find it confounding that after all these years, people still don't know the basics of the upsides of Macs and OS X. Perhaps it's because of the tiresome arguments from people like this.

So here's my answer. Note, despite what I said above about the argument really being between operating systems these days, I've looked at Macs as a hardware and software combination in this article, pitted against regular PCs running Windows.

Do you agree/disagree with the points here? Tell me why -- but make sure your points are solidly argued, and make sure you read the whole article before flaming me. There's an important bit right at the very bottom.

1. Reliable sleep mode

The killer feature of every Mac which can't be underestimated (and you don't realise how important it is until you own a Mac) is OS X's 100% reliable, near-instant suspend and resume.

Windows PCs have just never had this. Reliability on Windows is hit and miss, and it's nowhere near instant. As a result most people are in the habit of shutting down their PC totally -- or worse, leaving them on 24/7, chewing up power.

The difference between Mac and Windows in this respect is the difference between broadband and dialup internet. Back in the 90s, many people couldn't see the point of paying extra for an always-on internet service, as "it only takes a minute to connect using the dialup…"

I always shake my head in bemusement when I read about Microsoft working on dramatically shortening boot time on Windows. Boot time shouldn't be such a pivotal issue if suspend and resume worked well. Mac users probably reboot their Mac on average about once a month -- and often only to install an OS update. Which leads to my second point.

2. Extremely fast boot times

Rebooting a Windows PC can be such a painful experience that you really procrastinate doing it. Unless you're running on the highest spec hardware, Vista can take minutes to start up.

Mac OS X starts up from a cold boot in about 25 seconds on a current-gen MacBook Pro. As another journalist contributing to the discussion observed, this is not a faked boot speed, where the operating system maker has rushed to get the login window on screen, but delayed loading the rest of the OS. It's a genuine boot-to-usable-desktop time.

3. Apple uses good quality parts.

Aside from the operating system, Mac hardware is usually good quality. Apple's fit and finish doesn't generally bend and creak like the plastic panels on many PC laptops; Apple's keyboards are high quality; Apple selects good quality parts like very good LCD panels for its screens.

You can essentially buy a Mac product sight-unseen and know you'll be happy with the quality of the display, whereas PC laptops are a huge grab bag ranging from horrendous, dim rubbish to spectacular. (I have to admit I personally don't think the basic MacBook screen is of a quality that I would want to buy, but then, I think it's still better than a lot of PC notebook screens.)

4. Less blinking lights.


Apple doesn't festoon its hardware with blinking lights and inconveniently placed wireless on/off buttons, headphone jacks, etc.

PC manufacturers are starting to understand this and are producing increasingly clean designs (The HP 2133, pictured right, is quite a good example), but it's still my #1 bugbear about PC notebooks.

When I'm using my laptop in a dark room at night I don't want five bright purple and orange status lights blinking away at me. And when I'm using the laptop propped up on my legs on the sofa I don't want to be constantly accidentally turning off the WiFi. I don't want the headphone jack mounted on the front of the notebook, because when I plug the headphones in, the jack will be bumping in to my body if I've got the notebook propped up on my knees, lying on the sofa.

This lack of basic design refinement can make PC notebooks annoying to use for the entire lifespan of the unit (and it's not always something you can 'see in the shop before you buy' -- consider how many PCs are corporate-issued, or bought mail-order these days.)

5. OS X + Windows is better than just Windows

Ignoring Linux for a second, on a Mac I can legitimately run OS X and Windows (natively, or under virtualisation). On a PC I can only legitimately run Windows.

It means I can use OS X for everything, but if there's the occasional application for Windows I need to use (specialised company application; MS Access; mobile phone firmware upgrader utilities) I can easily do use Windows.

Another of my colleagues said she's found a good use for OS X's Spaces virtual desktop feature -- OS X on one desktop and Windows on another desktop. Of course, you can always pause a virtual machine, too, which means having Windows on-call when you need it doesn't need to be chewing up CPU time in the background.


6. Easier to troubleshoot Macs.

It's usually pretty easy to figure out what's going wrong with a Mac. There are three applications that help you and are all in one place and easy to find in the Applications/Utilities folder:


  • Activity Monitor (a more powerful version of Windows Task Manager)

  • Console (which shows all system logs in one place)

  • Disk Utility (which helps you identify disk integrity issues).

It's very rare that you can't get a decent hint of where a system problem lies from those three apps. On Windows, similar apps are available in the system, but they're more scattered and immeasurably more difficult for the average user to find.

7. A culture of good quality community software

There's a culture of very good quality freeware/shareware with excellent user interfaces on Mac -- probably a result of Apple leading by example in user-interface design and shareware authors emulating this.

The average Mac user could get away with only purchasing Microsoft Office and using freeware/shareware and Apple provided software for everything else.

On Windows, the signal to noise ratio in freeware/shareware is extremely high. There's so much junk software out there; it can be hard to find a tool that's good quality.

Some examples of exceptionally good shareware which I don't think there's an equivalently good Windows alternative for (taking into account both the software capabilities -and- the front-end GUI):

8. More useful apps out of the box

Every Mac comes with some very useful apps that don't come on Windows. (Of course, you can easily download them for Windows, but ubiquity of app distribution can make or break a platform -- it's why people have never really equated Symbian Series 60 phones with "useful applications".) Useful apps on every Mac:

  • Stickies

  • iPhoto
  • Expose

  • iCal

  • Time Machine.

Yes, this is no barrier to a Windows power user. But remember, the majority of computer users are not power users.

9. Neat and contained system settings.

Apple is very neat with its OS config settings. In Windows, there's many, many places you can change system-wide settings -- the registry, add/remove programs, the hardware manager, the services manager, network connections, control panel, etc.

On a Mac, the OS config settings are basically all in the control panel (with a few exceptions -- notably, the default browser can only be changed through Apple's own Safari browser -- evil.)


It makes both using a Mac and supporting other people using Macs much easier. One specific example: it is overcomplicated to guide a user to editing the TCP/IP settings for a particular network adaptor on Windows, but it's one of the most common things you have to do to resolve network issues. 

But accessing network adaptors is a cinch on Mac OS X...

And TCP/IP settings are easily accessible under "advanced".


10. Apple doesn't load the system up with crap.

Oh sure, Apple festoons its OS with hooks into online services designed to get you to spend money. But on the whole, Apple's festooning with vendor-specific services is much less intrusive than on Windows. -image-

Just about every (brand name) PC sold comes loaded up with junk that keeps popping up at you reminding you your six month trial is about to run out, and some apps are deliberately difficult to uninstall.


Macs come with iPhoto (linked to with Apple's book/photo printing service), MobileMe (stays out of your way unless you specifically activate it), iTunes (to purchase stuff through the iTunes store) and so on. Basically, Apple doesn't try to force its way into your wallet like PCs tend to -- Apple takes a carrot approach with some genuinely useful services rather than a stick ("your PC is our advertising billboard, cough up buddy").

Of course, this isn't a problem with Windows itself per se, but it is inextricably married to the Windows user experience for most people.

11. Tonnes of small reasons make Mac OS X better.

There are a large number of very small reasons a Mac is great to work on:

  • every version of OS X has sophisticated screenshot capability built in. CMD+4 provides a selector marquee. CMD+4+Spacebar takes just one window. CMD+3 takes the whole screen. You can set the format of the screenshot file and where Mac OS saves it.
  • The inbuilt image viewing app is powerful -- it can view PDF and open/export to most other image formats; you can crop, resize, rotate, adjust colour balance, etc.
  • Expose lets you quickly see all your open windows, or your desktop, or just the windows of your current app. Way better than ALT+Tab (which Macs also have) or Flip 3D (which Macs thankfully don't have.)
  • The Dock is much more efficient to use than the Windows start menu and taskbar -- the icon opens an app or returns to it if it's already open. It doesn't become crowded when you have lots of windows open.
  • Target disk mode allows you to boot a Mac into a mode where the whole machine acts like an external hard drive. Plug it to another Mac using Firewire and you have the easiest way in the world to do a system-to-system drive mirror. (Though, disappointingly, Apple didn't include this feature in its latest MacBook.)
  • Quick look lets you view pretty much all major file formats by clicking on the file and pressing the space bar -- no need to wait for an app to launch. Windows simply doesn’t have this.

12. Still no need for additional security software.

On a Mac, you don't have to run additional security software, which therefore doesn't slow down the computer, doesn't cause problems, and you don't have to shell out for an annual subscription for it.

This is an enormously contentious point. Some people will argue black and blue that you need to be a good citizen in the world and make sure you're scanning for Windows viruses on your Mac email in case you accidentally forward on a virus sent from one Windows user, to you, to another Windows user.

My opinion is: if Fords have a problem with their wheels falling off that's never going to be resolved, I'm not going to drive my Holden slowly on every road just because a Ford might find its wheels falling off at any time.

And what's with Microsoft selling OneCare anti-virus? It has decided to make money off selling a fix to a problem in its original product (Windows). That's just offensive.

13. Apple seems largely to be lameness free

On the whole Apple seems to come up with far fewer lame ideas that were non-starters to begin with. Microsoft, on the other hand, is the master of lame ideas. For example, Sideshow in Vista. Windows Ultimate Extras. 10 editions of the same OS. XPS file format to compete with PDF. One size fits all UAC -- "You just tried to change the date. Did you really mean to do that?"

14. Power of the Linux command line with Photoshop CS4

Just for a moment, let me diverge from Mac vs PC and take a look at Mac vs "all the alternatives".

There are a few key apps that are, for many people, 'must-haves'. Microsoft Office. Adobe Reader. Adobe Flash. Photoshop.

Linux can satisfy almost all of those needs. But Photoshop is a sticking point. Although there has been great progress in WINE -- even sponsored by Google --, you can still only run Photoshop CS2 (or CS3 if you're lucky.)

And don't tell me the GIMP is a total Photoshop replacement. I've tried it many times. Its user interface just isn't up to scratch yet.

The reality is, until Adobe really puts its support officially behind Linux (like Google has with Picasa, for example) it's always going to be an uphill battle.

With OS X, you get a polished OS, with the power of a UNIX/Linux command line (not the lame DOS-style prompt of Windows) and the ability to run the latest, officially supported version of Photoshop.

15. File sharing is much easier

Sharing files between computers has always been something that feels like it should be a lot easier than it is. Of course, one of the reasons for this is the need for security, which is opposed to ease of use, because security is about putting up barriers.

But it's also about user interface design. Mac OS hasn't always been easy for sharing between computers; in fact I'd say it's only 10.5 which has got it mostly right. But in 10.5 it actually is easy enough for ordinary users to use -- if you want to share the files on your computer, you switch on file sharing in control panel.

Shared computers on the local network appear in any file management window in OS X like a disk drive -- and when you try to open them, you'll be prompted for a system username and password.

It's the first form of computer file sharing that really puts it in front of the average user's eyes without them having to do anything to get to it.

Whoah, hold up there, anonymous flamer.

Before anyone tries to put words into my mouth: here's what I'm not saying:

  • I'm not saying a Mac is a remotely good choice if you're a career gamer, though there are enough games and adequate performance to satisfy a casual gamer (someone who likes to play a game once a week, isn't involved in the gaming scene and wouldn't know what LOLZ actually meant.)
  • I'm not saying Macs 'just work' and never have problems, because like any computer, they do.
  • I'm not saying hardware compatibility is the same with Macs. There are endless hardware devices that don't have Mac drivers. It's just that there's enough good ones in every category that do have Mac support for it not to be a problem.
  • I'm not saying Macs are for people who like building systems from scratch, or having maximum opportunity to chop and change parts at will.
  • I'm also not saying Apple is a nice company to deal with -- it's not. Its whole corporate ethos seems to be "be smug and arrogant; turn your back and pretend everything's fine, oh and also, polished plastic never gets scratched" as often as possible. (Though frankly, the superior hardware and software goes some of the way in actually allowing them to get away with this, and mostly, the front-end customer service is very good.)
  • I'm not saying that Apple is always good at admitting faults. While it is generally good with warranty if it admits a problem, if it is in denial about a problem, it will sometimes make people wait a year before they will begrudgingly accept the cost of fixing it across the board.
  • And finally, I'm not saying Apple's DRM (which it refuses to share with anyone else) is anything other than a repellant policy, from a company that has a monopoly position.

On balance, though, Macs just let you get stuff done, whereas Windows computers constantly find ways of annoying you.

That's my take on it. What's yours?


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Obi-Wan Kenobi (New user):

Is it just me or did the last three happen to be "filler" reasons?

14 November 2008, 10:21 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Hemma (New user):

Dan, my PC never asked me what's G20.... and The Mac, throws personal insults to the PC (Obama is very different to Justin Long... who is just a dousche). That's just.... nevermind.

15 November 2008, 1:10 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

alonzomarkkenneth (New user):

Can you help me answer this question

How Operating Systems Software differ from other software?

25 September 2011, 2:09 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

AIheg (User):

Quoting alonzomarkkenneth:
How Operating Systems Software differ from other software?


They are not 'software' in the common sense, they are the founding connection between your hardware and your PC.. err computer (don't want to piss off the mac fanboys.. for now). How they are designed therefore affects the performance and reliability of your whole system. They have extensions, commonly called drivers (although thats a Windows based name and Macs use kexts or 'kernal extensions' which you'll rarely ever hear because you can't add parts to your Mac). every program has to be designed for a specific operating system in order to work on it.

To give you an example or how important this is, Mac's Operating System; OSX naturally consumes much more memory than Windows (all versions). This means you get a lot less bang for your buck, but you're blessed with 'beautiful' OSX environment. Windows also has much more applications and allows you to upgrade your computer without having to buy a entirely new machine (and screen if you own an iMac). On the other hand, the OSX environment is a lot simpler to use, if less configurable and suits many users that do not have lots of knowledge about computing, it also generally has much better cross program features as lots of the best programs are made by the same company.

Apple's restricted policy makes stuff alot more reliable in general, although I will comment that as I wrote this from my workplace's 24GB Mac Pro (I'm a producer and Apple Logic is mac-only now), my system froze for about 30secs and Logic crashed in the background, so maybe I spoke too soon.





26 September 2011, 2:50 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

iCFX (New user):

Very well put sir.

05 June 2012, 9:00 PM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

AIheg (User):

Quoting alonzomarkkenneth:
How Operating Systems Software differ from other software?


They are not 'software' in the common sense, they are the founding connection between your hardware and your PC.. err computer (don't want to piss off the mac fanboys.. for now). How they are designed therefore affects the performance and reliability of your whole system. They have extensions, commonly called drivers (although thats a Windows based name and Macs use kexts or 'kernal extensions' which you'll rarely ever hear because you can't add parts to your Mac). every program has to be designed for a specific operating system in order to work on it.

To give you an example or how important this is, Mac's Operating System; OSX naturally consumes much more memory than Windows (all versions). This means you get a lot less bang for your buck, but you're blessed with 'beautiful' OSX environment. Windows also has much more applications and allows you to upgrade your computer without having to buy a entirely new machine (and screen if you own an iMac). On the other hand, the OSX environment is a lot simpler to use, if less configurable and suits many users that do not have lots of knowledge about computing, it also generally has much better cross program features as lots of the best programs are made by the same company.

Apple's restricted policy makes stuff alot more reliable in general, although I will comment that as I wrote this from my workplace's 24GB Mac Pro (I'm a producer and Apple Logic is mac-only now), my system froze for about 30secs and Logic crashed in the background, so maybe I spoke too soon.





26 September 2011, 2:50 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

MrUnicorn12 (New user):

So first you say you don't want to piss off the Mac fans, then you bash the Mac. I don't see why PC fans are so stubborn. I've used both and agree they both have faults, but I ultimately, I think the Mac is the clear winner for actualy working , but pcs are best for gaming only because it's customization and software availibility(because the PC fanboys are louder).

04 November 2011, 1:28 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

AIheg (User):

Do I bash the Mac? Or do I weigh them up fairly and tell you of my experiences on my two Macs... yeah, thats right... TWO... did you for get to real that Logic crashed in the background? Yeah, you know, the program that APPLE make....

In case you didn't get what I am hinting at... I was A. Using a Mac and B. Probably quite a bit more knowledgeable about what I was talking about than you ever will be.

You, my good sir, are a fanboy. You just can't see it.

04 November 2011, 1:42 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

swjr98 (New user):

Quoting AIheg:
Do I bash the Mac? Or do I weigh them up fairly and tell you of my experiences on my two Macs... yeah, thats right... TWO... did you for get to real that Logic crashed in the background? Yeah, you know, the program that APPLE make....

In case you didn't get what I am hinting at... I was A. Using a Mac and B. Probably quite a bit more knowledgeable about what I was talking about than you ever will be

you sir are an idiot because me and everyone i have talked to have had no problems with their macs so what does that say about your 2 its called not using the computer and program properly and you can say i am a fanboy but i have used 5 different pc's in a 6 year period and each of them shut down on me and i called the company and you know what they said its broken buy a new one. whereas my mac i have had for 4 years now and no problems so you tell me which ones better




06 March 2013, 4:51 AM (2 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

AIheg (User):

Do I bash the Mac? Or do I weigh them up fairly and tell you of my experiences on my two Macs... yeah, thats right... TWO... did you for get to real that Logic crashed in the background? Yeah, you know, the program that APPLE make....

In case you didn't get what I am hinting at... I was A. Using a Mac and B. Probably quite a bit more knowledgeable about what I was talking about than you ever will be.

You, my good sir, are a fanboy. You just can't see it.

04 November 2011, 1:42 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

AIheg (User):

Do I bash the Mac? Or do I weigh them up fairly and tell you of my experiences on my two Macs... yeah, thats right... TWO... did you for get to real that Logic crashed in the background? Yeah, you know, the program that APPLE make....

In case you didn't get what I am hinting at... I was A. Using a Mac and B. Probably quite a bit more knowledgeable about what I was talking about than you ever will be.

You, my good sir, are a fanboy. You just can't see it.

04 November 2011, 1:42 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

AIheg (User):

Do I bash the Mac? Or do I weigh them up fairly and tell you of my experiences on my two Macs... yeah, thats right... TWO... did you for get to real that Logic crashed in the background? Yeah, you know, the program that APPLE make....

In case you didn't get what I am hinting at... I was A. Using a Mac and B. Probably quite a bit more knowledgeable about what I was talking about than you ever will be.

You, my good sir, are a fanboy. You just can't see it.

04 November 2011, 1:42 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

AIheg (User):

Do I bash the Mac? Or do I weigh them up fairly and tell you of my experiences on my two Macs... yeah, thats right... TWO... did you for get to real that Logic crashed in the background? Yeah, you know, the program that APPLE make....

In case you didn't get what I am hinting at... I was A. Using a Mac and B. Probably quite a bit more knowledgeable about what I was talking about than you ever will be.

You, my good sir, are a fanboy. You just can't see it.

04 November 2011, 1:43 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

AIheg (User):

Do I bash the Mac? Or do I weigh them up fairly and tell you of my experiences on my two Macs... yeah, thats right... TWO... did you for get to real that Logic crashed in the background? Yeah, you know, the program that APPLE make....

In case you didn't get what I am hinting at... I was A. Using a Mac and B. Probably quite a bit more knowledgeable about what I was talking about than you ever will be.

You, my good sir, are a fanboy. You just can't see it.

04 November 2011, 1:43 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

AIheg (User):

Do I bash the Mac? Or do I weigh them up fairly and tell you of my experiences on my two Macs... yeah, thats right... TWO... did you for get to real that Logic crashed in the background? Yeah, you know, the program that APPLE make....

In case you didn't get what I am hinting at... I was A. Using a Mac and B. Probably quite a bit more knowledgeable about what I was talking about than you ever will be.

You, my good sir, are a fanboy. You just can't see it.

04 November 2011, 1:43 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

AIheg (User):

Quoting alonzomarkkenneth:
How Operating Systems Software differ from other software?


They are not 'software' in the common sense, they are the founding connection between your hardware and your PC.. err computer (don't want to piss off the mac fanboys.. for now). How they are designed therefore affects the performance and reliability of your whole system. They have extensions, commonly called drivers (although thats a Windows based name and Macs use kexts or 'kernal extensions' which you'll rarely ever hear because you can't add parts to your Mac). every program has to be designed for a specific operating system in order to work on it.

To give you an example or how important this is, Mac's Operating System; OSX naturally consumes much more memory than Windows (all versions). This means you get a lot less bang for your buck, but you're blessed with 'beautiful' OSX environment. Windows also has much more applications and allows you to upgrade your computer without having to buy a entirely new machine (and screen if you own an iMac). On the other hand, the OSX environment is a lot simpler to use, if less configurable and suits many users that do not have lots of knowledge about computing, it also generally has much better cross program features as lots of the best programs are made by the same company.

Apple's restricted policy makes stuff alot more reliable in general, although I will comment that as I wrote this from my workplace's 24GB Mac Pro (I'm a producer and Apple Logic is mac-only now), my system froze for about 30secs and Logic crashed in the background, so maybe I spoke too soon.





26 September 2011, 2:50 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Halcon (User):

Dan, I know you as a journalist have to cover a lot of information, Apple is a very arrogant company.
This company could have been on par with IBM if none of the stupid idiosyncrasies on how to limit the hardware and software for a certain line of product made by Apple only.
It could have benefited everyone, not just a few, in the way computers are made today, you should know well, IBM PCs are easy to upgrade and maintain Apple does not have such commodity, for another part is very expensive.
Apple also is losing a good opportunity to snatch the disgruntled Windows Vista users and let them buy OS X for the IBM PC.
If the trend could be established, I could buy the Mac OS and install on my machine.

14 November 2008, 11:54 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

McBanjo (New user):

You can't be serious. You want Apple to sell you a cheap version of their market-leading software for your cheap custom hardware? They would then have to spend millions of dollars making it compatible and writing thousands drivers for it, making it as bloated, crash-prone and incompatible as Windows. Then on top of that they'd loose millions from the sales of their premium-priced hardware.

Apple is a business and if they followed your advice, we wouldn't have an OS X to save us from Windows hell for very long. Exclusivity is the main benefit of OS X and to change this would cause it to exist no longer.

Though I do agree with you that Apple should allow for more significant upgrades, this has never been part of an Apple business philosophy and it probably never will.

This was also the reason for the downfall of IBM. IBM used to be a great, powerful brand, but since they started running with the crowd and entered an almost perfectly competitive environment, everything became about cost-cutting instead of building a brand or value for the customer (something sorely missed in I.T.) Apple still stands strong after all these years with miles of attainable ground, while IBM has little chance of gaining any market-share over its countless other hardware competitors.

15 November 2008, 12:14 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

jake (New user):

Rubbish, i CAN get os-x to run on my windows pc,

15 November 2008, 12:53 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

iroarloud (New user):

One problem, the V word!!!!

15 November 2008, 3:06 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

k2 (New user):

I would have to agree with jake, even though i love everything about macs, the price of the sleek imac makes me cringe. the only reason i like mac is because of the operating system. to avoid this barrier, i successfully hacked my PC and made it run OS X leopard. And my OS X PC is 1.25 times stronger than my friends imac and cost $300 less than it:

HP pavillion:
680 GB of memory (added 220 GB)
2.3 GHz (this was a toughie, had to hire a techie to get things right)
4 GB RAM
Really cheap graphics card that works,
It runs exactly like the mac, with a few issues. Though the legality of this is questionable, I don't want to pay apple money for the finish.


06 October 2009, 3:48 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

bkostoro20 (New user):

now, all you have to do is buy all the security software, virus protection, email software, photoeditting, video editting, DVD creator, and many of the other things that you would get with a mac out of the box. If you add up all the crap money you put into a PC, including headaches and repair bills, you'd be more wise to spend it on a mac. Also, Macs and PCs are like cars, they both can get you where you need to go, but do you want to drive a hyundai or a Jag?

08 February 2010, 4:11 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Anonymousewiuu2945u389 (User):

Quoting bkostoro20:
now, all you have to do is buy all the security software


or download it for free
Quoting bkostoro20:
virus protection


that is security software
Quoting bkostoro20:
email software


or use webmail
Quoting bkostoro20:
photoeditting


again, for free
Quoting bkostoro20:
video editting


usually bundled with new computers, if not, can be downloaded for free
Quoting bkostoro20:
DVD creator


built into the OS
Quoting bkostoro20:
and many of the other things that you would get with a mac out of the box


including?
Quoting bkostoro20:
If you add up all the crap money you put into a PC, including headaches and repair bills, you'd be more wise to spend it on a mac


and get a new Mac ever 5 years rather than a new battery? Quoting bkostoro20:
Also, Macs and PCs are like cars, they both can get you where you need to go, but do you want to drive a hyundai or a Jag?


Which is which? And besides, there will always be people who prefer one type of car to the other anyway.

And K2's computer runs Mac OS X anyway, just on a more flexible (and cheaper) hardware platform.

08 February 2010, 7:12 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

k2 (New user):

Yea, um my computer running OS X kinda crashed :S and i had to get it fixed. when i got it back i just installed openSUSE linux, and my imac is in the mail

01 May 2010, 11:40 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

juznut (New user):

Quoting Anonymousewiuu2945u389:
Quoting bkostoro20:
now, all you have to do is buy all the security software


or download it for free

Do you mean the virus protection things that you download for free then asks for your CC when it detects a virus? WIN


Quoting bkostoro20:
email software


or use webmail

Quoting bkostoro20:
photoeditting


again, for free
Please have a look at iphoto, then watch as other programs try mimic its features

Quoting bkostoro20:
video editting


usually bundled with new computers, if not, can be downloaded for free

Same answer as above.. have a look at imovie..



Quoting bkostoro20:
and many of the other things that you would get with a mac out of the box


including?
Expose, spaces, web clipping on safari, time machine, iweb.. sync between mail, contacts and calendar..

Quoting bkostoro20:
If you add up all the crap money you put into a PC, including headaches and repair bills, you'd be more wise to spend it on a mac


and get a new Mac ever 5 years rather than a new battery?


Do you really believe that your pc laptop batteries will last you five years?


08 January 2011, 7:58 PM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Anonymousewiuu2945u389 (User):

Quoting juznut:
Do you mean the virus protection things that you download for free then asks for your CC when it detects a virus? WIN

Microsoft Security Essentials, Avast Free, AVG Free etc. (I'm obviously not talking about businesses here, but I doubt that k2's old hackintosh which forms the basis of all the replies would have been a business machine. Feel free to prove me wrong though there)

Quoting juznut:
web clipping on safari

What is it?

Quoting juznut:
Do you really believe that your pc laptop batteries will last you five years?

No, but they're easier to replace when they do die. (I was actually exaggerating a bit there, but my intended point - which probably wasn't very clear! - is that the Apple approach can also have financial consequences for many members of APC's target audience (generally tech-savvy people who would be able to avoid the costs of repair bills). I myself haven't needed a PC repair bill in the last five years.)


10 January 2011, 12:52 PM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

A Mac user (New user):

Quoting jake:
Rubbish, i CAN get os-x to run on my windows pc
Well, don't. It's illegal. The problem was whether or not you can run OS X on any and every computer.


09 February 2010, 5:36 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

NetR@nger (New user):

Quoting McBanjo:
You can't be serious. You want Apple to sell you a cheap version of their market-leading software for your cheap custom hardware?
Market leading??,You can't be serious.Anyway i will give you a list of my "cheap"hardware,and you tell me if its "worthy of your beloved OSX"
CPU - E8600 at 4.21Ghz (on water).Best cpu EVER made by ANYONE.
HDD - 3 SCSIs at 15000rpm (And matched with a $2799 scsi contoller card),NO other hard drive even comes close.
MEM - 16Gb Hyperlink pro,fastest ram on the planet(So hard to get that a lot of "so called"experts have never heard of it).
VID - 3 9800GTX+(tri sli) also on water,stock gap till the next gen comes out.
PSU - 2 1100W Coolermaster Ultimates.
MON - 4 32 inch lcds
OS - Vista 64bit ultimate

System Cost - About the same as a good second hand car
Would you call this a quality system??. I certinly do
So WHOs is the cheap system? I know.




15 November 2008, 10:22 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Obi-Wan Kenobi (New user):

There's no call to show off your fancy specs.

15 November 2008, 11:02 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

NetR@nger (New user):

Lol,when u paid this much for a system,u tell everbody about it whenever u can.

15 November 2008, 6:24 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

mcmurphy510 (New user):

Yeah... you might make a Mac user cry!

10 May 2009, 4:18 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

TheBakedBaker (New user):

The problem is (as stated in the article) that most users don't spend the same amount on their computer as they do on their "good second hand car." So, for you, yeah, you're stuck using a terrible operating system, which is likely less burdensome since you probably have a great deal of experience and knowledge, allowing you to work around all the BS the rest of us just have to deal with. You also still have to worry about viruses and all of that crap, while mac users don't. So, if you need a bleeding-edge, state-of-the-art machine, stick with Windows. If you have more "basic" (common) computing needs, save a few grand and get a computer you can actually use.

18 November 2008, 1:39 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

TheBakedBaker (New user):

The problem is (as stated in the article) that most users don't spend the same amount on their computer as they do on their "good second hand car." So, for you, yeah, you're stuck using a terrible operating system, which is likely less burdensome since you probably have a great deal of experience and knowledge, allowing you to work around all the BS the rest of us just have to deal with. You also still have to worry about viruses and all of that crap, while mac users don't. So, if you need a bleeding-edge, state-of-the-art machine, stick with Windows. If you have more "basic" (common) computing needs, save a few grand and get a computer you can actually use.

18 November 2008, 2:53 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

nerdo (New user):

Obviously cheap enough to come troll this site lol. So what do you do with all this soon to be out of date uberhardware anyway? Play Quake 4?

18 November 2008, 11:19 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

NetR@nger (New user):

Hi mate,no its mostly used for web design,photo editing and for my other passion,air traffic control simulations as im about to become a controller.Its one of the hardest things ive ever done,but very rewarding.

19 November 2008, 10:07 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Balus (New user):

Quoting NetR@nger:
Here is a site i built for brisbane centre) http://www.balus.info/Radar.php

No you didn't. That's my site!




07 December 2008, 11:35 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Balus (New user):

Quoting NetR@nger:
(Here is a site i built for brisbane centre) http://www.balus.info/Radar.php

No you didn't. That's my site!




07 December 2008, 11:42 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

NetR@nger (New user):

It seems ive stuffed up and pasted the wrong link,sorry bout that.I have nothing to do with the link that got posted.The one i was supposed to put up is a beta and has been 8 months in the making,and after taking advice from from my client (Brisbane Centre),can not be made public.Once again sorry for the screwup...

08 December 2008, 8:30 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Decimated (New user):

Well then you are pretty dumb. If you had a brain, clearly you would see that photo editing is far superior on a mac, compared to a windows pc. If mac is so crap, why do people use them professionally for photography, video editing and music? I work closely with people at Nikon and Canon, the majority of users use Mac's. Maybe you like jacking off to your pc specs, but others really don't care? Macs "just work", I used to be for Windows, but after using macs for quite a while now, they are alot better than Windows for reliability, speed and its interface. I can't see how you can say dual quadcore processers is slow to be honest. Hell, you could even had 32gb of ram if you REALLY wanted it.

To add to your ATC sim, I worked for NATS in the UK and you don't need a ridiculously expensive pc for them at all. Its not exactly like you are gonna have much traffic to control in Australia anyway, play with the big boys at Heathrow and London TMA + Area my friend, thats where the REAL controllers are.

18 December 2008, 9:12 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (New user):

Quoting Decimated:
Well then you are pretty dumb. If you had a brain, clearly you would

Well there is a pointless way to begin presentation of your argument. A mindless insult and a suggestion of anatomical impossibility. Your not off to a good start, are you?


Quoting Decimated:
If mac is so crap, why do people use them

People drive french cars, people wear platform sandals, people drink warm creaming soda, people watch an entire series of "Big Brother". Popular personal choice is never and will never be a reliable indication of quality.


Quoting Decimated:
I work closely with people at Nikon and Canon

So do janitors, the proprietors of the local tuck shop, couriers drivers and even that little man who comes to change the indoor plants.


Quoting Decimated:
Maybe you like jacking off to your pc specs

So you though you'd aid your flagging argument with another insult did you? It didn't work, your argument is still looking feeble.


Quoting Decimated:
I worked for NATS in the UK

Ah that explains it, a Pom, the misguides personal belief of some superiority, based on industries of nearly two centuries ago.
A nation that cannot build a car that doesn't look like something out of a Noddy book.
A nation that cannot field a cricket team that isn't a joke from a population of how many million?
A nation whose only remaining industry is investment banking? Oops that is gonna hurt.


Quoting Decimated:
play with the big boys at Heathrow and London

you really are a sad little Herbert, but thanks for your contribution, we know now the Mac is the clear favorite for braggarts, train-spotters and Walter-Mitty-esque dreamers across the globe.


20 December 2008, 10:52 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

2monkeyballs (New user):

You people. I'm a mac user and I love my mac, I have nothing against PCs and I like them for gaming and such but you guys are insulting eachother over a computer brand. that's a little lame.

23 March 2010, 5:01 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

AIheg (User):

A 'pom' company designed every processor in nearly every smartphone to date. (ARM Holdings in Cambridge) Hows that for two century old industry?

A 'pom' designed every Apple product ever built since the Bondi Blue iMac. (Jonathan Ive) Hows that for building stuff that look like Noddy, fanboy?

A 'pom' has the fastest (year on year) growing supercar manufacturer in the world (Aston Martin , 36.3% rev. growth)

A 'pom' won the Ashes a couple years ago, but more importantly trains Pakistan and a host of other countries.

And a 'pom' just destroyed your little ass. Not saying I support you, but drop the word pom and someones just gotta come out and set you straight.

05 July 2012, 12:43 PM (10 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Russell Hicks (New user):

Isn't the minimum spec's needed to run Vista?? LOL

20 November 2008, 1:06 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

NetR@nger (New user):

Russell Hicks (New user):
Isn't the minimum spec's needed to run Vista?? LOL you twat

If your talking to me russell,Plain undisputed fact of life:Its a windows world-deal with it

20 November 2008, 4:19 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

DeadLetter (New user):

CPU could be better, why do you need 16GB of ram you'll never use it unless you are a serious power user, tri sli has been proven to have very poor scaling, OS is Vista.

And to your comment about "cheap" hardware, well the majority of the market want cheap PC's, the small manority which you belong to that know how to make a PC etc don't really matter.

17 October 2009, 10:47 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

AIheg (User):

Quoting DeadLetter:
the small manority which you belong to that know how to make a PC etc don't really matter.


Oh so I guess we can call up every company on the Forbes 500 and tell them they need to axe their IT departments because they don't really matter, then tell Apple to axe their engineers because they don't really matter... while we're at it may as well do the same for Dell HP and all the other idiots that offer pre built PCs... because anyone who knows how to make a PC doesn't matter to the guy that can't spell minority.

And he obviously is a power user you fool, stop reading forum posts and learn what you're talking about... even now his computer will smoke a maxed out iMac and he posted that spec years ago.


06 March 2013, 9:16 PM (2 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Jimbo2K8 (New user):

So what you are saying is "if you can't afford it, you don't deserve it". Yes, very inclusive. Just the image a company wants to shoot for.

In case you hadn't noticed, you still can't touch an Apple MacBook for under $1200. I can get 2 HP's for that much, and that includes 1 yr of support. And it's much more upgradeable.

It's annoying comments like these that make me dislike Apple. Before you bash Windows, get a clue. It has introduced many more users to computers than Mac has. It's the prevalent OS in home AND business, and the choice in places where brains are required by almost 8 to 1.

20 November 2008, 8:12 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

swjr98 (New user):

Quoting Jimbo2K8:
you still can't touch an Apple MacBook for under $1200. I can get 2 HP's for that much, and that includes 1 yr of support. And it's much more upgradeable.

yeah and they will break down in a year face it your a pc fanboy and macs are way more superior than pcs sorry




06 March 2013, 5:53 AM (2 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Izzy (New user):

I agree with just about everything you have to say. But I diverge on one issue, I don't think IBM makes PC's anymore, they sold their laptop division to Lenovo and I think (not sure) that Lenovo also is making their desktops now.

15 November 2008, 12:39 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Hemma (New user):

IBM is more oriented at providing services for major corporations such as banks for their bread and butter. I think Lenovo only has rights to the Thinkpad marque for a certain number of years.

15 November 2008, 1:05 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

McBanjo (New user):

Very good points and ones I would definitely use to best describe the goodness of the Mac. What's most annoying about Mac is that we still have to interact with Windows some day in one way or another. Whether it be trying to change everyone's old PC habits (like shutting down or putting everything on the desktop) or trying to solve problems through tech-support, which simply wouldn't exist in a Mac environment.

I'm constantly (seriously, constantly) telling myself, "If only this were a Mac, I'd be able to do this so much better/easier/faster......." or "If this were my Mac, I wouldn't have to do this." Like: "I wouldn't have to find, purchase and install this lame 3rd-party dictionary/PDF reader/Video Player/DVD player software," or, "I wouldn't have to be downloading this Windows Defender update twice a week." or "I wouldn't have to wait for 10 seconds while Windows Explorer decides it wants to hang." or "I wouldn't have to waste all these hours getting rid of this virus, or installing this driver."

It all adds up, and I think most Mac users find that they actually use their Mac (rather than fix it) more than they've ever used a PC before.

14 November 2008, 11:55 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

jake (New user):

Quoting McBanjo:
If only this were a Mac, I'd be able to do this so much better/easier/faster


im sorry i dissagree, i have trouble auto arraging icons on a mac where as on windows you simply right click then go view then select auto arrange, keep in mind these macs were osx 10.4

my VISTA laptop has no antivirus and yet has never ever had a virus.

i agree with explorer hannging, when was the last time i updated windows defender, oh wait it updates itself through windows update

15 November 2008, 12:50 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

lantzn (New user):

Auto Arrange on Mac 10.4
2 ways
1. From Finder choose View/Arrange By and pick your poison.
2. From Finder choose View/Show View Options, Desktop Window opens, go to the bottom and check the box that says Keep Arranged By and used the pop down menu to pick your poison.

I like the second option because it's automated and gives you a lot more options. I also like the Label Position to the right for a more organized icon/list sort of view.

15 November 2008, 7:30 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

hutriest (New user):

hahaha... very funny if you said that auto arrange is your problem in a mac. Too many option you can do @ mac desktop, include resize the icons, arrange all icon position.

About vista, sorry i'm not agree that vista is stable OS. I'm back to XP after get to much annoying error and hang-and-hang in many application include when running ms Office, fanny huh, compatible issue with their own product ^^

15 November 2008, 11:47 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

jake (New user):

i didnt say vista was stable. i just said mine doesnt catch viruses, the STABLE vista is the 64bit version.

im sick of vista it decides it wants to hang, crash or fail when ever it wants, i cant have a day where i have vista not failing at least once, no one say its my hardware either my computer has a hell of enough power to run vista

15 November 2008, 11:56 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Hemma (New user):

Fair enough. However, i think that you can't exactly say its annoying to have to interact with windows. Its just a fact that most corporate environments runs on a Microsoft environment. Its up to Apple to make the interactions easier for guys. Microsoft to a certain extent (although market driven more than anything) tried to make communications between macs and pcs easier by providing microsoft products like office for mac. Things could be worse off i think...

In relations to drivers, its something that's more to do with the Mac being quite strict about its hardware specifications. In the PC realm, people like to build their own, so think about the number of combinations that Microsoft has to deal with in terms of drivers. Only if Microsoft started to design and build their own pcs to their specifications, i'm sure that they would run just as smooth. I understand this because i triple boot Vista, Ubuntu and OSX86 on my laptop. The one with the least issues is Vista, followed by Ubuntu, then OSX86. It's because my copy of Vista was preinstalled, so the configurations are just right (fingers crossed). OSX86, as everyone knows has issues with every non-apple laptops... it might be sleep, might be wifi, and might even be touchpad.... but its because of the drivers available. Apple is smart in controlling the hardware. Unfortunately for microsoft, they are just a bit too big to control it. Its good though, to read about how they are trying to come to terms with their issues...

Viruses... i'm not trying to insult you (because people just report abuse), but most major corporations like banks, schools, government agencies run on a windows based environment. There's a larger interest in creating a virus for this platform. Whereas, for the 8? 10% of predominately graphics designers or web designers... there needs to be a real incentive.
Other than that, i think OSX is a more user oriented product, where they will try to cover everything, however, with Windows, its still (meaning Vista) in the era of 'Just an operating system'. Therefore, i'm quite excited about the release of 7, as it would be a make-or-break for microsoft in the OS environment. There's a benchmark set by Apple here.... and microsoft knows for a fact that they just need to meet it.

15 November 2008, 1:01 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (New user):

Quoting McBanjo:
the goodness of the Mac

Take your hand off it.


Quoting McBanjo:
What's most annoying about Mac is that we still have to interact with Windows some day

Uh-oh goodness breakdown!, If it was all goodness why would you ever have to interact with Windows? Ever?


Quoting McBanjo:
Whether it be trying to change every one's old PC habits

Last time a religious fanatic tried to change my habits I set the dog on him, sort out your own habits, and stay the hell out of everyone else's.


Quoting McBanjo:
while Windows Explorer decides it wants to hang

Ah yes Safari hanging is a so much better experience, I think its all that goodness.


Spare us the evangelism, enjoy your MAC it may suit your needs, It isn't adequate for mine, to each their own, and if you still see fit to wish to change other peoples habits, then the dog is keen for a run.

15 November 2008, 12:20 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

thegnu (New user):

Quoting McBanjo:
What's most annoying about Mac is that we still have to interact with Windows some day in one way or another.
--
yeah, the real bummer is that neither apple nor microsoft are actually interested in interoperability. they just want THEIR product to be the most compatible with the other product, and they both achieve their goal by making it hard for the users of the other product.

i am actually relatively unhappy with my mac, but i bought it because i needed a laptop, and at the time, i wasn't sure about linux power management. i do prefer mac over windows. i just dislike the fanboyism and revisitionist history that often comes from the mac camp. i do, i suppose, just cackle madly at the windows fanboys. :)


15 September 2009, 10:25 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Anonymousewiuu2945u389 (User):

Quoting McBanjo:
Whether it be trying to change everyone's old PC habits (like shutting down


Saving energy is a bad habit? Please describe a good habit. Quoting McBanjo:
"I wouldn't have to wait for 10 seconds while Windows Explorer decides it wants to hang."


On a PC, I wouldn't have to wait for 10 seconds while maximising windows, then arranging all the toolbars on Microsoft Word so that there isn't any desktop left. I really can't stand seeing glimpses of my wallpaper when working on an essay.
Quoting McBanjo:
lame 3rd-party dictionary/PDF reader/Video Player/DVD player software,"


Then don't install the lame 3rd-party Dictionary, Video Player and DVD Player software. Use the built-in stuff (if you really dislike 3rd party stuff that much) and dictionary.com Although you will need the PDF viewer

11 March 2010, 9:27 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

swjr98 (New user):

thank you finally someone here with some sense in them what i have found is that people cant afford macs so they bash them because they cant have them. just my view of it

06 March 2013, 5:59 AM (2 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Paulsmith (New user):

Macs look great I have IMac desktop, Mac latop pro, Iphone & Ipad - After a few months soled all as I'm a video editor and on the IMac converting all my home .avi's to DVD with paid software even converting an half-an-video make 4gb DVD and then takes around 15mins to burn a dvd. windows only 2gb DVD and burns a 4gb dvd in less than 8mins.

Mac to me is like a roll royce with a mini engine.. Mac is to limited software and even if you get software still dose not perform like windows sorry..

06 March 2013, 6:58 AM (2 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

itd (New user):

"15 reasons Macs are still better than Windows"

I think you missed the most obvious reason of all...
A "Mac" is a hardware/software combination that forms a working entity; "Windows" is an operating system. Give me a full computer system over an operating system disc any day :)


15 November 2008, 12:26 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply
15 November 2008, 1:01 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

mcmurphy510 (New user):

Quoting itd:
A "Mac" is a hardware/software combination that forms a working entity; "Windows" is an operating system


Yep... very true... can't argue with that... Mac is a rigid, un-flexible combo of hardware and software that limits your choices... Whereas Windows is just an OS that allows you much more room in terms what you can put in your computer.

Quoting itd:
Give me a full computer system over an operating system disc any day :)


But, yeah... a full computer is better than just a software disk... that's why I generally put my Windows on my computer, rather than just leave it on the coffee table...

10 May 2009, 4:40 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

MiCCAS (New user):

I'm sorry but this is the stupidest post I have ever seen from APCMag. Firstly, I'm not a Windows fanboi or a Mac fanboi - it's whatever suits the person that I care about.

However:

#3 - Windows has nothing to do with the software it runs off, they can't help if it's not "quality parts". If people want to get quality parts, they get quality parts. If they don't, they don't. Apple mac however forces you to use what they want you to use.

#4 - This ONCE AGAIN depends on the manufacturer. Less blinking lights.. has nothing to do with Windows.

#5 - An opinion, not evidence.

#6 - Windows comes with similar tools...

#7 - Windows has this too, more software than Macs do

#8 - Of course, jam pack it with crap people may not want to use...

#9 - I don't see any difference to what Windows has.

#10 - This is stupid.. What you see there is not Windows products, or Microsoft products - they are THIRD PARTY products!

#11 - When I have used the Mac dock I have found it very hard to differentiate what is what in terms of what's open and what is links.

#12 - Yet, when a virus or security hole is found for Macs they take forever to patch it - Windows does it in very short time - and, just because a Mac isn't popular enough now and therefore doesn't have as many outbreaks as Windows users, what about if it did - if the company won't even patch holes then how do you suppose it to cope?

#13 - *cough* Safari for Windows *cough*

#14 - Oh, and guess what.. Windows runs Photoshop too :O

#15 - I won't comment on this one because I simply haven't used it in a Mac and it would be unfair to comment on my opinion.

Just wanting to reiterate what I said before, if Mac suits you then Mac is the way to go for YOU.. I am sick of people thinking Windows is good for them so it's good for them.. The same with Mac, Linux, etc.

15 November 2008, 12:32 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Woodgrain (New user):

Agree 100%

You are absolutely right.

It's not about which is the better operating system, but which one works best for you. It's like buying an F1 sports car and trying to compare it to a Toyota Corolla & complaining that the F1 is harder to use and you need technical knowledge to use it.

This article frustrates me because there are a lot of readers that trust APC, as it is a good magazine, and will assume that this article is based more on fact than opinion.

The other point I'd like to add, as a System Administrator, is that Mac's are not designed for a corporate environment. They are great for little home workgroups, but nothing more.

I think it a very dangerous position for APC (or anyone for that matter) to suggest that users on Mac's don't need antivirus or antispyware. Please, let me encourage Mac users to get these for their computers, in many cases you do not know you have a virus/trojan until you install antivirus software to point it out to you.

If you find it difficult to use or to deal with Windows (or Linux), let me encourage you to try a Mac, my friends that struggled with Windows find it much easier. But please, don't try and convince all of your friends that use and like Windows/Linux that Mac is better, it's just different.

26 November 2008, 12:05 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

matthewlowery (New user):

Quoting MiCCAS:
Of course, jam pack it with crap people may not want to use...

They're the best design apps in the business. If you didn't want them, why would you have bought a mac? Mac's are for design lol! Quoting MiCCAS:
*cough* Safari for Windows *cough*
sucks.




Quoting MiCCAS:
This is stupid.. What you see there is not Windows products, or Microsoft products - they are THIRD PARTY products!


Still, all WINDOWS computers come with them. Not windows OS, but windows computers. Quoting MiCCAS:
When I have used the Mac dock I have found it very hard to differentiate what is what in terms of what's open and what is links.

One word - glasses.


11 July 2009, 7:58 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

thegnu (New user):

Quoting matthewlowery:
Quoting MiCCAS:
*cough* Safari for Windows *cough*
sucks.

*cough* Google Chrome *cough*?

also, i failed to point out that there have been some really horrible hardware decisions and terrible hardware components included in apple computers in the past. the difference is with a PC, you can choose to buy something else.



15 September 2009, 10:30 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

jake (New user):

the booting of my vista is 25 secconds and thats a cold boot, no3 the screens arent microsoft or windows problems its the hardware manufacturers,

15 November 2008, 12:32 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

itd (New user):

Seriously though, my previous post was just drawing attention the confused nature of the article.


After stating at the beginning of the article
“partly because Macs are now PCs -- so the argument is now really Mac OS X vs Windows vs Linux”
You then go on to mention;

“3. Apple uses good quality parts.” – you will get arguments for and against this but seriously what does this have to do with “so the argument is now really Mac OS X vs Windows vs Linux”

“4. Less blinking lights. ….. Apple doesn't festoon its hardware with blinking lights and inconveniently placed wireless on/off buttons, headphone jacks, etc. ….. This lack of basic design refinement can make PC notebooks annoying to use for the entire lifespan of the unit” Once again this is debatable eg; non user replaceable parts like batteries meaning the whole machine becomes a brick because of one small failure, lack of ports or those that are custom/obscure or lack wide support meaning you lose or break something and you either do without or if you can find it, it costs more than a generic part.

“5. OS X + Windows is better than just Windows” – ummm yeah but once again “the argument is now really Mac OS X vs Windows vs Linux” but suddenly a new contender emerges which is the first two at once.

Can you see where I am going with this, I disagree with “the argument is now really Mac OS X vs Windows vs Linux” because I think what you are actually comparing is a turnkey solution – the Apple MAC with its Apple OS – and a piece of a bigger modular system – the Microsoft Windows OS and hardware provided by a variety of vendors.

What I think is the most amazing thing about all of this is that Apple Macs don’t perform better and PCs are not significantly worse. Apple designs the entire product; hardware, operating system, and even a large amount of the software and yet they produce a product that is largely comparable to a PC running Microsoft Windows; an operating system that manages to run on infinitely diverse combinations and permutations of hardware, with equally diverse software.

Given that Apple controls virtually the entire product design process, both hardware and software, I have long wondered why they don’t manage to produce an infinitely superior product. As it stands, based on sales figures, more people prefer the mix and match of PC/Windows than the total integrated design of Apple Macs and you will get large numbers of people arguing that one is better than the other. The Apple Mac SHOULD be the no-contest winner and yet it is not, what is wrong?

15 November 2008, 1:13 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Dan Warne (Regular user):

Quoting itd:

After stating at the beginning of the article
“partly because Macs are now PCs -- so the argument is now really Mac OS X vs Windows vs Linux”
You then go on to mention;


Fair point :-) What I meant was that the argument in general is more about the operating systems these days, though my article looks at Macs (as a whole) vs Windows PCs.

15 November 2008, 9:08 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

itd (New user):

Thanks for the reply Dan, I respect that.

I understood the overall intention of the article, and I think in general the article provided some interesting and thought provoking material. It certainly has people responding with some equally interesting points.

I think the heading; “15 reasons Macs are still better than Windows” highlights the concerns I have with what you attempted to do. Comparing “Mac Operating System version XYZ” with “Microsoft Windows Operating System XYZ” is a fair comparison and that is part of what the article did. But comparing Apple on one side with everybody else combined on the other side introduces problems, and you did this on many fronts including hardware, design, and customer service/warranty.

It would be unusual to see a motoring magazine do a comparison of say, BMW alone versus all other brands of cars combined. This sort of comparison is what leads to the words “fanboy’ and “religion” being bandied about.

Point number 3; “Apple uses good quality parts” and then some assertions that all other brands combined use a “huge grab bag ranging from horrendous, dim rubbish to spectacular” could be equally applied to cars. Of course the “others” group is variable in quality it represents ALL OTHER PRODUCTS COMBINED !!! – this is hardly an argument that proves Macs are better. You could just as easily put Apple Macs in the “others” group and then argue against them with the exact same reasoning.

If I gave you the choice between BMW, a known product, versus some random vehicle from the group titled “others” of course you would rather buy the BMW “product sight-unseen and know you'll be happy with the quality” compared with the huge variety of others you might potentially receive.
(If you hate BMWs insert your brand of choice – I have never owned one, I just chose a name to illustrate the point)

The whole comparison of a “known” with a huge group of what is effectively “unknown” weakens any arguments made. For example you say;
“I have to admit I personally don't think the basic MacBook screen is of a quality that I would want to buy, but then, I think it's still better than a lot of PC notebook screens.”
That same sentence could be re-written as;
“I have to admit I personally don't think the basic MacBook screen is of a quality that I would want to buy, I think it's WORSE than a lot of PC notebook screens.”
The comparison of a specific or known with a non-specific or unknown means the argument can be stated either way and is therefore not really useful or valid.

In short, I think comparing “OS-ABC” with “OS-XYZ” is fair and valid but comparing “Product-ABC” with “Product-everything-else” or what is effectively “infinity” leads to something that is not really a comparison.


15 November 2008, 2:11 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

NetR@nger (New user):

Can i ask you one question ?.IF macs are so good,WHY is it that 92% of the world uses windows???.The stats make your argument,rather silly eh

15 November 2008, 9:29 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Dan Warne (Regular user):

Ah, that's one of the circular arguments I mention at the top of the article. Windows' success isn't due to it being good, it's due to Microsoft being a good marketer, and being very good at involving companies in its ecosystem.

15 November 2008, 10:20 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

NetR@nger (New user):

Ok,Ive thought alot about that and ill have to give you that one.

15 November 2008, 6:15 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Rod Rye (New user):

The growth rate of a single bacterial colony is greater than the human race, but that bacteria isn't going to be the dominant species on the planet any time soon.

What's sad is that the incredibly successful iPhone is still being outsold in most quarters (including the Christmas quarter) by phones running several year old Windows Mobile software.

20 September 2009, 1:49 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

UbiquitousGeek (New user):

I think it's more telling that the Mac's growth-rate is three times that of the PC industry. Apple is continually gaining market share and eating away at Microsoft's. Record profits and record numbers of Macs sold pretty much every quarter indicate an explosive growth in the Mac's popularity.

20 November 2008, 2:52 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Jimbo2K8 (New user):

When you are at the bottom, up is the only way to go...

20 November 2008, 8:12 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (New user):

Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
I think it's more telling that the Mac's growth-rate is three times that of the PC industry.

If you want to play the growth rate care then you have to consider the total market penetration of non windows OSs, and at that point your argument looks a little sad, a three times growth rate for the next five years would still result in a distant 2nd place.


20 November 2008, 8:22 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

UbiquitousGeek (New user):

Actually, I believe analysts predicted that should the current trend continue, they could hold 50% of the U.S. home market.

They're notebook penetration is even more exciting. If they were as doom and gloom as you'd like to have us believe, they wouldn't have more cash on hand than Microsoft, which they do. They also have zero debt. And to top it all off, look at their stock performance, especially before the economy took a nose dive. Even through all of this financial chaos, they're selling record numbers of Macs.

Now your argument looks a little sad.

20 November 2008, 2:05 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (New user):

Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
Actually, I believe analysts predicted that should the current trend continue, they could hold 50% of the U.S. home market.

Ah analysts, what like the analysts that just happened to miss a worldwide recession completely.


Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
They're(sic) notebook penetration is even more exciting.

Does it have party hats?


Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
If they were as doom and gloom as you'd like to have us believe,

Your the one playing the doom & gloom card, I said nothing of the sort. Personally I can see no better situation than for Apple and Linux to gain market share. The fact remains when your proportions are relatively small it's much easier to achieve meteoric gains.


Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
And to top it all off, look at their stock performance, especially before the economy took a nose dive.

Yeah especially before the market took a dive. How many of those analysts warned shareholders to get out quick?



Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
Even through all of this financial chaos, they're selling record numbers of Macs.

And even with apple breaking its own records, and with MS releasing a somewhat stillborn version of Windows, PC sales still dwarf those from Apple.


Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
Now your argument looks a little sad.

No the only thing sad is a lack of open mindedness and an inability of some to accept simple realities.


20 November 2008, 2:21 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

UbiquitousGeek (New user):

Back to the original argument here... Windows' market share has nothing to do with being a "superior" operating system. The lack of open-mindedness comes from the sheep who buy PCs because they don't know what their options are. They don't know why or how a Mac could benefit them. These people make up most of Windows' market share. If I take these people and show them exactly what the benefits are, nine times out of ten, they would choose the Mac, if money weren't a factor. These days, everyone wants something for next to nothing, and that's what a lot of the PC market is made up of. People want $300 throw-away computers. Well, they don't want throw-away computers, but they believe that for $300, they might get lucky and end up with a "good" computer. Well, Apple doesn't do that kind of hardware. If they did, they'd have the same reputation as Dell or Compaq. Also, there's a very thin profit margin in budget PCs. Apple is thriving well in it's current state. As long as that continues, I really don't care if the sheep continue to buy PCs. Apple, regardless, will continue to be highly profitable and continue to make computers that I want to use. They're not going away any time in the foreseeable future.

26 November 2008, 5:17 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

mcmurphy510 (New user):

Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
The lack of open-mindedness comes from the sheep who buy PCs because they don't know what their options are. They don't know why or how a Mac could benefit them. These people make up most of Windows' market share.


Please! Apples' minuscule market share has little to do with non-open-mindedness. For the majority of folks, buying a computer is not a small matter. It's discussions like this one that seep into popular culture and mainstream awareness that make it so. Most people who buy a new computer either already know computers or consult one or more people who do (weather it be their kid, the IT guy at work, or their programmer brother in law). They're aren't uninformed sheep who blindly go and buy PC's. They make a decision based on facts provided by people in the know, whom they trust!

Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
If I take these people and show them exactly what the benefits are, nine times out of ten, they would choose the Mac, if money weren't a factor.


It sounds like you do this a lot. Your very statement implies that when you do have an opportunity to consult someone on a new computer purchase, you either fail to mention PC's or just trash talk them like you're doing right now, rather that letting them see the benefits and drawbacks of both and letting them decide. With your highly negative attitude about PC's it seems like those you consult are the ones who 'don't know what their options are.' Of course they are gonna go with Mac in that case, with you leading them astray - uh... I mean in that direction.



10 May 2009, 6:08 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

UbiquitousGeek (New user):

Tell that to Commodore, Tandy and Atari.

20 November 2008, 1:59 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

neodiaobolus (New user):

But then again, 3 times 0 is still 0. And 3 times 1 is only 3. But .5 times 1,000 is 500.

01 January 2010, 6:27 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Russell Hicks (New user):

Just beacause a product is popular doesn't make it better...big mac anyone?

20 November 2008, 1:12 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

nribecca (New user):

WHY is it that 92% of the world uses windows???.

Same reason so many people like Rap Music!
Like Tommy Lee Jones said to Will Smith in Man in black after Will asked "Why the big secret? People are smart. They can handle it".... "A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals and you know it. Fifteen hundred years ago everybody knew the Earth was the center of the universe. Five hundred years ago, everybody knew the Earth was flat, and fifteen minutes ago, you knew that humans were alone on this planet. Imagine what you'll know tomorrow."

So, just because more people like something, that doesnt make it the SMARTER or BETTER choice. It all comes down to preferences. I like FAST, I like Less crashes, I like no Viruses, so far, I like MAC, and I have been using Personal Computers since 1986!!! TI994A And this is the first time I have purchased or even USED a Mac, because I tolorated the garbage of windows/MS all of the MS BS, believing th's what EVERYBODY uses!!! Everybody's dumb, then ;)

27 October 2009, 1:27 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Anonymousewiuu2945u389 (User):

Quoting nribecca:
I like FAST, I like Less crashes, I like no Viruses


Well, it really is fast maximising windows on a Mac.

I like upgradeable, longevity and being able to use all my software with minimal hacking and definitely no purchasing extra software. Mac gives me none of these

30 March 2010, 9:05 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Nk (New user):

Seriously its too early in the morning for this cr@p! MiCCAS has pretty much stated what I am thinking. Maybe you can do a follow up with why PC's (Not just Windows) are better than Mac's - I can think of a dozen off the top of my head hopefully you can too!


15 November 2008, 10:17 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Dan Warne (Regular user):

One of my best journos is on it! :)

15 November 2008, 10:20 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

todd_h86 (New user):

Dan.... are you wanting your servers to come crashing down in rain of hellfire and brimstone? Come one I bet if you think about it you will notice what you have said is just complete and utter flame piece!

Are APC journos gettings paid on a commission of how many reply's get posted to their article?!

15 November 2008, 10:46 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Rosefisted (New user):

What about superior Mac ergonomics?
The Mac mouse is nothing more that style over function. I find them uncomfortable to use for extended period, the scroll wheel (ball?) is painful to use, and what's with the "squeeze" function? You have to caress the mouse, because if you grab it, it "alt-tabs" your open apps....

Then there's the ability to right click and "open with" from one app to another. Unless you have set up your file association in Mac, good luck.

Isn't the Dock a great idea.. especially when using Entourage for emails... That little bouncing icon is soooooo NOOOOOOT annoying.

Which reminds me... When, exactly, are Apple going to introduce an email program that allows hyperlinks and embedded images? And it's not Entourage's fault... after all, that's a Microsoft application. I enjoy sending my emails to Mac users and letting them navigate through the 20 embedded images that have suddenly become attachments.

Apple seem to use the same arrogant marketing ploy Rolls Royce did years ago...
Rolls Royces don't break down, they simply fail to proceed...

Apple Macs don't need lock-up, they simply need time to reflect...

15 November 2008, 11:24 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

UbiquitousGeek (New user):

The simple fact that you used the "right click" argument, which hasn't been true for years, completely discredits your intelligence and voids and nullifies your entire argument.

20 November 2008, 2:57 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

gravyboy (New user):

1: OK, you can buy a Logitech bluetooth mouse and it will work perfectly.

2: Yeah, but on a mac you can right click, Open With. It shows you a list of the most recent applications you have used to open the file, it's own suggestions of programs that are capable of opening the file, and an option to choose another application all inside the menu. No annoying dialog pops up.

3: You can turn off the bouncing just like you can turn off blinking in Windows. Mail shows a neat red icon with the number of new messages.

4: Mail can show hyperlinks, html formatted email, and embedded images.

5: My Mac locks up when I am running Office 2007 in Crossover. :(

05 January 2009, 1:40 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

AnthonyBrisbane (New user):

#3 - If you can't afford to or buying it for a 5-year old, PCs let you buy less expensive parts. Macs don't let you. They only let you buy good quality parts.

#6 - Windows has exactly the same.

#7 - Windows has a lot more good quality freeware than the Mac.

#8 - The reason MS is removing some apps from Windows 7 is because people don't want their system filled with the MS/Apple crap and want to use a third-party tool.

#9 - The tools in Windows are incredibly easy to find.

#10 - Nothing to do with Microsoft. That's the manufacturer. Not all brand name PCs come with that, and no custom built systems do. Tell them you don't want it, and they won't give it to you.

#12 - Only because Windows is much more popular so no one bothers to write viruses for the Mac. And if you know what you're doing it's not essential to have, just helpful.

15 November 2008, 11:47 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

UbiquitousGeek (New user):

3. If you want inferior hardware, buy a used Mac. A lot of people do, which is why Macs have the highest resale value of any computer.

6. Not really. Activity Monitor is much more robust than the Task Manager. I don't recall ever seeing anything like the Console in Windows. The Disk Utility does things that Windows still doesn't do, including burning disk images. I don't remember seeing any RAID configuration tools in Windows either, but I could be wrong on that one.

7. Nope. First of all, most of the freeware available on Windows is also available for the Mac and it's usually better on the Mac. VLC is a great example of this. Our freeware is plenty and it's much more polished and useful. I use a lot of freeware, such as Adium, X-Chat (which isn't free for Windows users), Cyberduck (awesome FTP client, not available on Windows), iSquint (awesome video conversion, not available on Windows), HandBrake, various emulators and software to use the Wii Remote as a controller for those emulators, which I don't think is yet available for Windows...

8. No, I'm pretty sure it has to do with bloat, as well as fit and finish.

9. No, they're really not. Especially in Vista. Option are so scattered, it's ridiculous.

10. The writer was also comparing Mac hardware to all PC hardware, in general.

12. Completely untrue. The Mac is a high profile target. I've personally monitored the activities of groups *trying* to write malware for Mac OS X. It's not easy. If you don't use anti-virus, how do you know that you don't have a virus? It's easy to tell in Mac OS X because Unix doesn't allow things to be hidden from a competent user. If there were a problem, it would be easy to spot. This is not the case with Windows.

20 November 2008, 3:15 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Anonymousewiuu2945u389 (User):

Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
No, they're really not. Especially in Vista. Option are so scattered, it's ridiculous.


Just GodMode it

30 March 2010, 9:19 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (New user):

I'd like to start with your title Dan, and simply state that Macs are not better than Windows, which is simply a nonsense. Now before the Gamer fan boys claim a victory thinking they have won over Raindog, and before all those evangelistic Macophiles jump forward to defend the honour of their curvy designer plastic cases, I'll also clearly state that Windows is not better than Mac.

The whole "better than" thing is a nonsense and akin to, what is the ideal length of string, what is the ideal motor vehicle, what is the best colour, when is the preferred time of day, what is an ideal height. Well you get the idea.

For any "better than" to ever be meaningful it requires an application, and it may come as total surprise to fan boys of all persuasions that those applications will differ, yes lads some people even use their computers to write, design, create, and seldom ever feel the need to shoot pixelated bad guys in 7.1 surround via a plethora of small plastic speakers.

As for Dan's set of reasons

1. Reliable sleep mode. I could not agree more, Windows has never got this right especially in any form of networked environment.

2. Fast Boot times. Again I could only concur, but it is heartening to see from the drip feed media releases that MS is finally addressing this in Win7, how well they do that is yet to be seen, but at least it is admission the problem exist and any improvement is a good thing.

3. Apple Uses Good Quality Parts Well while I'd agree as a very sweeping generalisation, you have to consider this a little further. Aston Martin uses the best parts too, but you don't see too many Businesses offering them as company cars. One of the strengths of the PC is they can be had in a variety of quality levels as can the associated peripherals. There are plenty of PCs to be had that are built to an equal quality of the Apple MAC and there are also plenty of accessible PCs to be had for bargain prices. I'm no fan of buy now throwaway later products whatsoever, but just observing the number of sub $20K hatchbacks on the road, or observing the number of brightly coloured cheap thrill cartons emerging from the neighbourhood Harvey Norman on any given Saturday morning, I'd say the market for throwaway is substantial.

4. Less Blinking lights. Again I'd agree , and also note PCs can still be had without, Solar Flare or bamboo coloured shells, retina burning blue LEDs, spider web theme fan guards. Vacuum Fluorescent display panels showing the speed of all 14 accessory fans plus or minus 300 RPM, or even glow in the dark drive cables.
And while apple may not be as guilty on the blinding LED front, they are just as guilty on the dubious fashion front, those clear covered CRT innards displaying 12 months of accumulated office dust and the carbon tracking were real attractive, and even to this day we have apple to thank for all those iMac inspired iridescent blue ended USB leads.
And thankfully most of the extra PC LEDs occur in peripherals of particular brands, and as usual there is a very wide range of PC peripherals available, both with and without the gaudy lights. I am told the species know as Gamer actually finds all the flashy flash to be an enhancement. To each their own.

5.OS X + Windows is better than windows Well no it's not! And windows will never run as well in such an environment as what it can naively. You might have a good run with office applications, but try running anything that is hardware or network intensive and see how you get on.

6. Easier to troubleshoot Macs Um no! Troubleshooting via on-board apps will only work under certain circumstances. Hardware wise a modern Dell or HP can be serviced without tools with everything accessible, No Torx screws that Nana just never felt the need to kit herself out with. Apple has a strong "your too stupid to touch our hardware policy". As for software troubleshooting Windows is not difficult, but is victim of its own success with a myriad of poorly written games, drivers and apps likely to have the registry in knots.

7. A culture of good quality community software. This is not a win point for MAC, there is just as much, if not more, good freeware and shareware available for the PC. Linux would hold the clear lead over both PC and MAC in terms of community supported software, particularly considering the OS itself is community supported. The fact that Windows has a greater selection of junk shareware available is more a mark of PC success than a damning of the architecture. It's just not that hard to work out which are the worthwhile apps to load.
the Average MAC user can pretty much get away with MAC plus Office, and the average PC user can pretty much get away with PC plus office, the choice to load Maim & Bludgeon IV or Super-Handy-File-Sorter are choices available for the PC user, most of us neither need or load such things.

8. More useful Apps out of the Box. I don't particularly want apps out of the box. I'll concede that windows has included some tragedies of half baked apps, and desktop Linux builds see fit to load 4 terminals, 3 calculators and at least 1 partridge in a pear tree application, but these are easily removed from positions of annoyance. OS apps may be fine for preparation of a Sunday school newsletter, or a 3rd grade school project, but anything serious will usually require purchase of a professional application.

9. Neat and contained System Settings. All looks nice, all that neatness but it also equates to controlled system settings. Those neat setting only allow options within the managed confines Apple wishes to offer.

10. Apple doesn't load the System with Crap. Yes I'd have to agree this is a MAC plus, with the MS, PC manufacturers and every peripheral supplier seeing fit to festoon your system with crud. However the moment you open the browser, (which is in the end where most of the crap is now delivered) then the stakes equalise. That annoying Nokia pop-out on this APC site is just as present regardless of your OS unless your browser is broken.

11. Tons of small reasons make OS X Better. We are back to the "Better" again I couldn't be bother doing a plus and minus comparison of shortcuts, but I would note that for dozens of Small reason, many software vendors of specialist applications chose to avoid Apple. How is the choice of SCADA packages for the MAC for example. There are dozen of reason why the MAC is not the better choice for particular applications.

12. Still no need for security software. You being very brave saying no need, but there is not denying Linux and MAC are miles ahead in terms of security architecture. MS has dithered around for years because users might not have wanted annoying passwords, or had thought it an insult for Dad not to automatically have super-user rights. And of course PC is again victim of its own success, with every backroom hacker in upper and lower Kyrzikstan writing malware for Windows, it being the largest potential target.

13. Apple is Largely free of lameness Come on Dan pull the other one, the very notion of "Genius Bar" says Apple can do lame as well if not better than the opposition. Steve Jobs doing product promos while dressed like one of the Thunderbirds is not lame?

14. Power of the Command Line This is one dear to my heart, for those far enough up the gene pool to exist beyond Zombie Clicking, the command line will at times be the best (read most productive) tool for the job. I do not agree that the DOS prompt is so bad, although successive windows command lines are becoming less and less powerful, which is just dumb. Id rather use the best tool for the job and it's not always a mouse or a multi coloured custom skinned GUI.

15. File sharing is much easier Well across a workgroup it may be, but integrating MACs into a multi system environment is where that cotton wool covered utopia turns into a major PITA.

To make some very generalised observations of workplaces I encounter, MACs still dominate the desktops of the publishing related organisations, yet its almost universal that the accounts department will still be PCs only. MAC just wont be seen around any of the SCADA, CCTV or Automation system installations, this is a PC only area without exception, both Windows and Linux.

As for embedded applications MAC is nowhere to be found, and it appears they have poured all their R&D into their walkman thingys and touch screen gigglephones.

There is no "Better than", Dan has noted some strengths of MAC, but still MAC as it stands is not a universal replacement for a PC. The gaining of market share by both MAC and Linux is likely to continue even if Windows 7 proves to be the popular success that Vista was not, and that can only be a good thing.

It would be nice to see some more real innovation from all players and an end to this period where case colour is rating as a feature.

Dissenting fan boys with low self esteem and a need to defend the honour of their OS of choice need not reply.

15 November 2008, 11:58 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Me In Oz (User):

Quoting Raindog:
Dissenting fan boys with low self esteem and a need to defend the honour of their OS of choice need not reply.

Your comments were quite topical and interesting until this sentence.
Why do you feel the need to be condescending to others ?

That's that target I was referring to earlier !

And 'need not reply' ? ............ Again, thank goodness it's not up to you !




15 November 2008, 12:08 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (New user):

Quoting Me In Oz:
Again, thank goodness it's not up to you !

I never made any claim it was!


Quoting Me In Oz:
Why do you feel the need to be condescending to others ?

Why have you felt the need to shout someone down!!


Quoting Me In Oz:
Your comments were quite topical and interesting

That was the intention.


15 November 2008, 12:25 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Papa-Raboon (New user):

Quoting Raindog:
5.OS X + Windows is better than windows Well no it's not!

Sorry dude but you're wrong on that one.
Even Microsoft are experimenting running Windows as a VM. I run Windows as a VM to test sites that I build and the whole thing is backed up via time machine automatically. If I get a virus in Windows or the registry is destroyed somehow which again has been known I can just delete my VM disk image and restore from one that was backed up an hour ago because Time Machine on Leopard allows for a quick and safe backup.

Try doing that with a native install on Windows on a PC.



17 November 2008, 5:36 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (New user):

Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Sorry dude but you're wrong on that one.

Um no! Tried virtualising a windows application that requires 3 NICs and or multiple serial ports lately? Tried running them natively on Apple hardware? Tried finding OS-X software for similar tasks?


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Even Microsoft are experimenting running Windows as a VM.

Which is probably why MS are not saying much about the negatives of VM systems. It depends entirely on what and how you wish to run windows. Tried to run any serious communications apps via a VM lately?

Try doing that on your Os-X VM! Good luck?

There are some exciting advances in VM technologies now that hardware has made a march ahead of available software, but VM is not a universal panacea, and there is still many instances where "one box for one function" should still apply.





17 November 2008, 7:27 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Papa-Raboon (New user):

Quoting Raindog:
Um no! Tried virtualising a windows application that requires 3 NICs and or multiple serial ports lately? Tried running them natively on Apple hardware? Tried finding OS-X software for similar tasks?

Yeah because so many regular users want to do that!
Come on. you're reaching Raindog.
Anyway. If you had a Mac why would you want to run many Windows apps on it anyway?

I run IE and that's all. Just for testing sites I develop. CSS, that sort of thing.

As IT moves to open standards, the OS is becoming a matter of choice.

Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Even Microsoft are experimenting running Windows as a VM.

Which is probably why MS are not saying much about the negatives of VM systems. It depends entirely on what and how you wish to run windows. Tried to run any serious communications apps via a VM lately?

OK, name one and I'll have a go!
We'll call it research. I could also try it in Crossover Mac to see if it works. And that's NOT a VM. It's WINE for OS X.

Try doing that on your Os-X VM! Good luck?

There are some exciting advances in VM technologies now that hardware has made a march ahead of available software, but VM is not a universal panacea, and there is still many instances where "one box for one function" should still apply.

OK, point taken.
But for the average user and most Pro users too, OS X is a great environment to use and Fusion or Parallels will cover you for the majority of stuff you still need to transition from.


19 November 2008, 2:19 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (New user):

Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Yeah because so many regular users want to do that!

Applications with multiple NICs or serial adaptors are hardly out there esoteric. And regardless of what proportion of users run them it still makes a nonsense of the original sweeping statement that "Windows under OS X is still better than native windows". Even though you did quote one valid plus for running that way, there is always a going to be performance hit, and you well know how that will be received, particularly by the shoot-em-up set.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Anyway. If you had a Mac why would you want to run many Windows apps on it anyway?

Add a tick to your MAC fan-boy slogan score. You know already why people want to run Windows Apps on a mac, and reading your own reply you even quote reasons why you have to do so yourself. So whose stretching huh?


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
I run IE and that's all. Just for testing sites I develop. CSS, that sort of thing.

That's not something the average user would do everyday now is it? So there goes that angle you were taking. Actually I routinely do pretty much the same thing when testing, but it's hardly a strength of MAC at any stretch.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
As IT moves to open standards, the OS is becoming a matter of choice.

If only that were true. How many MAC applications run under Windows or even Linux? There are plenty of port and re-codes. But those open standards are a long way off, which is a real pity and an immense cost to software developers and to users of of more than one OS.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
We'll call it research. I could also try it in Crossover Mac to see if it works. And that's NOT a VM. It's WINE for OS X

It's all great stuff, but regardless it will not run Windows apps better than they run natively. Adequate may be more than acceptable but it will never justify the "better than" tag.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
But for the average user and most Pro users too, OS X is a great environment to use

No argument from me on that one. Great environment - yes, Better than -no, a personal preference - well that's a maybe.

I'm not trying to run down MAC, its a well refined mature option, but the suggestion it is a universal panacea for all computing ills or the suggestion it is a substitute for each and every or even most PC applications is far from reality.


19 November 2008, 8:42 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Papa-Raboon (New user):

Quoting Raindog:
Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Yeah because so many regular users want to do that!

Applications with multiple NICs or serial adaptors are hardly out there esoteric. And regardless of what proportion of users run them it still makes a nonsense of the original sweeping statement that "Windows under OS X is still better than native windows".

Well actually I think the article meant that being able to run both on a Mac was better than only being able to run Windows on a PC (obviously not taking into consideration that you can run Linux on either).

Now it sems you don't know that you can either run Windows in a VM (Parallels or VMware fusion) or you can dual boot using Apple's Boot camp natively into Windows so no performance hit there! In fact I have read articles that state that running Windows natively on a Mac is really fast compared to most PCs.

Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Anyway. If you had a Mac why would you want to run many Windows apps on it anyway?

Add a tick to your MAC fan-boy slogan score. You know already why people want to run Windows Apps on a mac, and reading your own reply you even quote reasons why you have to do so yourself. So whose stretching huh?

I stick by it and why does that make me a 43 year old Mac fanboy. I think at 43 I can be regarded just as a Mac fan :-)

But calling someone a fanboy because you have no real argument is a cop out which kinda makes you the fanboy. So here goes. I seriously do NOT know a single person that prefers to run Windows who has switched from a Windows machine to a Mac (and I know quite a few switchers). So since I use the words "Want to" rather then the words "Need to". I can say; hand on heart; that the average Mac user who has to run the odd Windows app would prefer it if they could get a proper Mac version. However, since there are equivalent Mac versions of all general Windows apps there is rarely any need to boot Windows on a Mac.

Quoting Papa-Raboon:
I run IE and that's all. Just for testing sites I develop. CSS, that sort of thing.

That's not something the average user would do everyday now is it? So there goes that angle you were taking. Actually I routinely do pretty much the same thing when testing, but it's hardly a strength of MAC at any stretch.

Running IE on a Mac is something I can hardly avoid since many ignorant users who don't even know what a web browser is (I talked to two of them this week alone) use IE because it is on the computer they bought and they just refer to it as "The Internet".

Mainly because IE is so crap but widely used is why I have to use it for testing. Otherwise I wouldn't bother.

How many Mac users have their own personal web site. I would guess, a higher percentage per userbase then their Windows using counterparts. A bigger percentage of Mac users are creatives, graphic designers, home users etc. The vast majority of Windows users are cubicle jockies inputting data, writing letters sending email etc.

Quoting Papa-Raboon:
As IT moves to open standards, the OS is becoming a matter of choice.

If only that were true. How many MAC applications run under Windows or even Linux? There are plenty of port and re-codes. But those open standards are a long way off, which is a real pity and an immense cost to software developers and to users of of more than one OS.

Seems you didn't understand what I meant by open standards. I was referring to file standards, not applications. PDF, XML, TXT, MPEG, etc. They are making the different software we use more compatible with each other. As Microsoft can only compete using "lock-in" tactics rather than quality they always try to develop their own closed standards versions of every file format WMV, WMA, etc to hold onto their desktop monopoly. If they eventually decide to compete on quality and actually start to care about the quality of their products they may actually finally use open standards. However, anti-trust cases in the US and Europe regarding anti-competitive practices have shown us this is the way MS play in the software arena.

Quoting Papa-Raboon:
We'll call it research. I could also try it in Crossover Mac to see if it works. And that's NOT a VM. It's WINE for OS X

It's all great stuff, but regardless it will not run Windows apps better than they run natively. Adequate may be more than acceptable but it will never justify the "better than" tag.

Well WINE and Crossover Mac are a reverse engineered version of the Windows API, not an emulator so you can run a good number of Windows Apps natively on Linux or OS X.

Agreed, some apps don't run as well as the API is closed source. And some don't run at all. But it also means that the bugs in the Windows API don't get built into the software either. So those apps that are classed as gold standard in WINE can quite possibly run better then they do on Windows. Any WINE or Crossover Mac users on here care to comment?

Quoting Papa-Raboon:
But for the average user and most Pro users too, OS X is a great environment to use

No argument from me on that one. Great environment - yes, Better than -no, a personal preference - well that's a maybe.

I'm not trying to run down MAC, its a well refined mature option, but the suggestion it is a universal panacea for all computing ills or the suggestion it is a substitute for each and every or even most PC applications is far from reality.

OK. Care to elaborate on that?

Each and every, fair enough. But neither is Windows! And Most Applications. Well we will have to agree to differ because you have yet to define what you mean by "Most PC applications" and I have yet to comment on which of those applications would be impossible on a Mac. But if I had to hazard a guess based on the fact that I am a power user and used both platforms (and linux on servers) I would state that Macs can be a panacea for most and nothing can be a panacea for all. So what it finally comes down to is which has the best security out of the box, best ease of use, most consistent user experience through the majority of it's software and is more reliable and I'm sorry, you can contradict me if you think I'm wrong but I would say Mac on all four counts.

I am saying this because of my own personal experience. Macs may not be perfect. But Apple cares about the quality far more than Microsoft does and they have the hardware to design as well as the software. Microsoft can't even get the security of their flagship product right. And they are only software developers!

19 November 2008, 10:00 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (New user):

Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Now it sems you don't know that you can either run Windows in a VM (Parallels or VMware fusion) or you can dual boot using Apple's Boot camp natively into Windows so no performance hit there!

It seems you are making sweeping assumptions, believe what you wish, but any form of virtualisation will involve a performance hit. Where do all those virtualisation CPU cycles come from? The super magic stress free no loss virtualisation chip. Multiple boots are fine to get you out of a pickle, but anyone who has considered jumping from OS to OS as a practical or productive means of working has usually ended up with one box of each type under his or her desk pretty quick smart. Argue all you like but its simple reality.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
In fact I have read articles that state that running Windows natively on a Mac is really fast compared to most PCs.

I've read articles that suggested defragging daily and other that claimed the Apollo moon landing was a hoax. Don't believe everything you read, especially when advertisers have a strong sway on much of what is published.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
I stick by it and why does that make me a 43 year old Mac fanboy. I think at 43 I can be regarded just as a Mac fan :-)

The fan-boy tag is hung on the choice to evangelise and otherwise bang on about a personal choice supposedly being something all others should adopt. Or belief in some form ignorant superiority that all those who do not use their chosen OS are somehow wrong.

As for the age, well I'd still be entitled to call you boy. I've known many stupid and ignorant people of every age I've see children and teenagers capable of real insight. Even if the latter is rare in the extreme and almost creepy.

Quoting Papa-Raboon:
But calling someone a fanboy because you have no real argument is a cop out which kinda makes you the fanboy.

No cop out. If your the one trying to push the single answer argument the your a fan-boy, end of story.

Quoting Papa-Raboon:
So here goes.

This'll be good

Quoting Papa-Raboon:
I seriously do NOT know a single person that prefers to run Windows who has switched from a Windows machine to a Mac (and I know quite a few switchers).

So you exist in a narrow and limited circle of association, you practically never see a windows fan at the Mac store right? Reality check time.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
So since I use the words "Want to" rather then the words "Need to". I can say; hand on heart; that the average Mac user who has to run the odd Windows app would prefer it if they could get a proper Mac version. However, since there are equivalent Mac versions of all general Windows apps there is rarely any need to boot Windows on a Mac.

No argument it would make much more sense to run an apps written for your OS of choice, the simple fact is that there are still lots that are written only for windows, as much as you and I wish that was not the case.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Running IE on a Mac is something I can hardly avoid since many ignorant users who don't even know what a web browser is (I talked to two of them this week alone) use IE because it is on the computer they bought and they just refer to it as "The Internet".

There's that fan-boy arrogance surfacing again. "Ignorant users" Ignorant why, because their live are not as computer focused as yours or mine? Ignorant because almost every quick start guide or reference uses IE as a base. IE was thrust at most people, and just because you and I know there are better options about does not make everyone who uses IE ignorant.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Mainly because IE is so crap but widely used is why I have to use it for testing. Otherwise I wouldn't bother.

Very much to do with how many copies of Windows are out there, isn't it, while MS might not have got much right of late there is no arguing the success and penetration of Windows. And news for you not all those purchase decisions were made from a position of ignorance.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
How many Mac users have their own personal web site. I would guess, a higher percentage per userbase then their Windows using counterparts. A bigger percentage of Mac users are creatives, graphic designers, home users etc. The vast majority of Windows users are cubicle jockies inputting data, writing letters sending email etc.

That one gets you "Fan-boy of the Month", you'd better loosen the skivvy and take a reality check. Personal web-site, yeah those are mark that will noted in the memoirs of of the universe, all those photos of the kids and the house and some caravan park holiday.

A bigger percentage of mac users are creatives? Take your hand off it, or are you suggesting Mac is specifically tailored for poets, advertising copywriters, school fete organisers. If you were to take that parallel the given the PC is the usual choice for engineers, architects, scientists, accountants etc, then you could claim the PC was tailored for those who intended to actually do something useful.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Seems you didn't understand what I meant by open standards.

Seems you were making assumptions, maybe even creative ones.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
I was referring to file standards, not applications. PDF, XML, TXT, MPEG, etc. They are making the different software we use more compatible with each other. As Microsoft can only compete using "lock-in" tactics rather than quality they always try to develop their own closed standards versions of every file format WMV, WMA, etc to hold onto their desktop monopoly.

Only a fool would suggest that Apple was a champion of open standards. Their systems are as closed if not more so than anything from Microsoft. Apple have no choice but to embrace common file format or they would bee doomed to obscurity. Of course Apple make efforts to read windows formats, they could not exist without maximised efforts to interact with Windows. The reverse is not so crucial.



Quoting Papa-Raboon:
If they eventually decide to compete on quality and actually start to care about the quality of their products they may actually finally use open standards.

Yeah one day Windows will be able to handle PDF, XML, TXT, MPEG files right? reality check time.



Quoting Papa-Raboon:
However, anti-trust cases in the US and Europe regarding anti-competitive practices have shown us this is the way MS play in the software arena.


And the way Apple plays, take the blinkers off.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Well WINE and Crossover Mac are a reverse engineered version of the Windows API, not an emulator so you can run a good number of Windows Apps natively on Linux or OS X.

As long as your prepared to take a performance hit.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Agreed, some apps don't run as well as the API is closed source. And some don't run at all.

Yep there is that reality biting in again.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
But it also means that the bugs in the Windows API don't get built into the software either.

How does that work? Oh yeah that's right the apps don't run at all. like it or lump it.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Any WINE or Crossover Mac users on here care to comment?

I run wine from time to time, but anything serious end up setting up another box running the app and it's native OS, it's that productivity thing again. probably not as much an issue for the poets though, at a rough guess.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
But if I had to hazard a guess based on the fact that I am a power user and used both platforms (and linux on servers)

Woo-Hoo do your wear your power user badge while power using? meanwhile back here on earth reality is in progress.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
I would state that Macs can be a panacea for most and nothing can be a panacea for all.

You've almost got it, now substitute some for most and you'll be on the money.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
So what it finally comes down to is which has the best security out of the box, best ease of use, most consistent user experience through the majority of it's software and is more reliable and I'm sorry, you can contradict me if you think I'm wrong but I would say Mac on all four counts.

You could say Mac on all for counts you are entitled to miss the point entirely.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
I am saying this because of my own personal experience.

Well I choose to comment not only from my own viewpoint and my own particular set of needs but also from the experiences of needs of customers, colleagues, systems developers and specialist manufacturers.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Macs may not be perfect.

They are far from perfect, far from universally applicable to every task, and nowhere near as adaptable as that many faced beast we know generically as a PC. That said they can be a tool of choice for particular applications. (not just poetry)


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
But Apple cares about the quality far more than Microsoft does


Oh rubbish. They are both large corporations anyone that thinks they care for anything other than profit and shareholders is kidding themselves. Apple have a better record for quality and consistency, but that comes hand in hand with a record for limited hardware and software choice, and from a lack of adaptability of architecture. The support task taken on by MS servicing a vast range of hardware, peripheral and other software is immense.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
and they have the hardware to design as well as the software.

And the locked up proprietary model and monopoly pricing that goes with such a design.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Microsoft can't even get the security of their flagship product right.

Well actually they can, millions of Microsoft boxes are configured and operating daily in relative safety. The difference is choice, those who choose to disregard security on PC are free to do so.

You have presented some excellent comparison points, and some considered argument, all good stuff, it's just such a pity to see all that spoilt by the "better than" and the assumed superiority.


20 November 2008, 10:13 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Me In Oz (User):

As a gamer, Apple will never be an OS of choice (at the moment) !
Thanks Dan, for including the things OSX CANNOT do !

15 November 2008, 12:11 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Ash (New user):

Yeah, yeah. I'm a Linux user, go ahead and stereotype me as an extremist.

But guess what. DRM is a big issue. Hardware Lock-in is a big issue. Anti-competitive software locks is a big issue (you can't even have Opera on your iPhone, because Apple doesn't want you to). Yay, Mac hardware is shiny and the Operating System is sexy. Let them take your freedom away from you if it's so important to you that can look like a hipster. Just move into stylish computing over smart computing and surrender your knowledge. You don't need it any more.

If Apple were to dominate the market, where would AMD be? Where would the sophisticated computer user be? Where would Open Source and Alternatives be?

To be honest, this article disappoints me. I love APC a lot, but I don't want to hear this rubbish from an intelligent magazine for power users.

And while you're at it, could you stop printing letters from clueless children who deem adults that game to have no lives? Enthusiasts are the market for your magazine, not condescending individuals who think they can tell us how to spend our money,

15 November 2008, 3:44 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (New user):

Quoting Ash:
Let them take your freedom away from you

Quoting Ash:
but I don't want to hear this rubbish from an intelligent magazine for power users.

Quoting Ash:
And while you're at it, could you stop printing letters from

So lets get this right Ash, you want software to be free and open source, but you want forums and publications censored to eliminate any opinions you don't agree with, and you want all article to be from your viewpoint?

Do you see the irony in your requests?


Quoting Ash:
Enthusiasts are the market for your magazine,

And Market research too! News for you Ash, APC has readers, focused on things other than the back page shoot-em-ups section too.


Quoting Ash:
but I don't want to hear this rubbish from an intelligent magazine for power users.

Quoting Ash:
who think they can tell us how to spend our money,

Nobody is telling you how to spend your money, whether you wish to spend it on computer software or new bicycle clips I doubt anyone gives a fig, your free to spend as you desire.

Curious though, that while baying for your rights of free purchase you see fit to tell other how to run their magazine and website and what they should include, and you see yourself as having a right to decide who should contribute on a forum.

I think you'd better take stock of exactly who is telling others how to behave! Don't you?






15 November 2008, 6:15 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Ash (New user):

Quoting Raindog:
So lets get this right Ash, you want software to be free and open source, but you want forums and publications censored to eliminate any opinions you don't agree with, and you want all article to be from your viewpoint?
I don't really see the relation between free and open source software and children whining adult gamers have no lives. They have the freedom to say what they want, and I have the freedom to suggest changes to the publishing of APC. The nature of open source and freedom is not 'everyone do what you want' but rather 'everyone gets a say'. I'm having a say.

Quoting Raindog:
Curious though, that while baying for your rights of free purchase you see fit to tell other how to run their magazine and website and what they should include, and you see yourself as having a right to decide who should contribute on a forum.


I pay for APC, I at least have the right to make a suggestion as to it's content. I don't really care about what that kid said, and he can take part on any forums he likes. I'd just prefer that APC would give the title of 'Letter of the Week' to you know, intelligent, insightful letters.

Quoting Raindog:
I think you'd better take stock of exactly who is telling others how to behave! Don't you?


Well, you are the one who excluded the actual points of my comment seemingly to attack my integrity for the sole reason that I objected to a letter of the week in APC. I would say you are very much telling me how to behave.

16 November 2008, 9:44 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (New user):

Quoting Ash:
I don't really see the relation between free and open source software and children whining adult gamers have no lives

and your point is?


Quoting Ash:
They have the freedom to say what they want, and I have the freedom to suggest changes to the publishing of APC.

And you exercised that freedom by suggesting onions you did not care for be restricted from publication, leaving me freedom to point out the flaws and contradictions in your stance. And was the insulting reference to other posters as children meant to add weight to you argument?

You've suggested everyone is free to say what they want but on opinions you choose to agree with should be heard!


Quoting Ash:
I pay for APC

That's great, but it does not entitle you to seat on the editorial committee now does it, a lot of other folks purchase APC too.

Quoting Ash:
I don't really care about what that kid said

As long as you don't have to hear or read it right?


Quoting Ash:
I'd just prefer that APC would give the title of 'Letter of the Week' to you know, intelligent, insightful letters

It is only your opinion that says this was not the case, others may disagree. Perhaps APC had tried to encourage a younger poster, or tried to allow a voice that differed from the noisy rabble. Regardless of how they made their decision it was their decision to make. I'd also ask why you chose to take this thread off topic rather than airing your grievances in the appropriate place? You'll find a forum section is available where your feedback would be welcome.


Quoting Ash:
Well, you are the one who excluded the actual points of my comment

No I pointed out the contradiction in what you said, and question your requests to have opinions other than your own suppressed!


Quoting Ash:
seemingly to attack my integrity

But it's OK for you to attack the integrity of other posters by calling them children etc? I've had a look and your definitely not listed as a protected species. You throw mud, expect mud thrown back.


Quoting Ash:
for the sole reason that I objected to a letter of the week in APC

No because you chose to belittle and name call others and chose to do so in an inappropriate location. No that there ever is an appropriate location for name calling.


Quoting Ash:
I would say you are very much telling me how to behave.

Well I am as far as rudeness is concerned, if you cannot express an opinion without name calling and attempts to shout others down then don't bitch about any dressings down you may incur.


16 November 2008, 11:49 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Ash (New user):

Quoting Raindog:
And Market research too! News for you Ash, APC has readers, focused on things other than the back page shoot-em-ups section too.

Oh, don't get the wrong idea. I use Linux only and do not own a current gen console. I rarely game. I'm not a gamer by any means, and the back section is of only marginal interest to me. I'm more of a PC builder. I like reviews on GPUs, CPUs, motherboards, esc.
The thing that gets me is that comment basically applies to me. Some would say I have no life because I don't simply go to Dell when I want a new computer. When I use a rarely used operating system. When I spend hours reading about new tech. Stupid comments like that letter irritate me because they assume I have no life because of my hobby.



16 November 2008, 9:52 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (New user):

Quoting Ash:
The thing that gets me is that comment basically applies to me.

If the shoe fits! Actually that comment was made to your assertion that APC readership only consisting of enthusiasts (which going by your prior comments suggested PC gamers). I made the suggestion that the readership was perhaps a little wider and diverse than that.


Quoting Ash:
Some would say I have no life because I don't simply go to Dell when I want a new computer.

Some would say the planet is likely to be over-run by killer lizards but I'd ignore those comments too.


Quoting Ash:
Stupid comments like that letter irritate me

Hijacking an interesting and though provoking thread with unrelated grievances irritates me. Anything to add on 15 reasons Mac v Windows?

16 November 2008, 12:00 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

$teeve Pink (New user):

Hey Dan.

Is this what you do for work?

You're fired!!!

15 November 2008, 4:15 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Dan Warne (Regular user):

Thanks $teeve -- however I think you're confusing yourself with my boss ;-)

15 November 2008, 4:25 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

znosko (New user):

The Windows users who defend the adequacy of their platform make accurate points. But the adequacy of Windows just proves the author's general point, even if he forgot to include one additional reason why Macs (or Mac OS) are still better than Windows: MS depends on Apple to maintain its adequacy, because MS needs Apple to steal ideas from. Examples abound from the entire history of both companies, but for modern examples, one need only examine Gadgets or refer to the internal MS emails revealing their anxiety over Spotlight.

15 November 2008, 4:44 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Halcon (User):

Let's get this straight! The article written by Dan Warne is about software.
Even though there are comparisons of the strength and weakness of both operating systems, this can't be generalized.
IBM PCs can be built form humble to high class components, costing several thousands of dollars.
Always when there is talk of this kind, the loyalists of one band try to bash the opposition with a lot of poisonous expletives.
know that My computer is not so cheap, I like the way it works.
Another point is that the Operating system should be free of tyranny, both companies Microsoft and Apple are guilty of using deceiving methods like DRM, Genuine Disadvantage, Product hacktivation and a lot more.
Neither companies can claim victory, as the ideologies are completely divisive!

15 November 2008, 10:12 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

BN (New user):

LOLZ @ Dan

Sure some of your points are valid, but most of them are just user preference bias.

sleep/Suspend works perfectly on my vista rig, and i don't think any part in my system is cheap either....quad core, 4 gig low latency DDR2, Asus MB, Antec Quadro power, Nvidia 280GTX etc etc Samsung LCD.

Sure theres issues with windows and some PC hardware, but being a hardware technician for well over 15+ years I've i had a dollar for every user who had a issue with a mac id probably own half of Google by now. Problems and issues go both ways.

So I think the real question that needs to be asked is HOW MUCH H DID DAN GET PAID FOR THIS BIAS WRITE UP ???

16 November 2008, 1:45 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Dan Warne (Regular user):

LOL!! If you think Apple would pay me, I don't think you know me or Apple very well ;-)

16 November 2008, 6:27 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Nicolas Gheeraert (New user):

Not being particularly a mac fan, I still find something quite striking : the difference of design between PCs and Mac, wether it concerns the OS part or the body part of the computer. Even PC users generally agree, compared to the simplicity of shapes and colors of the macs, the design of PCs is nothing. The argument has already been considered by Dan but not emphasized enough in my opinion.

For a lot of us the computer has become a central tool of our work/life and it's obviously important to enjoy your computer and its environment that you already fashion by personalizing wallpapers and screensavers in order to make it more likable. And to really like it I believe the design of the system is essential and should be given a lot more credit. I just don't see how some ridiculous modern-art PCs are to appeal to anyone. I am under the impression a lot of users (even some mac users who don't realise) give more importance to useless gadgets, like 200 more MHz or 50 more GigaBytes, than to things that have a truer value.

Design, it's a little bit like art, it has no palpable value. So we just consider it hasn't any. But I guess this is what makes the difference between a mac and a PC (to me the border still stands). Macs are a sub-group of computers just as Sony, Dell, Toshiba... form an other. And it justifies as a consequence the price paid for a mac : the prices are just not comparable. As long as the PC world doesn't make an effort, Macs have the upper-hand.

(off subject) Even more amazing is that this is the case in other areas : mp3 players, phones (OS of the iphone).

16 November 2008, 1:22 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

techdribble (User):

Better for you but not better for me. Great the mac works for you but I have tried and I will take a PC with Windows or Linux any day it just suits me.
"On balance, though, Macs just let you get stuff done, whereas Windows computers constantly find ways of annoying you. " See I have the opposite view and both a valid because you have no idea how everyone works and what they want out of a computer. I use what gets the job done for and in my case what I can build myself from quality components. For points 1 & 2 it would be bad if Apple couldn't get is its os to works with its software. Microsoft doesn't build hardware so those points dont mean much
Point 3 : So you know what components every other manufacturer uses in their PCs and laptops ?
Point 4 my PC has 1 light and my laptop 2 i wouldn't call that to many. Again I assume you have checked every PC and laptop on the market to make this comparison valid.
Point 5. I would run OSX on my PC but APPLE wont allow it.
Point 6. I have no problems troubleshooting my PC again this is your personal opinion and mine is the opposite and your opinion is no more valid than mine.
Point 7. Dont know about that I ran across my fair share of crap when I was using a Mac.
Point 8. If Microsoft add more apps everybody gets upset. On Linux this point is debatable.
Point 9. Again your opinion and not one I share.
Point 10. Microsoft doesnt either other companies might. My laptop came with 1 piece of crapware my PC with none. My linux pc came with no crapware at all.
Point 11. Again your opinion doesnt hold true for every user.
Point 12. Agreed
Point 13. Excuse me while I fall over laughing.
Point 14. Yeah hows your 64bit version of Photoshop going on OSX ?
Point 15. I dont have a problem sharing files on my windows box. Again your personal opinion and not a fact.





17 November 2008, 8:43 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

SeanFinn (New user):

I have used Macs at lans, friends and school but have never wanted to own one for the pure simple fact they are not as compatible as a Windows (or even Linux) based PC.

This article seems to be very pro mac, i made the unfortunate mistake of thinking the title to this article read "15 reasons why Windows PC's are still better then macs" But instead it read "15 reasons to prove i am a mac fanboi"

You dont buy a computer just for its software or UI, you buy it for actually doing a thing called 'work', not just because it looks pretty and feels smooth like your ever balding Steve Jobs.

I hope W7.0 blows Tiger out of the water, Apples tree need a shakeup, they have not even bothered to make their OSX 64bit native and they have been running the 64bit CPU's for 2.5 years!

Also OSX is still painfully slow on basic tasks and only really shines on apple exclusive apps which makes most of the reasons of this article totally BS.

A PC is also a open platform, you can change the hardware, software and even the UI to whatever you want.

But with MAC you are getting a locked platform, unable to change the specific specifications of the hardware in model you bought, no upgrading, overclocking, tweaking or any other glorious nerdage that could be had.

I hope this article crashes and burns like Steve Jobs health.

17 November 2008, 9:39 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Truckasauras (New user):

I really think you're struggling to come up with 15 credible reasons. I honestly think the price tag is sufficient to cancel out the majority of these reasons.

17 November 2008, 11:24 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

pmx (New user):

What planet are you people on ?

A Mac is not a PC .. and vice versa.

The 'comparing apples and oranges' statement here is not just a poor pun.

Despite the broad general similarity of both being computers than run software, the two systems have completely different design philosophies.

Windows PC's have slow boot times because of the wide range of hardware that have to support. If you reduced the amount of gear the PC had to support you'd have faster boot times and the resulting decrease in market share and you'd call it a Mac.

The wide range of 3rd party devices and sofware that Windows PC's support also effects the sleep mode. Having said that though, it has always worked for me. This is especially evidenced by Virtual PC's. I never 'reboot' my Virtual PC's .. they are always suspended and resumed and this always works.

Due to Windows vast market share any move Microsoft make to increase 'useful apps out of the box' will result in an anti-trust suit. When you've got close to no market share no-one cares what you do.

Microsoft doesn't load my system up with crap, Dell does that, Adobe does that, Yahoo does that. With the latest Yahoo Messenger, the opt-out of installing the Yahoo toolbar is 'hidden' in the advanced options .. nice ! Now When I get a new PC to setup I get my trusty Tiny XP image out out and have a lean mean XP install in no time. Boots quickly too.

I just looked at my PC and all the PC's (including laptops) around me .. not a blinking light to be seen .. headphone jacks are in the side so no problem there. You know if these are important issues for you then you should probably factor that in to your purchases. Maybe you should take some remedial shopping lessons instead of tilting a large corporate windmills. If I thought it was a good idea to pay extra money for subjective fit and finish issues that makes no overall difference to the system performance and usabilty then I guess I'd be a Mac user :)

'lameness free' .. is that the scientfic term .. 'New Apple Mac ! Now 90% lameness free !'

I work in mining and heavy industry. Windows PC's have 100% of that market due to their flexibily and reliabilty. If you buy the right PC, install the right software they just work. All the time. I managed the plant control network at a major industrial site for a number of years. It was a Windows PC network. The main file server, running NT 4.0, ran for 5 years, 24/7, no reboots, no problems, it was fully UPS backed and so it never shutdown even during extended power outages.
For home I bought a Dell PC 18 months ago and am running Vista Premium as a media centre. Pulled it out of the box, installed the TV tuner card, turned it on and use it everyday to record and watch TV, play games, use email, browse the web. Never had a problem with it .. not one.

So I don't know what you're all doing with the computers, but I think you should stop it, you'll go blind. If a major concern is 'Neat and contained system settings' then you're problably fiddling too much with them and that it was is stopping you from getting stuff done.


17 November 2008, 12:16 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Nicolas Gheeraert (New user):

Quoting pmx:
A Mac is not a PC .. and vice versa.
Quoting pmx:
If I thought it was a good idea to pay extra money for subjective fit and finish issues that makes no overall difference to the system performance and usabilty then I guess I'd be a Mac user :)
Quoting pmx:
If a major concern is 'Neat and contained system settings' then you're problably fiddling too much with them and that it was is stopping you from getting stuff done.

What you don't see is that all the "neat and well-organized things" of the OS X and mac apps have a lot of importance. Saying design is useless for work is naive, it has a lot to do with quality. Better organization and interface will obviously enable you to work faster while well chosen icons, colors and shapes will just make everything clearer on the screen. Mail, Safari, Pages... are good examples.

When you work on both systems like it is now possible on macs, as I do, you realize that very quickly. Even if some apps work only work with XP, you don't hestitate to switch to OSX for everything else, just to get a usable interface. It's obvious for picture, movie, music apps, but you realize it's the case as well for many other types of apps which have no acceptable equivalent on PC.

"A neat and contained" work environment, as you call it, is far from being a detail or even subjective. It has a direct consequence. I'd even say in lots of cases the interface compensates the lack of options compared to the tiring windows equivalent (as rare as this may be).

I agree the mac is not a pc, but they both fill the same consumer needs and so they can and have to be compared. And finally I'd like to remind you your personal experience is not an argument. You can't generalize your experience to the millions of PC users.



18 November 2008, 4:38 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

pmx (New user):

What I see is that 'neat', 'contained', 'well organised' in this context are subjective concepts that all people interpret differently.
If there was some sort of empirical defintion of 'neat' and 'well organised' that could be applied consistently to different applications, I agree it could improve the user experience and productivity.
However that would only be of significant benefit in the case of the applications that are used a lot (Browsers, Office Apps etc) and still would not apply to 'System Settings' which the majority of users have minimial, if any, interaction with. Did you read point 9 ?

It is the argument of window dressers and interior decorators everywhere that form is as important (if not more so) than function. It is not and it doesn't have anything to do with quality and everything to do with image. I've used Safari and keep going back to Opera and IE. I've used iTunes and keeping going back to Windows Media Player. The more Microsoft tries to modify its interfaces to copy the Mac, the less usable it becomes. I turn off all the design features to get a consistent usable interface. I've only started using Office 2007 now because I found a program that recreates the menu structure.

My experiences are just as valid as yours and everyone elses, especially in the case of this PC-Mac argument which is entirely specious.

The Mac addresses a segment of the consumer market very well. Windows PC's address the entire consumer market and industrial markets as well as possible. Sports cars go faster but that doesn't mean they're a better cars that you're basic sedan.



18 November 2008, 12:59 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

WarwickBrown (New user):

CMD+SHIFT+3, CMD+SHIFT+4, and CMD+SHIFT+4 - SPACE for screenshots, not just CMD+.

What's annoying about Quick Look is that the system-wide icon previews didn't come along until late Longhorn as far as I remember, then Apple announced they'd be adding the same feature to Leopard in 2006 at WWDC, but would go one further and have the space bar trick. Microsoft could have done that and it would have been the single killer feature of Vista. Being a user of both Leopard and Vista, Quick Look really is that one thing that would make me upgrade my OS.

Oh, and Expose and Spaces are the shiz. Shame barely any Mac users know how to use them. "Why do you have it so that you need to hold Fn while you press the function keys to get them to do what it says on them" "So F8, F9, F10, F11, and F12 function normally" "What do they normally do?" Urgghhh!!!!

18 November 2008, 8:51 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Jitsukablue (New user):

I agree on nearly every point, however MS office is almost obsolete due to Open Office, and Macs iworks is far better than MS's offering anyway (with the exception of mail merge, take not Mac. sort that out!).
This is a real petty hate, but it winds me up.
Less and Fewer are not the same words. You cannot have less blinking lights.
Fewer blinking lights. Less Light.
Fewer Coffee beans. Less Coffee.
It's a bit like the countless journalists who can't say "debut". It is not DAY'BOOOOOO, it is more like Dey'Beau (as in beautiful). “Niche” is also not pronounced Nitch.


18 November 2008, 11:04 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (New user):

Quoting Jitsukablue:
Less and Fewer are not the same words. You cannot have less blinking lights.

Dan may well have been referring to less blinking of the LEDs or Lamps on his MAC, rather than what you have assumed, being fewer blinking lamps. :>


18 November 2008, 11:40 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Jitsukablue (New user):

Quoting Raindog:
Dan may well have been referring to less blinking of the LEDs or Lamps on his MAC, rather than what you have assumed, being fewer blinking lamps

It wasn't assumed, it was judging from the pictures and the content that followed thereafter. I think anyone reading that section can tell he is referring to the quantity of the lights, not the quality or how frequently each light blinks. I appreciate what you're saying, but even if that's the case words such as 'brighter' or 'frequent' come to mind.

18 November 2008, 12:08 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Papa-Raboon (New user):

Quoting Raindog:
Dan may well have been referring to less blinking of the LEDs or Lamps on his MAC

Highly doubt it mate. I have a Mac Pro, two MacBooks, a Mac Mini and an iMac and the only light on them is the power light which extingiushes when the Macs are running or shut down and gently pulsates when the Macs are sleeping. So there are no "blinking" lights on Macs at all. I have always wondered what the point is of having them on PCs Some have so many.

If you don't need them on the Mac.
Why do they put them on a PC.

And what about all those ugly high tack stickers. uuuugggghhhh!
:-)



19 November 2008, 2:53 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (New user):

Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Highly doubt it mate.

I very much doubt it too, but speeling and grammer Nazis(LOL) that wish to be pedantic to the point of criticizing easy to understand sentences need to be dealt with. :>


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
and gently pulsates when the Macs are sleeping.

Ahah!, now you've done it the windows fan-boys will be onto that one. :>



Quoting Papa-Raboon:
If you don't need them on the Mac.
Why do they put them on a PC.

You don't need handlebars on a Ford Fairlane, but they are fairly useful accessory on a Kawasaki. And as I've stated previously some see all the flashy flash as a plus, even if you and I see it as being tat to the extreme.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
And what about all those ugly high tack stickers. uuuugggghhhh!
:-)

Not one you can blame Windows for, well apart from the COA tags, but yes I agree 100% with your observation. Stickers suck, they are praise points for those who haven't quite made it.
I can't say I've ever once felt the need to look at the top cover of a notebook to know it was a Core-2 Duo, mind you Vista users may need such reassurance from time to time. :>
No sticker has ever made a PC work better, or made a car go faster, or made some knob of a user look clever.
I'll concede P-R you've added another plus point for the MAC cause and while MAC would not solve many of my computing needs it would save me a small fortune in Eucalyptus Oil come sticker removal time.


19 November 2008, 9:05 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Jitsukablue (New user):

Quoting Raindog:
Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Highly doubt it mate.

I very much doubt it too, but speeling and grammer Nazis(LOL) that wish to be pedantic to the point of criticizing easy to understand sentences need to be dealt with. :>

Lets see.
A) Thank the person and correct the mistake, or just correct the mistake and delete the evidence, or
B) Personally attack the kind person pointed out a mistake?
Hmmm... which one should I choose?

No need to get personal, I guessed as you are a publisher, then spelling and grammar would be important to you? Obviously not. It might make sense (because I know what was meant), but that doesn't make it correct, does it? That example is just as wrong as saying "I'd like 1st pizza with extra geeky cheese and 1st pizza with none". They may guess what they mean, but it wouldn't be correct.
Do I need to point out that 'speeling' and 'grammer' are also incorrect, or was that supposed to be some form of irony? Even then, that would be acceptable to have mistakes in forum comments.



25 November 2008, 9:02 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

ESC (New user):

regarding #12: apple was hacked in 2 minutes flat, far ahead of windows, etc. see http://dvlabs.tippingpoint.com/blog/2008/03/27/day-two-of-cansecwest-pwn-to-own---we-have-our-first-official-winner-with-picture. I can't recommend apple to clients who have sensitive data on their computers. I have to recommend secured computers to them.

18 November 2008, 8:25 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

FilmCrzy (New user):

I hope i don't insult anyone saying this, but the reason why the masses like MACs are because they are idiot boxes. You don't have to "know" how to use a MAC, you can get on one do your thing. MACs have very few choice configurations for that specific reason. If they were as customizable as a PC they would have the same problems. Apple KNOWS this, this is why they sell RAM and other parts at a ridiculous costs and thats because what "Joe Ignorant" doesn't know, won't hurt him. So as a company they completly take adavantage of this. I own a MAC PRO and a MAC BOOK PRO and Custom PC. I use the MACs for Editing and the PC for Fun, but i can tell you right now, if the MAC OSX was actually released for any PC, you know damn well APPLE would go out of business and OS would have almost 100% of the same problems Windows does.

It has nothing to do with which operating system is better, it's how many users are on which. A good anology of the MAC user base and the PCs is Look a Large City like New York. This city has a extreme amount of people living in it, thus it can get quite dirty and crowded. Now compare it to a small city, more then likely it's less crowded and there is less trash. Hopefully that makes sense to some!

19 November 2008, 11:58 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

billythegates@web.de (New user):

First of all – I'm a Windows (XP) user and have never owned a MAC yet. But what really pisses me off at the moment is that I have just bought the new Adobe Creative Suite Master Collection for my IBM ThinkPad and I cannot install it due to repeatedly occurring BSODs. I tried it with another ThinkPad and the result was again repeatedly occurring Blue Screen at DVD #2 of #5. And what also pissed me off is that the installation of one DVD needs about 20 minutes to complete and the installer needs 280MB of RAM just to install programs – copying files from A to B while doing some changes to the Windows registry.

I have now spent 2 working-days on the installation of all CS4-programs and the only solution was to download all single test-versions and install them on-by-one. I do not want to know how much time – and as a freelancer MONEY – I have spent with installing Windows-based programs throughout my (professional) life. I'm about to switch because I am really sick of that over-dimensional time waste with Windows-based systems!

I know this was kind of off-topic because my special problem seems to be caused by Adobe's engineers – but I really wonder why installing programs in Windows can be such a mess!

@Dan, could you tell anyone out there if this kind of failure is likely to occur on a MAC? Thanks in advance!

19 November 2008, 8:22 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

renny (New user):

Every time I suggest to my coworkers that they dump their wintel hardware and get a Mac, their first response is 'expensive'. I've spent the last 4 years on a 'consumer' iBook G4 with only 2 outlays past the original - I typed all the letters off the keyboard and the battery finally gave up after 3 years. None of my coworkers can even use the computer they had 4 years ago - they are on their 2nd or even 3rd machine. (think total cost of ownership) I agree that Macs let you get your job done and put the controls that you need in a sensible and logical place. The Dock, though much maligned, is far superior to any other app switcher on the planet. Last night on my outdated machine, I spoke with Hong Kong by Skype, ripped a DVD for my iPod, and worked through quotes in Excel - all at the same time. Not bad for a 4 year old antique.

20 November 2008, 5:10 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Artie (New user):

In an ideal world, we would have an Operating System which is completely invisible from the user's perspective : how many of us interact directly with the OS in our phone/DVD player/games console ? The exception is development, and this where you really need a *nix shell, IMO. Microsoft finally got the message and we now have PowerShell (it had earlier incarnations, but this is the first time I have felt comfortable at a Windows command prompt). If Google has its way, the OS will occupy the position currently held by the BIOS - you need it to crank up the 'real' system, but only a chosen few get excited over it. As consumer hardware becomes ever more powerful, technologies like virtualisation will be increasingly viable as an alternative to multi-boot machines : hopefully, we will continue to have a choice re the user experience. I dont care whether they call it 'WinLynx OS XII' or 'FancyPants 1.0', and I dont really care which corporation funds it - it has to be fast, seamless and painless. Thanks, Santa.

20 November 2008, 2:55 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Artie (New user):

Dan, I just want Apple to continue innovating and forcing the other guys (hardware and software) to lift their own games. HP, for example, now have a range of consumer desktops and laptops that show real flair for design, even if they do come preloaded with mountains of crap and Vista. I have their DV9 17-inch laptop and am very happy with it, but I opted for the XP 'downgrade' when I bought my 'generic' gaming desktop : as much as I love the iMac, I cant see Apple ever selling a sub-$1500 iMac that gets 33 FPS with Crysis on high settings. My old 2.2GHz Macbook Pro sits quietly in the corner, waiting for the next time I want to access the Net without attracting every slimeware merchant on Earth :)

20 November 2008, 10:05 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Truckasauras (New user):

We all know that the Apple 2e was kick a$$. Now there's a computer you can trust.

20 November 2008, 2:16 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

psharkauburn (New user):

I'm always amazed when people write articles like this because they never get things quite *right* or really *fair*. I've been using both OSs for years and each obviously has pros/cons. Two extremely important things to qualify before going further significantly effect most of the items on the authors list - 1. Microsoft Windows is the predominant market leader (somewhere in the 90-95% range Link; 2. Windows based PCs support vastly more hardware configurations/devices (and Microsoft in no way dictacts the hardware you purchase).

Reason 1: Personally I've never had issues with sleep mode, but I've supported users with issues on Windows PC. The vast majority of the problems came down to device drivers either being faulty or not updated. Nothing to really fault the Windows OS for, just a by-product of people being able to choose the hardware inside of their PC instead of having it dicated to you.

Reason 2: Yep, Mac's boot faster. This is one I could care less about, I only reboot on the occasion Windows Update requires it, or a major software install. Windows software installs definitely require more reboots post installation which is annoying, but it almost always comes down to the software manufactures and their coding skills. A good example is that MS Office 2007 doesn't require a reboot post install - software done right. I still give the Mac props though.

Reason 3: Just stupid - obviously isn't Windows related because Windows doesn't make parts. So which arbitrary vendor do you go up against? Apple vs. Dell, Apple vs. Sony, what? Dollar wise Apples products are inferior - for the same dollars spent you can get vastly superior parts from a multitude of Windows PC vendors (whether superior in quality at the same quantity level, or superior in quantity at a similar quality level). Maybe it's not common knowledge, but neither Apple nor Dell make very many components inside their machines, they buy them from hardware manufactures and assemble them together. What is common knowledge is the price premium charged for Apple products. On the Windows vendor side you have a choice to have the vendor use premium parts or not.

Reason 4: Same as 3 above, nothing to do with Windows, just a vendor by vendor thing. Some are better, some are worse. I personally love the new Dell Latitude E series. To be fair I also love the MacBook designs as well.

Reason 5: Very true - Boot Camp/Parallels is fantastic. Windows PCs had virtual server software ages before Mac recently got it, this is simply an Apple doesn't play nice with others issue - points to MSFT on this one. If only Apple didn't make so much profit on their hardware side, they might be inclined to attempt making their software product work on 95% of the computers out there.

Reason 6: Don't get it. Same utilities on Windows side - and in Vista it's all in one place - "Computer Management". I love the note the author puts on "console" - like Event Viewer doesn't put all the system logs in one place.

Reason 7: Plain ridiculous. I totally agree Mac has a good community of software out there. There is NO denying that Windows has an infinitely larger community of software out there - that's the number one reason to purchase a PC because it can run more software (maybe #2 reason, cost is a huge factor). Listing software is truly pointless here.

Reason 8: Damn skippy! Love the built in Mac software. On defense on MSFT side is that when they tried incorporating software into the OS they got sued to death - downfall to being the market leader. This would probably naturally be reversed if Apple dominated.

Reason 9: ??? Uh...everything the author listed is located in one place in Windows - in the control panel...which he listed. They're the same. I'm going to assume it was a brain fart on the authors part here. Even keel.

Reason 10: ??? Don't get it either. Windows doesn't include any *junk*. Back to the Apple Vs. Dell Vs. Sony Vs. Billy-Bob issue. Some better than others, but the consumer ultimately has the choice on the Windows side due to a massive number of vendors to choose from. No choice on Apple side.

Reason 11: item one = print screen (along with PS + Alt/Control/Shift) - don't get it. Rest of items I agree with.

Reason 12: Like the author says, huge point of contention - but oddly the author gets the point of contention wrong. Because Windows is absolutely market dominant, the bad guys out there target it. If roles were reversed we would naturally see the opposite. Macs definitely have security flaws - and like Windows they obviously provide updates to patch them. For some reason it reminds me of a very crappy gym in town towting itself as the best because there are no lines to use it's equipment...but what if it was a good popular gym?

Reason 13: Uhh...maybe? I won't criticize anyone for trying new things, I know Steve Jobs wouldn't either. Multiple editions of the OS - kind of lame, kind of nice to have some choice (authors addition skills to get to 10 seem troubling to me). XPS format - who cares? Why would trying to compete be bad. Adobe tried to sue MSFT in 2006 over them including PDF support in OS - another case of being leader being a detriment.
Of course you get prompted on changing the date - it should be left alone! Too many critical things depend on the date to function - same as in any OS.

Reason 14: Agreed - Linux has a better command line than DOS. Windows has the powershell which is better than Linux (incredible if you haven't tried it). Obviously command lines aren't for average users on any OS so I'm assuming you mean to target IT folks in this arena. I have no clue where Photoshop came into this reason - I assume the author knows there is Photoshop for Windows.

Reason 15: Just flat out wrong. Network Neighborhood in Windows has existed since 98...I have no clue how right clicking a folder and choosing share is difficult.

OK - analyzing reasons done. I really think the author needed #4 to be MacBook vs. all other notebooks and could have summed it up with "magnetic power cord", I would have been yelling "hell ya!".

I really hate coming off as a Windows fanboy, because truly I am not (I really am a PC fanboy that that includes pretty much all OSs) - I really love Macs. I just hate seeing these wacky lists that don't make sense.

My number 1 reason to like Macs more is that they repond much much faster to consumer demands. Again though, its just a by-product of having a small market. If Windows developed a new OS every year people would rail on them (why do I have to upgrade all the time!).

Like I started with, most arguments are completely dependant on MSFT being market leader and extremely hands-off on the hardware/software you can choose to use with it. It seems whenever MSFT tries to do something extremely helpful they get sued - sued multiple times by Apple in fact, as well as countless others. You're just an easy target when you are the leader.

I see OS's in a linear fashion. On one end of the spectrum is Linux - ultimately customizable, difficult to use for beginners but extremely capable for IT experts, much less commercial stable software and support, not for average user. Then comes Windows - very customizable, overhelming amounts of software both commercial and open source, tons of support and documentation, and runs on an overwhelming amount of hardware (which adds to the customizable part), easy to use for beginners, incredibly capable for experts. Then comes MacOS, extremely easy to use for beginners, but very lacking for IT experts; incredibly uncustomizable - very few hardware choices (and only 1 PC vendor on top of that!) and very few software choices (but the software that does exist tends to be towards the industry top - good but expensive).

If you don't like having choice (or can't make decisions) go the Mac route. Seriously, in the Mac store you only have 4 models to choose from (talking iMac here), beyond that choose whether you want wireless keyboard/mouse and you're done - simple and elegant. You got to admit the irony in the company and positions itself as targeting the creative/individual , you get the least amount of individualism/flexibilty/customization in their products.

Done.

20 November 2008, 7:07 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

mark.m (New user):

Great article, with good points throughout. As someone who lived in the PC world for (too) many years, I now absolutely "get" why I used to hear Mac owners saying "I love my Mac". I would like to add a comment on just two things:

1) Regarding the virus/spyware issue (12. Still no need for additional security software) - Yes, we Mac owners have been blessed for a long time with this wonderful advantage. There are several technical reasons for this (physically typing in a password to authorize installation of any app and admin does not equal root are just two examples), though I will not go as far to say that a Mac will never get a virus. But I think that a seven and a half year track record of zero viruses in the wild (not "proof of concept" code) is very impressive, in addition to being a money-saver insofar as not having to purchase all of the "anti-ware" and the annual subscription fees that is virtually a requirement on a Windows PC.

2) Regarding Apple's DRM (Whoah, hold up there, anonymous flamer) - Apple is currently REQUIRED to use their FairPlay DRM, based on contracts they have with the recording labels. Do you understand this is a legal issue that Apple simply cannot choose to arbitrarily ignore? You should be aware that a good number of independent labels (and also EMI as of April 2007) allow their songs to be sold on the iTunes Store without any DRM and at the higher 256kbps bit rate. The use of FairPlay is NOT Apple's choice or desire, as evidenced by Steve Jobs' call for an end to all DRM in February 2007. So why are you not attacking the record labels; THEY, not Apple, are the ones who need to be dragged into the 21st century (kicking and screaming, apparently). By criticizing Apple and not Universal, Sony, and Warner, you give the impression that you are just as sadly informed on the issue of DRM as that idiot Norwegian bureaucrat ( http://theappleblog.com/2008/10/08/norway-itunes-drm-war/ ).

21 November 2008, 5:35 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Samboc (New user):

Interesting comments. I fix PC's for a living. ( I know MAC's don't break !!). Had to help set up a home network the other day. 3 computers - a XP Laptop, XP desktop and the latest MAC ( Running on Intel with XP in a 4 GB partition?? ) I setup the XP systems and had a look at the MAC. ( Have only seen 2 or 3 in my life). It was faily intuitive to access the network area and set up network ID's and passwords and it worked in a minute or two. The similarity between the MAC and Windows 3.1 was remarkable and certainly helped my navigation.

After a bit more checking the XP desktop showed very obvious signs of spyware and IP Hijacking which is another problem. When I isolated the MAC it showed exactly the same symptons. I have seen this form of spyware many times. It can be fixed with a lot of effort - the quickest fix is to reformat the HDD and reinstall. What do I do with the MAC ??

22 November 2008, 9:42 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Samboc (New user):

Interesting comments. I fix PC's for a living. ( I know MAC's don't break !!). Had to help set up a home network the other day. 3 computers - a XP Laptop, XP desktop and the latest MAC ( Running on Intel with XP in a 4 GB partition?? ) I setup the XP systems and had a look at the MAC. ( Have only seen 2 or 3 in my life). It was faily intuitive to access the network area and set up network ID's and passwords and it worked in a minute or two. The similarity between the MAC and Windows 3.1 was remarkable and certainly helped my navigation.

After a bit more checking the XP desktop showed very obvious signs of spyware and IP Hijacking which is another problem. When I isolated the MAC it showed exactly the same symptons. I have seen this form of spyware many times. It can be fixed with a lot of effort - the quickest fix is to reformat the HDD and reinstall. What do I do with the MAC ??

22 November 2008, 9:56 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Samboc (New user):

PS - Did I mention I tried to scroll on the MAC - Ancient history

22 November 2008, 9:56 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

HostingDude (New user):

Is it just me, or is this whole thing LAME as hell. I RESISTED updating from Windows 2k for YEARS because nothing was stable enough... point surrendered. BUT, now, after installing Vista Ultimate 64 on a quad core, well f*ck it, I'm a believer again. Keep in mind I'm 45 years old and my FIRST PC was an Apple II. Yes, we called Apples PC's back then... hell anything was a Personal Computer. Then I had a II+ Then a IIc. Then a IIe. Then a 386. Then a 486. You see, I switched when the bulk of software switched. And cost went down. And ease of connecting a hard drive without ripping a hole in my wallet to buy a cider or bCider. Look, Apple, I was with you in college, and you screwed me then. Steve Jobs can't win me back now with 3 percent of the market. You HAD the lion's share of the market in 1984/85/86 when the Apple II had more software written for it than any computer on the market. And you PISSED IT AWAY. Don't expect me to feel sorry for you.

Hey, when I want to play with something UNIXish or LINUXish, I can log into my leased CentOS 5 server, or my other server running RedHat Fedora Core, or my other server running FreeBSD. But don't shove that crap onto my own computer at home. Here, I want to load stuff everybody else uses, and I can use too. Stuff that I can EASILY find fixes for because it's used by EVERYBODY, not just some Steve Jobs-adoring freakazoid with no income.

Get a life, dude. Get Vista Ultimate on a Quad-Core processor, and give up the Windows-bashing. You'll always be number 3. (Note, not number 2 -- Linux holds that crown. Number 3.) Dumbf*ck.

24 November 2008, 7:28 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

HostingDude (New user):

Is it just me, or is this whole thing LAME as hell. I RESISTED updating from Windows 2k for YEARS because nothing was stable enough... point surrendered. BUT, now, after installing Vista Ultimate 64 on a quad core, well f*ck it, I'm a believer again. Keep in mind I'm 45 years old and my FIRST PC was an Apple II. Yes, we called Apples PC's back then... hell anything was a Personal Computer. Then I had a II+ Then a IIc. Then a IIe. Then a 386. Then a 486. You see, I switched when the bulk of software switched. And cost went down. And ease of connecting a hard drive without ripping a hole in my wallet to buy a cider or bCider. Look, Apple, I was with you in college, and you screwed me then. Steve Jobs can't win me back now with 3 percent of the market. You HAD the lion's share of the market in 1984/85/86 when the Apple II had more software written for it than any computer on the market. And you PISSED IT AWAY. Don't expect me to feel sorry for you.

Hey, when I want to play with something UNIXish or LINUXish, I can log into my leased CentOS 5 server, or my other server running RedHat Fedora Core, or my other server running FreeBSD. But don't shove that crap onto my own computer at home. Here, I want to load stuff everybody else uses, and I can use too. Stuff that I can EASILY find fixes for because it's used by EVERYBODY, not just some Steve Jobs-adoring freakazoid with no income.

Get a life, dude. Get Vista Ultimate on a Quad-Core processor, and give up the Windows-bashing. You'll always be number 3. (Note, not number 2 -- Linux holds that crown. Number 3.) Dumbf*ck.

24 November 2008, 7:30 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

HostingDude (New user):

Is it just me, or is this whole thing LAME as hell. I RESISTED updating from Windows 2k for YEARS because nothing was stable enough... point surrendered. BUT, now, after installing Vista Ultimate 64 on a quad core, well f*ck it, I'm a believer again. Keep in mind I'm 45 years old and my FIRST PC was an Apple II. Yes, we called Apples PC's back then... hell anything was a Personal Computer. Then I had a II+ Then a IIc. Then a IIe. Then a 386. Then a 486. You see, I switched when the bulk of software switched. And cost went down. And ease of connecting a hard drive without ripping a hole in my wallet to buy a cider or bCider. Look, Apple, I was with you in college, and you screwed me then. Steve Jobs can't win me back now with 3 percent of the market. You HAD the lion's share of the market in 1984/85/86 when the Apple II had more software written for it than any computer on the market. And you PISSED IT AWAY. Don't expect me to feel sorry for you.

Hey, when I want to play with something UNIXish or LINUXish, I can log into my leased CentOS 5 server, or my other server running RedHat Fedora Core, or my other server running FreeBSD. But don't shove that crap onto my own computer at home. Here, I want to load stuff everybody else uses, and I can use too. Stuff that I can EASILY find fixes for because it's used by EVERYBODY, not just some Steve Jobs-adoring freakazoid with no income.

Get a life, dude. Get Vista Ultimate on a Quad-Core processor, and give up the Windows-bashing. You'll always be number 3. (Note, not number 2 -- Linux holds that crown. Number 3.) Dumbf*ck.

24 November 2008, 7:30 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

HostingDude (New user):

P.S. You're just copying the concept of "10 reasons that an iPhone is no Blackberry." There is a difference. That comparison is EXACTLY RIGHT. The iPhone is indeed a lame piece of eye-candy-trash that can't do a damn thing businesslike. Here, you're trying to argue the opposite -- that a piece of goof-off hardware is better than a real business machine. Your head is seriously up your arss, dude. Seriously.

24 November 2008, 7:37 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

InformationOverlord (New user):

A few points I disagree with...

2. My Vista PC boots to a desktop in 50 seconds and my 2 year old xp PC (E6600) in 35 seconds (No av though), not the minutes suggested. Although this is NOT a laptop, the article title suggests macs are better in general including desktop PC's

3. Im sorry, but this is just not a valid point. There is only one producer for macs, and yes, they do use good parts. However, there are many PC manufacturors that will too - you cant just generalise.

6. Its pretty easy to troubleshoot windows too - and if you dont know your way around, there are plenty of free apps and/or support communities to help you out.

7. Im sure you could find apps similar to visual hub, onepassword and transmit. As for Adium, GAIM or Trillian.

8. Vista has an integrated stickynote app for sidebar, Windows Media Center which can replace iPhoto, Windows Calender to replace iCal and TimeMachine is a waste of space in my personal opinion. Thats not to say I cant appreciate that some people would find it useful.

9. Apart from the registry, all those apps are contained in the control panel - whats wrong with that?
And, in any case, the access to the registry gives a flexibility to tweaking programs that you dont get on a mac.

10. *cough iTunes cough*. And the key is just that - Brand name PC's. Thats not Windows Dan, thats the PC manufacturors.

11. Look on sourceforge for a screencapture utility. Get RKLauncher (from sourceforge), its a better version of the mac dock for windows. As for quicklook, I must be odd in that I can wait 8 seconds for Word or acrobat to Open. And windows can view most images.

12. As for this, Viruses that target Macs have existed since 2006 (http://www.sophos.com/pressoffice/news/articles/2006/02/macosxleap.html) All macs do is lull you into a false sense of security. And you dont have to pay annual subscription on ZoneAlarm, Spybot and Avast!.

13. Hey ive got a point for mac? How about the MacBook Air, with its whole army of ONE USB port. Or OSX's inability to play any decent games? Thats pretty lame to me.

14. You say that OSX has a better command shell than Windows. Right after saying that average users [i.e. not power user's] cant even download 3rd part apps. Well im sure these users will harness the power of the OSX command shell. And Windows users have free development languages in programs like SharpDevelop, VB.net Express etc which is much more powerfull that the apple command line. And windows has Photoshop CS4.

15. And Windows is harder to share files with?



26 November 2008, 4:51 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

InformationOverlord (New user):

A few points I disagree with...

2. My Vista PC boots to a desktop in 50 seconds and my 2 year old xp PC (E6600) in 35 seconds (No av though), not the minutes suggested. Although this is NOT a laptop, the article title suggests macs are better in general including desktop PC's

3. Im sorry, but this is just not a valid point. There is only one producer for macs, and yes, they do use good parts. However, there are many PC manufacturors that will too - you cant just generalise.

6. Its pretty easy to troubleshoot windows too - and if you dont know your way around, there are plenty of free apps and/or support communities to help you out.

7. Im sure you could find apps similar to visual hub, onepassword and transmit. As for Adium, GAIM or Trillian.

8. Vista has an integrated stickynote app for sidebar, Windows Media Center which can replace iPhoto, Windows Calender to replace iCal and TimeMachine is a waste of space in my personal opinion. Thats not to say I cant appreciate that some people would find it useful.

9. Apart from the registry, all those apps are contained in the control panel - whats wrong with that?
And, in any case, the access to the registry gives a flexibility to tweaking programs that you dont get on a mac.

10. *cough iTunes cough*. And the key is just that - Brand name PC's. Thats not Windows Dan, thats the PC manufacturors.

11. Look on sourceforge for a screencapture utility. Get RKLauncher (from sourceforge), its a better version of the mac dock for windows. As for quicklook, I must be odd in that I can wait 8 seconds for Word or acrobat to Open. And windows can view most images.

12. As for this, Viruses that target Macs have existed since 2006 (http://www.sophos.com/pressoffice/news/articles/2006/02/macosxleap.html) All macs do is lull you into a false sense of security. And you dont have to pay annual subscription on ZoneAlarm, Spybot and Avast!.

13. Hey ive got a point for mac? How about the MacBook Air, with its whole army of ONE USB port. Or OSX's inability to play any decent games? Thats pretty lame to me.

14. You say that OSX has a better command shell than Windows. Right after saying that average users [i.e. not power user's] cant even download 3rd part apps. Well im sure these users will harness the power of the OSX command shell. And Windows users have free development languages in programs like SharpDevelop, VB.net Express etc which is much more powerfull that the apple command line. And windows has Photoshop CS4.

15. And Windows is harder to share files with?



26 November 2008, 4:51 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

InformationOverlord (New user):

A few points I disagree with...

2. My Vista PC boots to a desktop in 50 seconds and my 2 year old xp PC (E6600) in 35 seconds (No av though), not the minutes suggested. Although this is NOT a laptop, the article title suggests macs are better in general including desktop PC's

3. Im sorry, but this is just not a valid point. There is only one producer for macs, and yes, they do use good parts. However, there are many PC manufacturors that will too - you cant just generalise.

6. Its pretty easy to troubleshoot windows too - and if you dont know your way around, there are plenty of free apps and/or support communities to help you out.

7. Im sure you could find apps similar to visual hub, onepassword and transmit. As for Adium, GAIM or Trillian.

8. Vista has an integrated stickynote app for sidebar, Windows Media Center which can replace iPhoto, Windows Calender to replace iCal and TimeMachine is a waste of space in my personal opinion. Thats not to say I cant appreciate that some people would find it useful.

9. Apart from the registry, all those apps are contained in the control panel - whats wrong with that?
And, in any case, the access to the registry gives a flexibility to tweaking programs that you dont get on a mac.

10. *cough iTunes cough*. And the key is just that - Brand name PC's. Thats not Windows Dan, thats the PC manufacturors.

11. Look on sourceforge for a screencapture utility. Get RKLauncher (from sourceforge), its a better version of the mac dock for windows. As for quicklook, I must be odd in that I can wait 8 seconds for Word or acrobat to Open. And windows can view most images.

12. As for this, Viruses that target Macs have existed since 2006 (http://www.sophos.com/pressoffice/news/articles/2006/02/macosxleap.html) All macs do is lull you into a false sense of security. And you dont have to pay annual subscription on ZoneAlarm, Spybot and Avast!.

13. Hey ive got a point for mac? How about the MacBook Air, with its whole army of ONE USB port. Or OSX's inability to play any decent games? Thats pretty lame to me.

14. You say that OSX has a better command shell than Windows. Right after saying that average users [i.e. not power user's] cant even download 3rd part apps. Well im sure these users will harness the power of the OSX command shell. And Windows users have free development languages in programs like SharpDevelop, VB.net Express etc which is much more powerfull that the apple command line. And windows has Photoshop CS4.

15. And Windows is harder to share files with?



26 November 2008, 4:52 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

InformationOverlord (New user):

A few points I disagree with...

2. My Vista PC boots to a desktop in 50 seconds and my 2 year old xp PC (E6600) in 35 seconds (No av though), not the minutes suggested. Although this is NOT a laptop, the article title suggests macs are better in general including desktop PC's

3. Im sorry, but this is just not a valid point. There is only one producer for macs, and yes, they do use good parts. However, there are many PC manufacturors that will too - you cant just generalise.

6. Its pretty easy to troubleshoot windows too - and if you dont know your way around, there are plenty of free apps and/or support communities to help you out.

7. Im sure you could find apps similar to visual hub, onepassword and transmit. As for Adium, GAIM or Trillian.

8. Vista has an integrated stickynote app for sidebar, Windows Media Center which can replace iPhoto, Windows Calender to replace iCal and TimeMachine is a waste of space in my personal opinion. Thats not to say I cant appreciate that some people would find it useful.

9. Apart from the registry, all those apps are contained in the control panel - whats wrong with that?
And, in any case, the access to the registry gives a flexibility to tweaking programs that you dont get on a mac.

10. *cough iTunes cough*. And the key is just that - Brand name PC's. Thats not Windows Dan, thats the PC manufacturors.

11. Look on sourceforge for a screencapture utility. Get RKLauncher (from sourceforge), its a better version of the mac dock for windows. As for quicklook, I must be odd in that I can wait 8 seconds for Word or acrobat to Open. And windows can view most images.

12. As for this, Viruses that target Macs have existed since 2006 (http://www.sophos.com/pressoffice/news/articles/2006/02/macosxleap.html) All macs do is lull you into a false sense of security. And you dont have to pay annual subscription on ZoneAlarm, Spybot and Avast!.

13. Hey ive got a point for mac? How about the MacBook Air, with its whole army of ONE USB port. Or OSX's inability to play any decent games? Thats pretty lame to me.

14. You say that OSX has a better command shell than Windows. Right after saying that average users [i.e. not power user's] cant even download 3rd part apps. Well im sure these users will harness the power of the OSX command shell. And Windows users have free development languages in programs like SharpDevelop, VB.net Express etc which is much more powerfull that the apple command line. And windows has Photoshop CS4.

15. And Windows is harder to share files with?



26 November 2008, 4:53 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Papa-Raboon (New user):

@Information Overlord

"A few points I disagree with... "
Good for you IO we are all entitled to our opinions on the web so lets see what you wrote that I disagree with :-)

"6. Its pretty easy to troubleshoot windows too - and if you dont know your way around, there are plenty of free apps and/or support communities to help you out."
I would wholeheartedly disagree with you on that. Registry troubles are something you would need a very experienced Windows tech to sort out and if you get it wrong you need to format and re-nstall everything including windows and that requires a phone call to MS WGA team to re-authenticate. What if it happens out of working hours with a tight deadline to get finished.

Macs rarely go wrong software wise. They used to with OS 9 and you used to have extension conflicts to deal with but not with the OS X UNIX 03 core. I really cannot remember a time when I had to troubleshoot OS X except for when I bought some cheap RAM that didn't show up. The Mac still worked though. It just didn't show the RAM. And I have had two hard drives that wore ou. The first was a pig and I lost loads because I wasn't using a backup utility. The second was completely recoverable due to using Time Machine. I restored from it and voila! I was back up and running.

"TimeMachine is a waste of space in my personal opinion. Thats not to say I cant appreciate that some people would find it useful."
Thank you, I certainly did. Good luck when your drive goes down :-)

"9. Apart from the registry, all those apps are contained in the control panel - whats wrong with that? "

Yeah, the author wasn't very clear on one point here which is obvious from your comment. To add and remove programs on Windows you have to use installers and un-installers or the "Add and remove programs" utility and it generally sprays stuff all over your hard drive .dll files, additions to the registry. Now that's fine if done properly but if the un-installer is badly coded (it happens more often than people admit) you still end up with fragments of code and registry additions which eventually cause issues and turn your once speed demon into a dog slow PC. I know many people who format and re-build their hard drives either every 6 months or every year.

To install Mac apps you just have to drag them to the Applications folder and to un-install then you just have to drag them to the trash and empty it. Occasionally you get an installer which gives you an App in the Applications folder and folder of libraries in the "Application Support" folder that is clearly named and easily removed but they are for code that is commonly used by a suite of programs like Adobe CS3. It's not system level stuff and therefore doesn't affect system performance. And there is no registry to bugger up. Mac Apps are pretty much self contained. So you really don't need to troubleshoot OS X in the sense you need to troubleshoot Windows.

"And, in any case, the access to the registry gives a flexibility to tweaking programs that you dont get on a mac."

You need to tweak Windows registry in order to make it work properly? OMG

"10. *cough iTunes cough*. "
*cough Media Centre cough" your point is?

"And the key is just that - Brand name PC's. Thats not Windows Dan, thats the PC manufacturors. "

If we're talking about Mr or Mrs average's first PC buying experience then the author's comment here is valid. You do get a lot of crapware to remove with a brand name PC. Demo apps etc.

Now back to iTunes. It's a fine piece of software and don't let anyone tell you different without explaining why they think that. iTunes is not a demo demo application. I use it every day and it works perfectly and is easy to use too. I'll go as far as saying it's integration with airtunes, the iPod and the AppleTV are amazing. I can totally control my Mac's iTunes upstairs over WiFi with my iPhone and hear the tunes on our Hifi which is plugged into the audio output of our Airport Express router that communicates with our Airport Extreme router upstairs again over WiFi. It was a synch to set up too. I can stream movies seamlessly over WiFi from iTunes to our AppleTV plugged into 1080i on our 42" LCD TV. And do that with all the Macs in our house. All with a tiny little remote control. It's very transparent to use. iTunes is awesome! Do all that with WinAmp!!!


"11. Look on sourceforge for a screencapture utility. Get RKLauncher (from sourceforge), its a better version of the mac dock for windows."

I thought we were talking about Windows here. Is RKLauncher included with Vista?
Don't see the point here, you are saying they copied the OS X dock and that in some ways makes Windows better? I'm sure if you think there are better features in RKLauncher that someone could make the same or an even better app for OS X. In fact there have been many dock extensions made by third party devs over the years. What's your point?


"As for quicklook, I must be odd in that I can wait 8 seconds for Word or acrobat to Open. And windows can view most images."

Quicklook is instantaneous. So lets say you were going into a meeting in five minutes and needed to quickly review a bunch of media that you only got a few minutes ago off a colleague on a USB stick. You have an audio file (any format) a spreadsheet, a word document a couple of images and a movie all in the same folder. In Leopard you highlight the first document (an image) and click the quicklook button at the top of the finder window. Your image instantly appears. You can press your down arrow (or use your mouse) and your spreadsheet appears. It's multipage? No problem you can view them all in full screen if you want. You arrow down to your Word Doc, same thing, just appears. You go down to your audio file and it starts playing through your speakers. You arrow down to the movie and it starts playing, with sound. You also have a full set of standard controls for movies and audio and can bring a bunch of thumbnails up of any type in a folder if you want to use that as well. All instant. Your Windows using colleague in the meantime is waiting for all of those Apps to load and has a memory issue (not enough to run all of those apps on his laptop). So he has to close each app after he has loaded it to open the next one. He gets 2 - 3 minutes to review and you get the full 5 minutes in Leopard. Quicklook not that useful eh? I use it all the time!

12. As for this, Viruses that target Macs have existed since 2006 (http://www.sophos.com/pressoffice/news/articles/2006/02/macosxleap.html) All macs do is lull you into a false sense of security. And you dont have to pay annual subscription on ZoneAlarm, Spybot and Avast!.

Well please can you tell me of an OS X user who has actually had this virus or any other virus in the wild. (0 - 49 users apparently and it caused no damage). It's as easy to catch as a flying wet bar of soap in a shower, as dangerous as a common cold and as prolific as a "penny black" stamp. And contrary to popular belief it is not technically a virus as a virus requires zero human intervention. You want to read a true recount of the Leap-A "virus"? Here is one and links to a few more are at the bottom.
http://www.creativetechs.com/tips/quicktips_83-special.html

Just because XP and Vista are as virulent as a whores drawers doesn't mean other OS's are so full of holes they need virus checkers. On OS X you don't even need a firewall but you get one free with it anyway. Just in case you are used to using windows and have become neurotic because of it.

13. Hey ive got a point for mac? How about the MacBook Air, with its whole army of ONE USB port.

Macbook Air is thin, very light, well built and perfect for a road warrior who needs to travel light. And USB ports. I never use them with laptops. I do with desktops. I have 5 Macs and there is plenty of choice. Sometimes extra ports are a waste of space, weight and time. My Mac Pro has 5 USB ports and I can make it 6 when I plug my keyboard into one of them as it has two USB ports itself. Weak argument. You get two USB ports on the other Mac Laptops. Not that I ever use them.

"Or OSX's inability to play any decent games? Thats pretty lame to me."

Emmm. That's down to the manufacturers of the games isn't it?
If you spend all of your time playing games then you may as well get a console. How about an XBox 360. I hear they've so far made several $billion loss on that they need to sell more. You love Microsoft that much, go buy one!

"14. You say that OSX has a better command shell than Windows."

It does, it's UNIX 03 certified!

"Right after saying that average users [i.e. not power user's] cant even download 3rd part apps."

What on Windows do you mean? Because these third party apps might contain malware? Good point, finally talking sense. When you getting your first Mac then? :-)

"Well im sure these users will harness the power of the OSX command shell."

Well my 69 year old father won't that's for sure. But I log into Linux Boxes at a data centre in London every day using the Terminal app on my Mac and I also occasionally install and configure PHP, MySQL and Apache on various OS X boxes as well and it helps to have a good command shell if you want to perform custom configurations. ./configure, make, make install. It's UNIX. And to a power user like me it's useful. If I had to do the same things on Windows I would have to slum it with a DOS like command prompt Uuggghhh!

"And Windows users have free development languages in programs like SharpDevelop, VB.net Express etc which is much more powerfull that the apple command line."

Uuh! Command line terminals and IDE/Debugger environments are totally different things. Apple gives you Xcode Free on a Mac. You can develop with a ton of languages out of the box and code for the iPhone and iPod touch too. A lucrative market by the way.

"And windows has Photoshop CS4."
So does Mac, What's your point? And I've been using Photoshop since version 1.0. You haven't (unless you had a Mac) Photoshop 1.0 was released in 1990 for Macintosh exclusively.[5] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adobe_Photoshop (Last sentence of second paragraph).

How much did MS pay you to write this FUD anyway IO?

26 November 2008, 9:25 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

InformationOverlord (New user):

@Papa-Raboon:

"I would wholeheartedly disagree with you on that. Registry troubles are something you would need a very experienced Windows tech to sort out"

You are embarrassing yourself here, Papa-Raboon, with your obviously limited knowledge of windows. How you can say you need an experienced Windows tech to double click on a .reg file and hit OK I dont know. And if that fails, www.crossloop.com will get the problem sorted.

"Macs rarely go wrong software wise"

Maybe they don't. I dont use macs very often so I wont comment (obviously a view you dont subscribe to). But I can say that my windows PC very rarely has a problem too.

re TimeMachine "Thank you, I certainly did. Good luck when your drive goes down :-)"

Well, I have a RAID 1 setup so I can easily restore data if any problems occur. So thanks for wishing me luck, but I wont need it.

"Now that's fine if done properly but if the un-installer is badly coded (it happens more often than people admit) you still end up with fragments of code and registry additions which eventually cause issues and turn your once speed demon into a dog slow PC"

And that is the fault of Microsoft how? Add/Remove programs just executes the uninstaller script bundled with the program. Macs can have that problem too - its up to the developer.

"You need to tweak Windows registry in order to make it work properly? OMG"

Did I say that? I said it gives you more flexibility, which it does. You only have to look at tools like tweakXP to realise that. The apps will still run fine, but power-users can excercise a greater level of control.

"*cough Media Centre cough" your point is?"
At least media-centre doesnt load on startup and waste PC resources. It also isn't plastered with advertising.

"If we're talking about Mr or Mrs average's first PC buying experience then the author's comment here is valid. You do get a lot of crapware to remove with a brand name PC. Demo apps etc."

Well we are discussing windows and OSX, not Dell/HP/Compaq and Apple.

" I can stream movies seamlessly over WiFi from iTunes to our AppleTV plugged into 1080i on our 42" LCD TV. And do that with all the Macs in our house. All with a tiny little remote control. It's very transparent to use. iTunes is awesome! Do all that with WinAmp!!!"

I can use my $249 D-Link DSM-320 to do the same thing for $100 less

"I thought we were talking about Windows here. Is RKLauncher included with Vista?
Don't see the point here, you are saying they copied the OS X dock and that in some ways makes Windows better?"

I personally dont use it - what I am saying is that its an option for those who find it preferable.

"Quicklook is instantaneous. So lets say you were going into a meeting in five minutes and needed to quickly review a bunch of media that you only got a few minutes ago off a colleague on a USB stick. You have an audio file (any format) a spreadsheet, a word document a couple of images and a movie all in the same folder... Your Windows using colleague in the meantime is waiting for all of those Apps to load and has a memory issue (not enough to run all of those apps on his laptop). So he has to close each app after he has loaded it to open the next one. He gets 2 - 3 minutes to review and you get the full 5 minutes in Leopard. Quicklook not that useful eh? I use it all the time!"

I just pulled out a stopwatch. Picture/Fax viewer - 0.4 seconds. Word - 1.1 seconds. Media Player - 3.8 seconds. Excel - 1.3 seconds. Last time i checked that doesnt add to 2 minutes.

"Just because XP and Vista are as virulent as a whores drawers doesn't mean other OS's are so full of holes they need virus checkers. On OS X you don't even need a firewall but you get one free with it anyway"

You get a firewall with windows too. And I have a windows PC, used it for 2 years with no Anti-Virus (i'd prefer not to have the performance impact) and have not got a virus yet. As long as you dont download dodgy torrents etc, Windows systems are fine.

"Macbook Air is thin, very light, well built and perfect for a road warrior who needs to travel light. And USB ports. I never use them with laptops. I do with desktops. I have 5 Macs and there is plenty of choice. Sometimes extra ports are a waste of space, weight and time"

Perfect for a road warror? I would think that Wireless Broadband would be nice? Oh well, there goes your single USB port. And a slow 4200RPM iPod drive as a system drive with a measly 80GB? Not going to fit too much on that. Of course, you could take an external harddrive but oh wait - that sort of ruins the point of a small notebook and you cant have your broadband and your external HDD at the same time. As for extra ports being a waste of space, weight and time, They use maybe 1 sq. cm for 2 (1 on top of the other), they might add a gram or two and just how do they waste time?

"If you spend all of your time playing games then you may as well get a console. How about an XBox 360. I hear they've so far made several $billion loss on that they need to sell more. You love Microsoft that much, go buy one!"

I dont spend all my time playing games. I would just appreciate being able to load a decent looking game when I feel like it. As for loving microsoft, I dont. I have a PS3, not a 360. I can just appreciate that they have a good OS, much better than Apple fanbois would have you believe.

"What on Windows do you mean? Because these third party apps might contain malware? Good point, finally talking sense. When you getting your first Mac then? :-)"

At least I dont have to misinterpret comments to come up with a 'retort'.

"But I log into Linux Boxes at a data centre in London every day using the Terminal app on my Mac and I also occasionally install and configure PHP, MySQL and Apache on various OS X boxes as well and it helps to have a good command shell if you want to perform custom configurations. ./configure, make, make install. It's UNIX. And to a power user like me it's useful. If I had to do the same things on Windows I would have to slum it with a DOS like command prompt Uuggghhh!"

Thats what registry scripts (.reg files) are for. Custom configurations.

"How much did MS pay you to write this FUD anyway IO?"

Nothing. All I can say is that at least I dont have to resort to off-topic attacks to get my point across.

27 November 2008, 5:27 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Papa-Raboon (New user):

@InformationOverlord
"You are embarrassing yourself here, Papa-Raboon, with your obviously limited knowledge of windows."

Of course it's limited. I only use Windows for testing web dev work in IE 6 & 7. I mainly go by what I hear from the Windows users I know and what I find with a google search. You'd have to pay me to regularly use Windows and even then I would boot up a Mac or Ubuntu box once your back is turned :-)

"How you can say you need an experienced Windows tech to double click on a .reg file and hit OK I dont know. And if that fails, www.crossloop.com will get the problem sorted."

Went to www.crossloop.com Seems you have to pay to join and you get to chat to people on the net who can help you. Sounds great but lets say you were installing a ton of software on your PC and you get a power failure half way through. You re-start your PC and get a blue screen. You try to hit F8 0n startup to choose the option to go back to your last working Windows configuration and you're the unlucky 1 out of 10 that it doesn't work for so you are left dead in the water. (if you actually know to hit F8).

So you can't boot up and it's your only computer. How can you get onto www.crossloop.com to ask for advice?

Regarding the Windows registry. Here is a website (one of many) that says putting the configuration settings for everything in one file is a dumb idea. http://www.codinghorror.com/blog/archives/000939.html
If you search for Macs and OS X in the comments you will see nothing but praise for the way Apple implemented application preferences and nothing but disgust for the way Microsoft implemented the registry. These are mainly Windows programmers commenting.

"Maybe they don't. I dont use macs very often so I wont comment (obviously a view you dont subscribe to). But I can say that my windows PC very rarely has a problem too."

Fair enough. But you commented negatively on Time Machine and quick look! Things you know either little or nothing about. But my point is, once you have a problem with Windows it can mean you're down for the count. It's fairly easy to break if you tinker and don't know what you are doing. A friend of mine is a self employed PC trouble-shooter and he is always going out fixing people's Windows boxes for a fee. He makes a fortune because of the issues people have with Windows. OS X is a cleaner tighter more secure OS so it's harder harder to mess up. EG, you need to know the root password to get edit or delete the system files like any UNIX or UNIX based OS.

"Well, I have a RAID 1 setup so I can easily restore data if any problems occur. So thanks for wishing me luck, but I wont need it."

Good for you, but your original comment was that Time Machine was a waste of space in your opinion. So how is this different to implementing RAID 1. They both use a big chunk of external drive space. Thing is, Time Machine is a no brainer to set up and restore from. Your granny could figure it out. Just plug in an external drive and OS X asks you if you want to use the drive as a Time Machine backup drive. You say yes and you're done. It backs up everything unless you go into the preferences and select things you don't want to back up. That's it. Good luck to the PC newbie who has just bought their shiny new dell box and a RAID 1 system setting it up. Might need to ring a techie for help (at a cost).

"And that is the fault of Microsoft how? Add/Remove programs just executes the uninstaller script bundled with the program. Macs can have that problem too - its up to the developer."

Really? to uninstall 99.9% of software on a Mac you just have to drop the App in the trash and empty it. And on the other .01% you can do that too but you might be left with a folder in Application Support which you can either trash or not. It doesn't affect the system if you leave it.

"You need to tweak Windows registry in order to make it work properly? OMG"

Did I say that? I said it gives you more flexibility, which it does. You only have to look at tools like tweakXP to realise that. The apps will still run fine, but power-users can excercise a greater level of control.

On a Mac you go 'Application menu -> preferences' and set the preferences to give you more control. It amends the applications preferences file to new settings. If the application fricks up for some reason you can trash that file and a new default one is created. Been like that since Macs were created.

"*cough Media Centre cough" your point is?"
At least media-centre doesnt load on startup and waste PC resources. It also isn't plastered with advertising.

Neither does iTunes on the Mac. I presume that it loads Apple software update on Windows at startup so you know whether there is an update for iTunes, Quicktime or Safari.

"Well we are discussing windows and OSX, not Dell/HP/Compaq and Apple."

But can you run Mac OS X on anything other than a Mac (not legally anyway) and also can you run Windows on your toaster or Doovde player? Nope, so Windows is useless without a PC and if you buy a cheap one your Windows experience is marred with the inclusion on your shiny new Acer of a ton of crapware. Which is often hard to delete. And it's Microsoft's fault for their business model. It's an OEM OS and the PC manufacturers have to pay a licence fee for it so to make any decent profit on their cheap and cheerful lines they have to offset the cost of the 'doze licence with the cash they get from crapware suppliers. If they used Linux they would make enough profit not to have to install stupid demo software.

"I can use my $249 D-Link DSM-320 to do the same thing for $100 less"

But can you use your phone to view your albums, artists, playlists etc and turn the volume up and down, play pause etc over your TV and HiFi viewing stuff on your PC's WMC from your bathroom over Wi-Fi. For no extra fee? Quickly, and easily with multi-touch?

"Quicklook is instantaneous. So lets say you were going into a meeting in five minutes and needed to quickly review a bunch of media that you only got a few minutes ago off a colleague on a USB stick. You have an audio file (any format) a spreadsheet, a word document a couple of images and a movie all in the same folder... Your Windows using colleague in the meantime is waiting for all of those Apps to load and has a memory issue (not enough to run all of those apps on his laptop). So he has to close each app after he has loaded it to open the next one. He gets 2 - 3 minutes to review and you get the full 5 minutes in Leopard. Quicklook not that useful eh? I use it all the time!"

"I just pulled out a stopwatch. Picture/Fax viewer - 0.4 seconds. Word - 1.1 seconds. Media Player - 3.8 seconds. Excel - 1.3 seconds. Last time i checked that doesnt add to 2 minutes."

I can do that on y Mac but you're missing the point. You still have to navigate the apps and their different interfaces. If you're in a bit rush it can be flustering. Especially if you're under pressure or a client is looking over your shoulder and wants a quick answer or you are on the phone and someone wants the same from you.

I used to do it your way on my Mac before Leopard and it feels less stressful now. You're just being stubborn on this one. You know jolly well it would be useful if Windows had an equivalent. My PC using friends are always impressed with it.

You don't even have to use Quick Look either. If you are in cover flow view in a Finder window you can peruse the stuff with virtually as much control in a smaller (resizable) area at the top of the window.

"You get a firewall with windows too. And I have a windows PC, used it for 2 years with no Anti-Virus (i'd prefer not to have the performance impact) and have not got a virus yet. As long as you dont download dodgy torrents etc, Windows systems are fine."

So how do you know if a torrent is dodgy or not?
I download torrents with impunity. TV progs mainly. Never worry what might be contained in them. So without a virus checker on Windows you either avoid torrents completely or play Russian Roulette with your system.

"Perfect for a road warror? I would think that Wireless Broadband would be nice? Oh well, there goes your single USB port. And a slow 4200RPM iPod drive as a system drive with a measly 80GB? Not going to fit too much on that."

You get either a 120Gb SATA drive or a fast 128Gb SSD. 80Gb? That's old news. And if that's not enough for you you can get a MacBook or a MacBook Pro. And I thought we were talking Windows and OS X. You brought up the MBA first. Breaking your own rules here me thinks!

"I would just appreciate being able to load a decent looking game when I feel like it."

And you can on a Mac. You can get a lot of good games apparently. I don't play games as I use my machine for serious work and web surfing but here is a list: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Mac_OS_X_games. Not sure how up to date it is.

If you can't get what you want on that list then you can always boot into XP with Boot camp and play them on Windows if you are that desperate.

"As for loving microsoft, I dont. I have a PS3, not a 360. I can just appreciate that they have a good OS, much better than Apple fanbois would have you believe."

See, that's what pisses me off. "Apple Fanboys"!!!

We use the Mac because we choose to. Most of us have used Windows or have to use it at our place of work. Many of us know both systems equally well because we have to but 99.9% of us prefer the Mac. And around 50% of New Mac buyers are Windows switchers.

Most Windows sufferers have little or no experience using Macs and still comment negatively against the Mac and OS X. Even though they don't know what they are talking about. I build websites and every day I have to test my sites in IE6 and IE7. I don't use a website to do it as I need to do it right away so I use VMware and XP. So I do use Windows to an extent every day and I have reasonable experience with it from Jobs I have had in the past. I'm so glad I don't need to use that crap all the time.

"What on Windows do you mean? Because these third party apps might contain malware? Good point, finally talking sense. When you getting your first Mac then? :-)"

At least I dont have to misinterpret comments to come up with a 'retort'.

Witty retorts aside. You suggested that Mac users in general won't know how to download software. Most Mac users happily download whatever they like. Many Windows users hold back as they are afraid as to what way the software they download will affect their system. I know several Window users that have their system carefully set up working optimally and will not consider downloading or installing anything else just in case it slows down or buggers up their PC. That is a typical mindset of the average Windows user. Mainly indoctrinated by draconian rules set down by their IT departments at work.

As for the typical Mac user who uses Macs atwork. Well all the graphic design companies I have dealt with over the years are happy to let their employees install any shareware or open source software on their Macs that they like if it will help them get their job done more efficiently and quickly.

"But I log into Linux Boxes at a data centre in London every day using the Terminal app on my Mac and I also occasionally install and configure PHP, MySQL and Apache on various OS X boxes as well and it helps to have a good command shell if you want to perform custom configurations. ./configure, make, make install. It's UNIX. And to a power user like me it's useful. If I had to do the same things on Windows I would have to slum it with a DOS like command prompt Uuggghhh!"

Thats what registry scripts (.reg files) are for. Custom configurations. I know that but if the registry gets corrupt you have a chance that you will have to do a re-install.

"How much did MS pay you to write this FUD anyway IO?"

Nothing. All I can say is that at least I dont have to resort to off-topic attacks to get my point across.

What way did I attack you. You just called me a fanboy!

Anyway. I have much work to do.

I bid you good day and hope that one day you will get the chance to experience computing free from the bonds of Microsoft.

28 November 2008, 12:34 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Anonymousewiuu2945u389 (User):

Quoting Papa-Raboon:
I can do that on y Mac but you're missing the point. You still have to navigate the apps and their different interfaces. If you're in a bit rush it can be flustering. Especially if you're under pressure or a client is looking over your shoulder and wants a quick answer or you are on the phone and someone wants the same from you.

Do you really believe that Windows does't have a quicklook equivalent? I'm fairly sure that if you just go Organise->Layout->Preview Pane, you just get some space on the right hand side of Explorer where a document/picture/media controls/whatever appears when you select a file. It might not be as elegant as Quick Look, but saying you have to load all the individual programs on Windows is just complete ignorance.




05 March 2010, 9:57 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Truckasauras (New user):

I don't really see how anyone can ultimately prove that one is "better" than the other. It's like trying to justify why Strawberry ice-cream is better then Chocolate ice-cream. Ultimately it's a matter of preference.

27 November 2008, 9:13 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (New user):

Quoting Truckasauras:
It's like trying to justify why Strawberry ice-cream is better then Chocolate ice-cream.

Now you've done it, wait for the chocolate fan boy to come out and defend their honour, while branding you a heretic and self appointed forum moderator.


27 November 2008, 9:18 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

joey blades (New user):

Your 14th point touches on it, but doesn't capture it fully. Maybe it's just the engineering geek in me and doesn't apply to the mainstream, but...

One of the main reasons I like the Mac OS is that, behind all the glitter and gold, there's unix and all that comes with that. People that care about such things appreciate that you don't have to install cheap and flakey imitators of things like grep, emacs, perl, c, X11, ssh, find, diff, curl, etc., etc. ...

05 December 2008, 5:42 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

shrike (New user):

I just wanted to say well done to Dan for a well researched and objective article, and while most Windows devotees won't understand it I definitely share your point of view. I have been using a mac for the last 2 years, and after a lifetime of Windows experience I now couldn't bare the thought of running it at home again.

06 December 2008, 11:06 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

lawrencemach8er (New user):

My pc OS came clean no trial software, My mac came with ilife 30 day trial, 1 year mobile me. My mac has beachballed and crashed comming out of sleep, anyway i prefer hibernation on my windows laptop it does not use any battery. You need virus protection on a mac i use etrust which is very primitive and count not clean an itunes virus. At a hacking convention they hacked the mac in 5 minuets and it took 2 days to hack vista after they installed 3rd party apps and one had a back door. I boot vista in 5 seconds my mac will take at least 12 seconds to get to log in screen. I love leds my custom computer case it lit with blue leds looks way better than that steal mac pro. You can run OSX on pc but there is no need, you would not want to, and if apple found out they would search and destroy you with lawyers that will cost more than the case. File sharing over a network is easier on my pc i have one shortcut no need to connect to servers or any other rubbish you just drag and drop files.

07 December 2008, 1:05 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

UbiquitousGeek (New user):

Lie much?

PCs only come clean when you install plain old Windows from scratch. iLife is not a trial. It's free, on every Mac. The difference between the trial of iWork and the trials that come on a PC is that all you have to do is drag iWork to the trash. With PCs, shovelware throws files all over your hard drive.

Crashed coming out of sleep? Horse crap. I never shut down my Mac, I only put it to sleep. Haven't had a single problem. Vista, on the other hand, has crashed on waking up.

Virus protection is primitive because we don't fricking need it. The jackasses at the convention had plenty of time to prepare for this "hack" ahead of time. Not only that, but they weren't using the stock drivers that are used by Apple. I can bust into a Windows PC in less than two minutes. It's stupid simple.

What the hell is the point of LEDs? Somehow that makes a PC better? Anyone can mod a Mac, same as a PC.

OS X will never be licensed for PCs. If there weren't such an interest in running OS X on PCs, OSX86 wouldn't exist. Unfortunately for you're ignorant argument, there are a lot of people who'd love to run OS X on their PCs, more so than there are people wanting to run Windows on their Macs.

File sharing is easier!? Now I know you're a lying sack of crap. With Leopard, I don't even need a shortcut, it just connects to all of my networked machines automatically, without my needing to tell it to. You don't have to connect to servers? Really, genius? How the hell can you access servers without connecting to them? Some sort of PC fanboy magic? Get real. Vista is nowhere near as "drag and drop" as OS X.

It's painfully obvious that you're an idiot. You're either a pathological liar or you've never spent more than ten minutes on a real Mac.

07 December 2008, 11:55 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

lawrencemach8er (New user):

Mac's are slower yet more expensive. Macs still need to run virus but still fail to clean itunes virus's you pick up in .mp3 files. I boot vista in under 5 seconds on a Hot day. I book OSX in 12 seconds on a cold day. I get ilife 30 day trial on mac. I get only the drivers and a kick ass media center which is better than iphoto and all the mac crap. CMD still better than terminal, terminal is only good on linux, mac OSX has restricted a lot of features in the terminal. I can install OSX on my pc but linux/xp/vista is the best combo mac OSX is a waste. It is no easier to troubleshoot macs they will suddenly crash and you are like WTF happened, I have only ever once crashed a PC because of the wrong graphic card driver so i used the generic intel graphics and installed the correct driver as the blue screen told me it was the driver that was stuffed.

MACS are not better

07 December 2008, 1:13 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

UbiquitousGeek (New user):

More lies?

Slower? Rubbish. Macs don't get viruses from MP3 files, that's a Windows thing. Only Windows and it's ignorant users can be fooled into mistaking an executable for an MP3. Vista does not, under any circumstances, boot in five seconds and it certainly doesn't boot faster than a Mac, especially from sleep mode. Again, iLife is not a trial! It's free on every Mac. Plain and simple. It's been that way for years. Media Center is better than iPhoto? iPhoto, for one, isn't for presenting media. It's for collecting, organizing and editing photos, as well as ordering prints, photo books and making slideshows. The terminal is "restricted"? WTF? You've never heard of SUDO!? Easier to troubleshoot!?!?!? ROFL! Never heard of the console? It tells you everything that's happened, in a human readable form, not some coded gibberish like Windows. Saying that you've never had a crash in Windows is like saying that you've never had to breathe. We don't have to wait for a kernel panic before we know what's wrong.



07 December 2008, 12:08 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

NetR@nger (New user):

Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
Only Windows and it's ignorant users

Ok,first of all its a windows world,deal with it.And WHO are you calling ignorant,you stupid fool?.Do you hold a PHD in astro-physics??,I do.Do u hold a diploma in I.T??,I do.I work on and fly machines that would turn your town into a ash cloud in less then 10 minutes.We have hundreds of computers around here and not a mac in sight,so it would seem that at the pointy end of things,you dont really have any idea at all.So please engage your brain before posting your fanboy mac garbage here,because when the crap hits the fan in this country,your going to be glad that windows has the stick.


10 December 2008, 7:13 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

UbiquitousGeek (New user):

It's also a George W. Bush world (for the moment), but that doesn't mean we have to like it. For someone who holds a P.H.D., you're sentence structure is terrible. Punctuation missing or in places it doesn't need to be...

Yeah, I always knew a Windows machine would destroy the planet.

After seeing how Windows can leave me sitting at the B.M.V. for five hours, I really don't want a Windows machine to be responsible for national security. I bet Windows "had the stick" on 9/11, too, right?

10 December 2008, 10:59 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Truckasauras (New user):

Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
I bet Windows "had the stick" on 9/11, too, right?

Mate you're just a tool. Yes, we're all thinking this.

11 December 2008, 1:51 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

UbiquitousGeek (New user):

I'm sorry, but what was your argument? What's with this "we" crap? Do you have a mouse in your pocket? Did you have something to say about Windows' security?

Yeah, when I hear "security", I think Windows. (That's sarcasm, in case you're a little low on grey matter.)



11 December 2008, 2:33 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Truckasauras (New user):

Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
I'm sorry, but what was your argument?

There is no argument. It is a statement of fact, you're a tool. Your using of the 9/11 tragedy to support your argument on which is a better OS was stupid, plain and simple.

11 December 2008, 3:49 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Bradley Anm (New user):

I love my Mac. I dont want to go back. Its so sexy. And Light. And Little. And Simple

09 December 2008, 11:04 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

InformationOverlord (New user):

Well im sure a Mac could a saved the Twintowers on 9/11... not

10 December 2008, 3:31 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Truckasauras (New user):

Here's a well written piece on the Mac vs. MS flame wars:

http://www.smh.com.au/news/digital-life/laptops/articles/whats-so-great-about-macs/2008/12/09/1228584827312.html?page=fullpage#contentSwap1

Well writtten imo.

11 December 2008, 12:06 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

germloucks (New user):

I think you missed the bullseye on a lot of your points.

1) Viruses. XP- HUGE problem. Vista? Not really. Reason? Vista default user accounts dont have administrative rights, via the user account control. Very similar in function to Linux. I've had vista for about 1 year now, and have found about 10 viruses total. Most virus infections come from ignorant users INSTALLING viruses from emails, or browsing porn. No more magical "where the hell did that come from" virus infections with Vista. (XP, it happens all the time)

2) Neat and contained settings manager. You mentioned the registry, and hardware manager as things that arent centralized. 99.99% of windows users never mess with that crap. Messing with the registry is a death wish in the first place.

3) Easier to troubleshoot MACs. I disagree. For the expert MAC user perhaps, but MAC OS has nowhere near the same capabilities for OS troubleshooting that Vista does. (I used to train tech support on vista troubleshooting, i AM an expert on this.)

4) Software/Hardware compatability. the Number one reason people dont buy MACs. For the MAC power user this wont be a problem. But can you imagine Grandma Daisy trying to tweak her windows emulator? I think not. Oh it so easy! Not when you just learned how to use a mouse! With PCs being as cheap as they are, we've seen a huge surge in first-time computer purchases. Most see the MAC as intimidating, and cumbersome.

5) Screenshot abilities? Come now, thats a bit overreaching there. What possible function do you absolutely NEED a well made screenshot tool? If you have gone to all the trouble to learn the commands to make a screenshot the way you want, you could have pressed PRNT SCRN, pasted into paint, and cut the portion out you needed.

6) Blinking lights? Come on now. Thats only a factor with laptops, and most laptop models ive seen have 8-10. Including caps/num/scroll locks. I DOUBT that is intimidating to anyone.

7) Boot times. Yes a problem with Vista users with bare-bones systems they bought for 500$ that has 1GB of crapRAM. My system boots to an operational desktop in 30 seconds flat. Its simply a matter of hardware requirements.... NOT a deficiency of Windows Vista.

8) The differences between MAC OS command prompt and the Windows one is a matter of PREFERENCE, nothing more. And tell me how often you use your command prompt? I cant think of a single example of why an average user would ever use their command prompt. I can guarantee most don't even know they have one.

9) Apple uses quality parts. I believe you were discussing Windows VS MAC, not PC manufacturers VS Apple. Microsoft does not manufacture PCs. This goes for your "blinking lights of doom" argument also.


The rest i pretty much agreed with. Although some of your points were embellished a bit. Perhaps out of a bit of fan-boy-ism.


My main gripe with MACs are the lack of software support, combined with the total inability to upgrade your hardware. The 1200$ investment you make is permanent... MACs also don't have a very high resale value. The reason for that is, where do you go for repairs? PC users can take their PCs to any number of local repair shops present in almost every small town. MAC users have to get Apple to fix it.

Some of the main reasons i like Vista, is the vast ability of the operating system to repair itself. Microsoft made a lot of automated tools that fix software incompatability, boot problems, registry problems, and offer data backup/recovery options.



You might label me as a windows fan-boy, thats okay. I just want to make sure to represent the "other side" of this argument.

11 December 2008, 3:12 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

nippi (New user):

In my office, we buy dell laptops, and install osx on them.

all the power of a mac, for 2/3rds the price

its the operating system thats good, hardware is just hardware

18 December 2008, 3:50 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

nippi (New user):

i agree mac software is better, but hardware is just hardware, and being restricted by mac specs is crap.

in my office we buy pc hardware, and install mac software on it.

simple, cheaper, better

18 December 2008, 3:55 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Felicity (New user):

I can't believe Mac ppl are still trying to find stupid reasons to say Mac's are better. They are not - end of story. I converted to PC when Windows came on the market although I did have the old IBM 86 before my Mac. There is no going back to Mac now for me. I have a lot of friends with Macs and they always ask for help - sorry. I just buy good Toshiba's and run Microsoft products and don't have a worry.

26 December 2008, 8:39 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

zoots (New user):

I have to admit that I am amazed by the self serving and fatuous posts contained herein. I hear many posters who love the sound of their own keyboards...they seem lonely, frustrated and....angry? Why so aggrevated? Why so petulant? What do you have to prove? I have used Windows, I have used MACs, I am very much happier with MACs.....everything else is dross...Be sure to keep up the good work...I prefer to enjoy the sunshine, a good aperatif and the smooth skin of a woman

03 January 2009, 2:17 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

YourWorstNightmare (New user):

That was hilarious. I can give you one reason why Windows is better than Mac.
Steve Jobs, thats all that Mac has he goes and the empire crumbles. Mac is a cult not a corporate outfit. And might I ask where are the bloody games on the Mac. If it can't game it's worthless to loads of people.

09 January 2009, 4:34 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

gamebuster (New user):

[/end of writer's flame]
[my flame]
Most of the reasons are just "windows-hater-pronouncements".
The reasons are no facts.

Example 1:
"Rebooting a Windows PC can be such a painful experience that you really procrastinate doing it. Unless you're running on the highest spec hardware, Vista can take minutes to start up.

Mac OS X starts up from a cold boot in about 25 seconds on a current-gen MacBook Pro. As another journalist contributing to the discussion observed, this is not a faked boot speed, where the operating system maker has rushed to get the login window on screen, but delayed loading the rest of the OS. It's a genuine boot-to-usable-desktop time."

Windows Vista boots in no-time here, and YES, i have great hardware. If you have a crappy PC with tons of trash, it can and will take minutes to boot. But that is user-error, no windows vista "error". Mac's have their problems too.

Also,
it's just a fact: there is much, much, much more software available for use on windows than apple mac os. Also, if i want to run windows, i can run it on any PC. If i want to run mac os, i MUST buy an apple (or use hacks), not even mentioning the prices of apple's.

Windows is far from perfect, so is apple mac os.
windows is NOT better than apple's mac OS, but neither is mac OS X better than windows. Both windows and mac OS are UNIQUE in features and users. If you want to do boring money-making things, you'll probly use an apple, since its more "basic". Do you want a PC for the whole family with games etc, you better buy a PC.

Your 15 reasons are just "mac is better than windows and i will think up some reasons to convince you"-reasons.

The only reason that is absolutely true and valid is no.: 1. The sleep mode.

Btw, DO NOT COMPARE hardware with an OS. ALL reasons where you put in user-errors, variable environments and hardware are just useless. You should compare purely the Operating Systems itself.

You can't say: windows is worse than mac os because third-party hardware has blinking lights
that is the WORST reason i've ever read. I can install windows on an apple: no blinking lights.

PC != windows
APPLE MAC BOOK != MAC
SOFTWARE != HARDWARE

conclusion:
14/15 reasons are just rubbish.

You say "Whoah, hold up there, anonymous flamer.", but i think the only flamer here, is you.

example: the end: "On balance, though, Macs just let you get stuff done, whereas Windows computers constantly find ways of annoying you."

tssss

[/end of my flame]

12 January 2009, 12:40 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Anonymousewiuu2945u389 (User):

Quoting gamebuster:
"Rebooting a Windows PC can be such a painful experience that you really procrastinate doing it


Let's see:
1. Click start
2. Click the arrow next to the power controls (Vista/7) or Shut Down (XP and 2000)
3. Click restart
4. Wait a couple of minutes

Surely it isn't that painful as you suggest?
Besides, sleep mode still uses energy. Hibernate and shutdown don't. Oh, and the Macs I use often take an age to boot anyway

22 March 2010, 7:59 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Troels (New user):

I don't feel like this review or what you wanna call it, brings justice to the Windows 7 platform. The sleep mode works as good as on the Mac and boot times has decreased a lot. Quality of parts depends on the brand and model of your computer, but unlike the Mac, you can choose between a whole range of different types, shapes and sizes. The fact that you can upgrade all of your hardware in a desktop computer is a big plus and you don't have to spend two months salary to get a Mac Pro.
I'd still say, to all the Windows hates, they have to try out Windows 7.
If I won a million dollars, I'd go buy a Mac, but if you look at Cost vs. Specifications - the Mac would never be a good choice.
I love the design of the Mac and OS X and I love the user friendly applications included in iLife and the fact that the Mac has some solid software applications you can't find on the Windows platform like; Apple Logic (music production), Final Cut Pro (movie production) and more.
But then again, too expensive for my taste... I'll stick with my rock solid and fast Windows 7 laptop, I bought a year ago for about 700 dollars and it has the specs of a new 1299 dollar Macbook!

19 January 2009, 12:17 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

MacsDoHaveViruses (New user):

13. Macs do have viruses.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/12/02/apple_mac_av_advice/

This is nothing new. It is just the first time Apple have finally admitted it. There has been commercially available Mac virus software around for years.

30 January 2009, 5:57 AM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Jack Lim (New user):

I can't see any screw in iMac notebook, It is juz so cool!!
Until, I think, what happen if the iMac is faulty and I have files contain confidential information which I can't afford it to be exposed to anyone?
So well.. nahhh...let's go for other notebook. I juz need to choose it carefully out of so many vendors. Ohya.. I can choose, that's great.



06 February 2009, 2:36 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

MacsAreBad (New user):

In my opinion a lot of your argument is based around Mac's being more user-friendly, not stuffing up and the occasional time when they do its easy to find out whats causing it. For people who are useless with computers your argument is very strong and for complete computer dummies i suggest getting a mac. But for people who have half a brain and know what to do your argument is just crap. Get a good anti-virus protection (it isnt that bloody expensive). Ive been using my new custom-made PC for about a year now, i use Windows for the operating system, i have Bullguard AntiVirus protection and i've gotten 1 virus. I simply ran a scan and what do you know it fixed the virus. Also i was having certain graphics issues, grabbed a screw driver, unscrewed the tower took out the graphics card and had a look at it .. found out i had overused it and then bam replaced it and my graphics are working fine

MACS SUCK

13 April 2009, 8:30 PM (4 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

MacOnMyAss (New user):

No, but what you ARE saying is that "Macs are still(LOL) better than Windows PCs". Which is an outright lie. Not an exaggeration or overstatement, just a lie. I have been listening to this garbage for a long time now and am just so sick of it. Mac owners are like militant vegetarians these days. Come over to our side, our stuff just works better. It does magical "better than window's" stuff that we can't really quantify, but look, it's really pretty. That whole list of yours is a joke and you know it. If you don't know it, then you must live inside some kind of isolated mac community or something. You can not do anything on a mac that i can't do on a pc, period. Why is that? Because there are 9 times more pc users that's why. Someone will figure it out if it has any real world value.
I have people come to me everyday, right after their 1 1/2 hour "appointment" at the mac store. They all have that same gleam in their eyes. Like they just smoked a crack rock or something. I tell them, don't do it, whatever you do, just don't buy one. Buy anything else, here is a nice e-machine for eleven cents. JUST DON'T DO IT PLEASE! They just have to do it though, they can't help themselves. The desire to want to be different is just too strong.
Week or two later I get the inevitable calls. "Do you know how to fix X?" Yes, I do know how to fix X. Go buy a machine that runs the operating system that 90% of all computer users use. Then call me back if you have the same problem on that machine and I will fix it in 3 minutes over the phone. Or, I will refer you too a few billion people that can fix the issue. Oh, something broke? No problem, macs are easy to fix. Just put it in the box it came in and ship it back, there, all fixed. Why no, I don't know how to install that program on a mac. I am pretty sure you need to install windows on it first man. "Install windows on it?? Well then why the hell did I buy a mac"? I really don't know man... I really don't know.

27 May 2009, 8:11 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

texasboy1 (New user):

i dont care what any of you say, windows vista and ALL of their OS's are user friendly. thats why they are so famous. and the last thing i want is complications

29 May 2009, 9:45 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Georgiatch11 (New user):

very biased article. it also seems as if little or no research was put into this article. Most everything seems to be opinion based. the first reason you put down is not even true. Windows Vista and Windows 7 have a very reliable sleep mode that take little or no time at all to come out of. reason number 2 is also false, all my vista and windows 7 machines boot within 18-35 seconds and 2 of the computers are actually 4-5 years old and were no where near top of the line computers when i bought them. reason number 3 isn't exactly true either, macs may use quality parts but they always seem to be 3 to 4 months behind all the windows pc manufactures when it comes to parts and so you don't have the latest in the greatest running in your machine nor can you really update the parts in a mac like you can a pc so they aren't exactly great to keep for more than 5 years. Then theres reason 5, honestly on all my computers theres no more than 7 blinking lights the actually have a purpose and all the buttons are well placed. so maybe your talking about computers from about 10 years ago, but if i do recall macs and pcs were pretty ugly and so theres not really an arguement there. Reason 5. windows + osx might be awesome but when both systems actually store information in the ram so they can start up faster and run applications faster its not that great of a mix.. if your talking about using windows in Vmware its still not that great because you lose alot of performace. anyway I could continue going down each reason why you say macs are better than pc's but since I know it probably won't matter because your a MAC fanboy and probably think Steve Jobs is God.. there really is no reason to try and argue with you

03 June 2009, 8:42 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

funnybluehat (New user):

Its quite laughable how worked up people get about an article that's just trying to state the facts. Whether you have a PC or mac, I am sure you chose it because it works for you. I chose my computer because it works for me. in fact I applaud anyone who has backbone and can decide which machine they would like to interact with for the next few years. In the meantime, stick to your own and be glad to know that someone gives you a pat on the back for it. Oh, and those gifted few who have no lives or friends, have fun picking apart my post to make sure you have spotted every flaw in existence than tell everyone in all capital letters about how my argument was ill supported. Everyone is overjoyed to know that you have less of a life than the next person and because everyone has a heart wrenching affinity with have to scroll past each and every useless post. We appreciate your ignorant opinions greatly.

03 June 2009, 12:01 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Zac Jardine (New user):

Has anyone watched any of the latest movies? They all seem to use Macs and MacBooks.

25 June 2009, 2:45 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

bwkrazyness (New user):

what i don't understand is if you are an educated pc user you won't get viruses, but stupid people who do go to macs... why don't hackers switch to macs. cause 99% of apple users would get the virus(the 1% doesn't have internet)

08 July 2009, 11:38 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

bwkrazyness (New user):

what i don't understand is if you are an educated pc user you won't get viruses, but stupid people who do go to macs... why don't hackers switch to macs. cause 99% of apple users would get the virus(the 1% doesn't have internet)

08 July 2009, 11:39 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

bwkrazyness (New user):

what i don't understand is if you are an educated pc user you won't get viruses, but stupid people who do go to macs... why don't hackers switch to macs. cause 99% of apple users would get the virus(the 1% doesn't have internet)

08 July 2009, 11:39 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

bwkrazyness (New user):

eww... this is a liberal writer, see how the "fancy" mac is obama, and the "disgusting" pc is bush. bush was a great president, sure he spent alot but when all thoes liberal clones realize who they have been supporting it will have been too late. also flashing lights are good, and manufactures determine how many lights there are on the computers, not all pc's have them, but i guess that's too much for a mac fanboy to understand.

08 July 2009, 11:39 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Fashim (New user):

The boot with windows i think is much better because you can boot from multiple things like the Cd Drive or Usb Memory also that some things in the boot has saved my computer multiple times.

15 July 2009, 12:41 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Fashim (New user):

The Dual Operating System's is on Windows all you really have to do i partition and boot the OS cd then select the partition. But you really only get Windows and Linux cause macs dont sell there OS or you could have different versions of windows.

15 July 2009, 2:03 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Fashim (New user):

Windows doesn't come loaded with crap. When i got my PC i got some programs like a DVD player And like a virus scanning utility that was only like 80Mbs and theres always free virus scanners like Avast! And a
custom built PC doesnt get loaded up with crap.

15 July 2009, 2:19 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Fashim (New user):

Macs dont come with better hardware actually all they have that is better is the HDD. mac just think about like less wires and smaller when pc's are more like 4Gbs of ram Good craphics card Better CPU. But i guess PC's need it because they play games.

15 July 2009, 2:25 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

DENZO (New user):

I have a PC for home use, quad core with twin GTX260's, 4gb ram 1333mhz,and a 24inch monitor (XPS system).

And I have a macbook (unibody aluminium late '08 model, 2.4 ghz)

I love them both, never have a problem with either, and I use them both often.

I like the PC better for home use. I would not change over to MAC for home use. (gaming, and most video extensions I get in emails dont always play on mac unless I pay/upgrade the quicktime player - which I dont like).

Gaming is PC only, and upgradeability is better on PC by far. I like also how on PC things seem to be more readily available and usually via free download for example.

MAC is a better mobile computer I have found. It starts up QUICK. It has fantastic form. It is a genuine winner against most other mobile PC's in terms of battery power/on time. And it does not have to be in the form of a 7 inch computer either. It does so on a 13inch screen and above.
I love how I can get 4.5 hours of net surfing wireless on my mac. Other laptops I have had do not come close.

I like them both, and stick with my decisions. PC for home, Apple for mobile.



03 August 2009, 1:24 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

alex!1!! (New user):

One of the most stupid thing i never read! So funny to read a novice user writhing such rubbish! First, files sharing is very easy with Windows so i don't need more. Maybe you are just too "novice". Then Mac is not Linux, it's BSD moron! Mac can have virus! There is less than Windows but that's because it's less popular. Windows come with nothing more than Windows. It's your choice (or the OEM builder choice) to put crap on it. Uhh sorry ? Did you already hear about Control Pannel? I just don't care to have apps when i install my PC. I like to decide what im gonna put! If you want quality community software, then you are not a the good place. Go linux instead! By the way if you can't troubleshoot Windows, don't use a computer. Mac need to be able to run Windows because it is just INCOMPLETE! And you can run a Mac on PC based with OSX86. Ooo what the frick did you wroth here ahahahah! Don't like those light uhh? You can alway find PC without these light or unplug them! 25 second is just long to boot! My debian based machine boot in 13 seconds so ... But i know Windows is quite long to boot. Good quality parts ahahah ! : My PC is quality and it's not a mac. : Q6600 8800GT 4GB DDR2-800 500GB Hard drive. And i paid the half of a fricking Imac that is just 50% less powerful. frick sleep mode and shutdown! xD

06 September 2009, 7:44 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

alex!1!! (New user):

One of the most stupid thing i never read! So funny to read a novice user writhing such rubbish! First, files sharing is very easy with Windows so i don't need more. Maybe you are just too "novice". Then Mac is not Linux, it's BSD moron! Mac can have virus! There is less than Windows but that's because it's less popular. Windows come with nothing more than Windows. It's your choice (or the OEM builder choice) to put crap on it. Uhh sorry ? Did you already hear about Control Pannel? I just don't care to have apps when i install my PC. I like to decide what im gonna put! If you want quality community software, then you are not a the good place. Go linux instead! By the way if you can't troubleshoot Windows, don't use a computer. Mac need to be able to run Windows because it is just INCOMPLETE! And you can run a Mac on PC based with OSX86. Ooo what the frick did you wroth here ahahahah! Don't like those light uhh? You can alway find PC without these light or unplug them! 25 second is just long to boot! My debian based machine boot in 13 seconds so ... But i know Windows is quite long to boot. Good quality parts ahahah ! : My PC is quality and it's not a mac. : Q6600 8800GT 4GB DDR2-800 500GB Hard drive. And i paid the half of a fricking Imac that is just 50% less powerful. frick sleep mode and shutdown! xD

06 September 2009, 9:16 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

geoffer (New user):

Yup. I've been using /building /loading & configuring Wintel's, FreeBsd's, Linuxes & Mac's since 1990. Took me forEVER to admit that the clamshell G3 I bought used off Ebay had run over three years without any need to shutdown or restart except, as you pointed out, an Apple software update required it. Three years .... the Ubuntu machine I'm typing on now has that kind of reliability too. Sure I have WinXP, for gaming, on a flamboyantly overbuilt homebuilt. I rely on & explicitly trust my MiniMac for any honestly serious computing work. I work on customer's Vista machines daily, you couldn't give Vista to me for free. Macs do the computing so their users are free to do the thinking.

11 September 2009, 1:09 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

aggggh...tea! (New user):

To me it's still horses for courses. I use a PC at work and a Mac at home. At work I need to use GIS packages, of which there are no decent ones running on a Mac. At home I need something which pitches up my music and allows me to manipulate photos easily .... hence Mac. The Mac is easy to run, and no real fuss - although I'm using GIMP to do the majority of my photo editing now-a-days!

That said, I'm currently tinkering around with Linux on a stripped (5 year old) ex-windows laptop - and it's running the latest install of GIMP, OpenOffice and Banshee without any troubles... now if there were a decent open source GIS out there I would make the switch all together!

15 September 2009, 8:00 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

thegnu (New user):

so, i'm a linux user, administrate windows computers, and am posting from a mac. eh, 1-2 is because of locked-down hardware. #3, I use good parts. so do lenovo and toshiba, if you buy anything other than their bottom of the barrel laptops. 4, whatever. 5, that's apple's fault for being their own hip brand of evil. #6, fancy a mac user thinking it's easy to troubleshoot a mac. #7, it's significantly worse than linux, and many linux apps never make it to a usable native mac version. #8, absolutely, good sir. out of the box apps in windows are a joke. #9, i would also call a lot of mac system settings deficient in addition to neat and contained. which means i end up having to root around to find out how to do what i have to do. the network adapters thing was just fine in xp, and i always got pissed at hardware manufacturers for including their terrible wifi management apps when the windows app worked better. #10, this is another example of total control of their market segment. it's true, though. #13, on apple's lameness, i disagree wholeheartedly. despite the benefits derived from controlling the hardware, it's horribly lame.

i still think that if people want to check their email and go on the internet, they should get a mac. if they are on a budget, they should get linux. if they need to run any number of applications that don't work under wine or do any real networking, they should use windows.

15 September 2009, 10:15 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Rod Rye (New user):

1. I assumed sleep mode was unreliable, then I tried it two years ago with my then new Vista PC. I now sleep every time I go out and it hasn't missed a single beat in 2 years. It's instant.

2. Cold boot time is 8 seconds. Under Windows 7.

3. My PC uses good quality parts. Apple uses the cheapest parts they can get, and adds some gloss to them. Their marketing department is the best, when something that looks like quality can be added but actually removes functionality and reduces cost, it will be done. The impression of quality is far more important than actual quality. My 13 month old dead Macbook Pro battery is case in point, never mind what they charge for a new one or Applecare. In reality they're using the same parts everyone else is.

4. What blinking lights ?

5. One OS that does everything you want is better than two that don't.

6. Yes, it was, the best way to diagnose my old mac was to throw it out, because just to get the problem looked at was going to cost over a hundred dollars, then likely the problem would have taken several hundred dollars to fix, while a replacement wasn't much more than that. Same goes for upgrades, throw it out, buy a new one.

7. On Mac you have to pay extra for what is included out of the box for free, on any windows PC. In many cases hundreds of dollars for it.

8. Microsoft unlike Apple can't bundle everything so have to make much available as free downloads to avoid being dragged before the EU and US courts.

9. Those screenshots could be 1:1 from windows.

10. Fair point but that's not windows, and most OEMs aren't the OEMs that do that. Apple are much better at shaking money out of people for what should be included, people actually enjoy the experience and write articles about it.

11. Have you ever used windows ? I'm betting not for as long as OSX because it does all of this, you just simply didn't notice.

12. You don't need any extra security software with Windows unless you're a moron. You don't need any extra security software with a Mac, when you get a virus (which does happen) the situation is unrecoverable. Buy a new Mac.

13. On the whole, Apple seems to come up with few ideas. The Newton, Power PC architecture (which was furiously clung onto years after the futility was realised). The Apple Pippin (a games console) which OS maker still makes consoles ?, Macintosh TV (it lasted 5 months). Naturally producing less products is actually right out of the marketing textbook as people who don't get the right product for their needs because it isn't being made are actually happier and more likely to purchase than those that have to choose between multiple products that all fit their needs.

14. Adobe Flash is a must have, but it's never coming to the iPhone. Why ? Because it could potentially dilute Apple's revenue stream. Apple have no qualms in preventing you from using 'Essential' software if they can make more money by denying you. If Mac OSX were ever to get anywhere near dominance this would carry over to that platform also.

15. The problem with file sharing on Windows computers is that it's TOO easy. That it's too hard is a new criticism.

On balance, if you want to limit what you can do, and do less. A Mac is fine, sure you may be locked in and restricted, and paying a huge premium for the privilege, but you will be happy to do so. While using Windows you will begrudgingly accept that all the alternatives are significantly worse.

20 September 2009, 1:43 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

The Big Baboo (New user):

Quoting Rod Rye:
I now sleep every time I go out and it hasn't missed a single beat in 2 years. It's instant.
:):)"Instant Sleep" God i wish I could get some of that :( I think a caffeine and bourbon lifestyle has wrecked my body but hey,"You're only here once"






22 October 2009, 9:56 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

whynot (New user):

I don't think the author could have demonstrated a more effective example of trolling than if he added the word Muslim to the title.

Unfortunately this sort of crap is in keeping with the continuing decline in the standard of journalism of APC.

Reviews in the magazine are nothing more than regurgitated press releases. I won't be renuing my subcription when it is due.

Most here may not be old enough to remember when it was IBM compatible for business and Apple for home. It wasn't "evil" MS that slayed Apple's dominance in the home market, which was what PC market share is now, it was the evolution of the much cheaper 100% IBM compatible clone (remember that phrase).

21 September 2009, 9:17 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

xCriSiS (New user):

Macs don't get viruses
This argument is flawed. The reason there are few viruses on macs has to with issues of user share. Less than 2% of people use mac compared to over 90% for Windows. This is a matter of logistics rather than security. Symantec (makers of Norton Anti-Virus), a leading computer security provider, states that OS X is less secure than Windows XP. Apple gives its users a false sense of security. Apple users often neglect basic security practices, such as running a firewall, using caution when opening emails, and running antivirus software. Apple computers ship with the built in firewall disabled, while Windows XP ships with in on by default. Widows also advises users to run security software. As the Apple user share grows, there will be more and more threats and mac users will not be prepared.
So OSx is actually much more unsecure. That's why macs fail.

06 October 2009, 4:43 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

UbiquitousGeek (New user):

First of all, your market share data was, well, pulled directly from your ass. Mac OS X now has 12% of the U.S. home market and over 40% of the smartphone market. Second... A company that markets virus protection software wants Mac users to "secure" their computers? Duh! Why would you take advice about computer security from a company who's sole purpose is to make money selling security software? We have a false sense of security? After owning and using a Mac every day for five years without a single malware infestation, I'd say that I have a very realistic sense of security. Of course, there are preventative steps that anyone should follow, but I don't worry about it as much as I would if I were still using Windows every day. You people don't seem to understand why OS X is inherently more secure than Windows. It's not about market share. There are very real and technical reasons why OS X isn't plagued with malware. If you Google the terms "Windows inherently" and read the first link, you'll see exactly why OS X is more secure. There are various attack vectors in play on Windows PCs that just don't exist on a Macintosh. If you think that Apple doesn't value security, you are sadly mistaken. There have been new security features in every version of Mac OS X. There are security updates at least twice a month. OS X warns you when you're about to open an application for the first time that was downloaded from the internet. It even tells you when it was downloaded. There's home folder encryption. There's a firewall and network stealth mode. If anything attempts to write to a system folder, you're prompted for the administrator's password. I'm not going to get into every single security feature of Mac OS X, but you should read the article I mentioned earlier. It explains exactly why OS X isn't vulnerable to the types of attacks that Windows is plagued with. I couldn't explain it any better than that article does. PC users have been claiming for years that OS X will see malware as market share rises. Well, I'm still waiting. We're up to 12%, where's my malware? Where's the malware on my iPhone? Real world usage speaks for itself. Let's browse porn/warez sites for a few hours and see who's machine goes down first. Here's a hint, it won't be mine.

06 October 2009, 3:22 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (New user):

Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
was, well, pulled directly from your ass.

So rather than provide some substantiation you chose to behave like a toad and make rude replies. suit yourself.


Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
OS X now has 12% of the U.S. home market

US huh? that makes your ass pulling claims erronious at your 1st utterance.

Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
Why would you take advice about computer security from a company who's sole purpose is to make money selling security software?

Yeah why trust professionals when you can get schoolyard advice. And why trust car manufacturers advice either, who needs oil?


Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
We have a false sense of security?

We do? oh yeah, by we you are actually referring to yourself.


Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
After owning and using a Mac every day for five years without a single malware infestation

Like the guy who cancels insurance becuse he'd driven 20 years without an accident. Not the wisest move, is it?


Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
Of course, there are preventative steps that anyone should follow, but I don't worry about it

Pretty much sums up your false sence of security, its not a matter of if but more a matter of when.


Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
You people don't seem to understand

You people? Only think us people don't understand is where you got the mistaken idea you held a clue?


Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
It's not about market share.

Market share is a major factor, equally as important as the lax security of windows workstations.


Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
There are very real and technical reasons why OS X isn't plagued with malware.

And there is very clear examples of how superior security has also been breached.

Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
If you think that Apple doesn't value security, you are sadly mistaken.

Oh we dont think that at all, we think smug toads fooling themselves that OS X is totally inpenetrable are the ones that are sadly mistaken.


Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
There have been new security features in every version of Mac OS X.

There have been new security features for windows appearing on an almost daily basis. That new security code is being released strongly indicates that all code is susceptable to varying defrees of attack.


Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
OS X warns you when you're about to open an application for the first time that was downloaded from the internet.

Fat lot of good that is going to do when your mistaken belief is that OS X cannot be compromised. You'll just click anyway.


Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
If anything attempts to write to a system folder, you're prompted for the administrator's password.

And when not mistakedly believing that your inpenetrable you'll provide it, in the hpe of seeing new porn or thrills.


Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
but you should

I decide what I should, not you.


Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
It explains exactly

something your rudeness and demands are not achieving.


Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
I couldn't explain it

Clearly.


Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
OS X will see malware as market share rises. Well, I'm still waiting.

waiting for a rise in market share and/or waiting for a rise in reported infections.


Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
where's my malware?

with an attitude loke you hold its only a matter of time


Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
Where's the malware on my iPhone?

they are called applications.


Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
Real world usage speaks for itself.

Is this your real world of one? or the real real world?


Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
Let's browse porn/warez sites for a few hours

You can start without me, thanks all the same.


Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
Here's a hint

Your full of hint's aren't you? I'll take my hints from someone with a more realistic outlook and some actual know-how, thanks all the same.


06 October 2009, 4:35 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

thegnu (New user):

Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
"After owning and using a Mac every day for five years without a single malware infestation, I'd say that I have a very realistic sense of security."

After living for 25 years without a tiger attack, I'd say my tiger repellent is working. In other words, you have nobody trying to hack your stuff.

Exhibit A:
http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/1495591/security-experts-mock-mac-security

These people have a more realistic view of security than you. Also, while I've never had anyone hack into a windows PC, I HAVE have the old IT guy at the company I work at log into my Mac at change my hostname (to log onto the domain), as well as other things, WHILE I WAS ON IT. This guy hacked my Mac rather than hack the Windows PCs he set up? Hmmm...

I'm no Microsoft fanboy, but I think I do have to point out that Microsoft's response to exploits is often significantly less geared towards garnering the proper publicity than Apple's response is.

12% is still a piddling pile of crap in terms of market share. When Firefox had 12% market share, everything was rosy. Now that it's around 25%, we're beginning to see stuff. Talk to you in another 5 years?


06 October 2009, 10:49 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

The Big Baboo (New user):

Oh dear :( Another one of those people who use one paragraph for a 35 minute diatribe of drivel they not nothing about.

22 October 2009, 9:32 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

The Big Baboo (New user):

Quoting The Big Baboo:
Oh dear :( Another one of those people who use one paragraph for a 35 minute diatribe of drivel they not nothing about.
I was referring to the "Ubiqitous Geek" there you know :) Sorry about any misunderstanding.







22 October 2009, 9:46 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

xCriSiS (New user):

Macs don't get viruses
This argument is flawed. The reason there are few viruses on macs has to with issues of user share. Less than 2% of people use mac compared to over 90% for Windows. This is a matter of logistics rather than security. Symantec (makers of Norton Anti-Virus), a leading computer security provider, states that OS X is less secure than Windows XP. Apple gives its users a false sense of security. Apple users often neglect basic security practices, such as running a firewall, using caution when opening emails, and running antivirus software. Apple computers ship with the built in firewall disabled, while Windows XP ships with in on by default. Widows also advises users to run security software. As the Apple user share grows, there will be more and more threats and mac users will not be prepared.


06 October 2009, 4:48 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

thermalman (New user):

microsoft "non-starters" are not wot u think. they are just a mass of tech that they can use in the future to make its products better

07 October 2009, 9:38 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply
13 October 2009, 9:39 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

nribecca (New user):

Thank you for this list, as I am about to make the switch to Mac. This week's 17 downloads, and the hours of my life I will never get back waiting for them to down load, install, and restart, AND the last straw, as soon as it was all done, within seconds I got a notice that there was yet ANOTHER update I had to download install, reboot, AGAIN!!!

so, I'm ready to make the move from the Dark Side ;)

17 October 2009, 6:58 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

xCriSiS (New user):

Don't absolutley not a good idea. Just do some research and figure out a decent easy to use affordable pc, you'll regret a Mac.

22 October 2009, 5:22 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

The Big Baboo (New user):

Eh whatever floats your boat ;) I've always preferred Hungry Jacks to Big Mac's any day but then that's just me :)

22 October 2009, 9:24 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Pauly-Smith (New user):

"I long ago stopped actively seeking out Mac vs PC discussions (partly because Macs are now PCs -- so the argument is more about Mac OS X vs Windows vs Linux than a proprietary Mac architecture vs an x86 PC architecture)"... yet point 4 refers to purely hardware related flashing lights... getting desperate to fill your 15 or just a case of pot kettle anyone? I must say also, I had a chuckle at points 6 and 13, do you get a free pair of blinkers with every Mac purchase?

26 October 2009, 6:26 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Pauly-Smith (New user):

"I long ago stopped actively seeking out Mac vs PC discussions (partly because Macs are now PCs -- so the argument is more about Mac OS X vs Windows vs Linux than a proprietary Mac architecture vs an x86 PC architecture)"... yet point 4 refers to purely hardware related flashing lights... getting desperate to fill your 15 or just a case of pot kettle anyone? I must say also, I had a chuckle at points 6 and 13, do you get a free pair of blinkers with every Mac purchase?

26 October 2009, 6:29 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

nribecca (New user):

Well, after spending 5 very late nights setting things up here ar my observations on the new Mac Mini (or Mac in general)

Ridiculously fast! After years of conditioning to make coffee while waiting for my PC to boot up, or even recover from Hibernating, I almost get whiplash everytime I start this up! Amazing that we dont HAVE to wait forever for our Computer to be ready for input!!!

Still many incompatabilities! I needed to purchase a new Scanner and Web cam, since the mac didnt recognize them, nor were there any drivers out ther wi allow them to be used on a Mac. Add to that hald the Musci and Video files I have been using for years are also no longer compatable. This was the reason I waited so long to convert to MAc in the first place. Add to that the very different user interface, standard keyboard shortcuts like ^c and ^v now use their unique key, it is taking some getting used to. Although I can use the Right-Click on my mouse, it is virtually useless, since most of the common menu items do not appear upon Right Click, and I find myself hunting down the losction of simple commands like Print, or PrtScr, or even Properties.

All in all, once I get through the painful process of learning my way around, which is kind of an adventure, and converting all my files to compatible formats, AND replacing what ever other hardware might need replacing, I believe in the LONG run, I will be infinately more pleased with the MAc Experience, than I have EVER been with MS.

Just one NewBee's observation....

27 October 2009, 12:56 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

nribecca (New user):

Well, that last story, although you sound like a very nice guy, I must point our several flaws. 1 Windows, in a word, is flawed. I tried to get the best of both worlds, and load Office for MAC last night, and as soon as I did my mac started acting sick, like my PC always used to. Although I told it to REMEMBER my password, for e-mail and other items, OFFICE seems to have disables the 'keychain' function of Mac, and it's now BROKEN, just like Windows.
As far as Apple lowering their prices, it's never been a price war, in fact, Apple has a differerent philosophy, they upgrade their quality, while keeping their prices the same, therefore giving consumers more for their mooney. They can charge more, because we are OK with paying a bit more for a quality product. They just released a new line of products, so I'm not sure when the next version of Mac will be out, but, last week they pretty much doubled the power of the Mini, and completely redesigned the laptops, as well, again, keeping the pricing the same.
As far as window's flexibility, it is it's strength, as well as its major downfall. With all the flexibility, comes all the incompatibility, and endless flow of BUGS.
So, blue food or green food .. I prefer food I can swallow, and doesnt make me sick, no matter what color it is.

29 October 2009, 11:47 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

xCriSiS (New user):

You people obviously don't understand how macs are inadequate from a technical point of view (ie. hardware, components and software programs). So go with your macs, be inadequate.

30 October 2009, 11:31 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

texasboy1 (New user):

so windows is once again screwed over and beaten by mac again, eh?
oh silly me! that 90% of the OS choice must have been for someone else.......

aside from linux for a second, [who we all know is the number 1 choice in a power house OS anyways..] i will tell you this....macs commercials are flawed, and stereotypical. not to mention what the media has made an effect on it. I don't know how many movies or TV shows where i've seen a mac in the background instead of a PC. mac brainwashes people with the idea that PC's suck, and therefore, since they're the only other OS choice besides linux, they must not suck as much. i personally never had any problems with windows, i don't buy store made computers any ways....and it doesn't help much when you're when of those daft people who just waltz around the net visiting "inappropriate pages" [ahem] thinking that they would come out of there without a scratch or SOME form of trace or damage. as for windows loading there OS's with crap, i have nothing to reply to that other than it is also, stereotypical. sure maybe windows did once load there software with crap [such as windows 95] but as for windows xp and beyond, unless it was, say, and illegal copy or you bought it from some random guy down the street, i strongly disagree that windows loads up on vaporware. as for virus's and macs not getting them.....c'mon people.....THEY SPECIFICALLY MADE AN ANTIVIRUS SOFTWARE FOR A MACINTOSH. macs do and can get virus's. the people that make them just choose to write them in windows format because thats the OS that almost everyone has nowadays. crashing? you bet, say hello to Mr. kernel panic. hacking? ive heard a story where a guy hacked a mac in about 30 seconds and won $10,000....user friendliness? self explanitory....

oh and BTW, i saw a mac mini on sale for about $600....with about 1GB of memory and built on video. or you could get one with about 2-4GB of memory similar of that price of a regular mac. I about i about died of laughing.

so in my opinion...windows is just as good as a mac if no better. your just getting screwed over for trying something that resembles a silver box with a picture of an apple on the back and paying over $1000 for it. don't forget to flush kiddies.

31 October 2009, 3:04 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

texasboy1 (New user):

so windows is once again screwed over and beaten by mac again, eh?
oh silly me! that 90% of the OS choice must have been for someone else.......

aside from linux for a second, [who we all know is the number 1 choice in a power house OS anyways..] i will tell you this....macs commercials are flawed, and stereotypical. not to mention what the media has made an effect on it. I don't know how many movies or TV shows where i've seen a mac in the background instead of a PC. mac brainwashes people with the idea that PC's suck, and therefore, since they're the only other OS choice besides linux, they must not suck as much. i personally never had any problems with windows, i don't buy store made computers any ways....and it doesn't help much when you're when of those daft people who just waltz around the net visiting "inappropriate pages" [ahem] thinking that they would come out of there without a scratch or SOME form of trace or damage. as for windows loading there OS's with crap, i have nothing to reply to that other than it is also, stereotypical. sure maybe windows did once load there software with crap [such as windows 95] but as for windows xp and beyond, unless it was, say, and illegal copy or you bought it from some random guy down the street, i strongly disagree that windows loads up on vaporware. as for virus's and macs not getting them.....c'mon people.....THEY SPECIFICALLY MADE AN ANTIVIRUS SOFTWARE FOR A MACINTOSH. macs do and can get virus's. the people that make them just choose to write them in windows format because thats the OS that almost everyone has nowadays. crashing? you bet, say hello to Mr. kernel panic. hacking? ive heard a story where a guy hacked a mac in about 30 seconds and won $10,000....user friendliness? self explanitory....

oh and BTW, i saw a mac mini on sale for about $600....with about 1GB of memory and built on video. or you could get one with about 2-4GB of memory similar of that price of a regular mac. I about i about died of laughing.

so in my opinion...windows is just as good as a mac if no better. your just getting screwed over for trying something that resembles a silver box with a picture of an apple on the back and paying over $1000 for it. don't forget to flush kiddies.

31 October 2009, 3:08 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

ic3ss (New user):

Dan, I'm a 15 year PC guy and recently have become interested in buying a macbook pro. I really like it, but if there is only one sticking point, it's the fact that none of the macs have a ten key pad on the keyboard. Even on the desktop macs, the keyboard is minimalistic, nice to look at, but impractical. I know it's easy to just plug in a usb standard keyboard to use, even on the laptops but shouldn't this just be a basic feature? Every PC desktop today has a ten key. Even on the macbook pro 17" ther is ample room for it, if they could just back off from the ideal asthetic styling and just get real a little bit.

01 November 2009, 9:07 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply
02 November 2009, 7:06 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

The Big Baboo (New user):

Quoting mattrix:
ghghg

Heh heh :) I see that you've been shocked by the statements on the subject here "matrix" and really can't defend either option which is as it should be by the way :) To each his own I reckon.I really don't care what I use as long as the blasted thing works the way I want :)

03 November 2009, 7:32 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

mattrix (New user):

first of all,have u tried windows 7 yet ??
when you say "Apple uses good quality parts." you know pc does as well in fact you can customise and change brands and standards at will if you have the money. to customise a mac on apple. com is extreemly expensive.. adding an extra 4gb of ram to a 4gb core 2 duo will cost u $300 extra.. worth it i dont think so.

02 November 2009, 7:25 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Buick-Boy (New user):

Macs are more expensive, PC is upgradeable. Macs are user-friendly, PC definitely is not. Just save the $2000 and buy a computer you can actually fricking use. Vista (which I have) freezes about 3 times a week while i'm using nothing but WORD. WTF is that? Anyway, Macs come with more software to begin with...and if you absolutely have to, you can run XP on the side on a Mac. Mac is better in every way, shape, and form.

03 November 2009, 11:35 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Anonymousewiuu2945u389 (User):

Quoting Buick-Boy:
Just save the $2000 and buy a computer you can actually fricking use


I can use Windows.
Quoting Buick-Boy:
Macs are user-friendly, PC definitely is not


Define user-friendly. I'm fairly sure that there isn't a 'one size fits all' level of user-friendlyness

Quoting Buick-Boy:
Vista (which I have) freezes about 3 times a week while i'm using nothing but WORD


I also have Vista. And it runs perfectly well.

Quoting Buick-Boy:
Anyway, Macs come with more software to begin with


Oh, wow, and Linux comes with even more (too much in the case of some distro's, though)
Quoting Buick-Boy:
Mac is better in every way, shape, and form.


Including upgradeability? I don't want to camel-trek to the nearest Apple store because the HDD just died. And then that's assuming that Mac is compatible with the wide variety of Windows programs out there, which it isn't (unless you shell out extra for a copy of Windows). Until these two issues get sorted out, PC will always be a superior, more flexible platform. Especially if you just stick an Apple logo on it "Hey! It's an Apple-labeled computer! Just a few hours of hacking and I can legally run OSX on it!"

01 March 2010, 12:52 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Fraxxure (New user):

*sigh* raindog...
Quoting Raindog:
----------------
Quoting McBanjo:
Whether it be trying to change every one's old PC habits

Last time a religious fanatic tried to change my habits I set the dog on him, sort out your own habits, and stay the hell out of everyone else's.
----------------
I think what he's trying to say is if someone wishes to switch to a Mac it takes a fair amount of teaching and explaining for them to adequately get used to the Mac operating system.

Quoting Raindog:
---------------
Quoting McBanjo:
while Windows Explorer decides it wants to hang

Ah yes Safari hanging is a so much better experience, I think its all that goodness.
--------------
Safari has only done that once or twice for me and I've been a dedicated Mac user for 6 plus years.

Quoting Raindog:
Try doing that on your Os-X VM! Good luck?

I ran World of Warcraft over a virtual machine (parallels) on my osx leopard standard macbook ($1000)

Quoting Raindog:
---------------
Quoting Papa-Raboon:
I seriously do NOT know a single person that prefers to run Windows who has switched from a Windows machine to a Mac (and I know quite a few switchers).

So you exist in a narrow and limited circle of association, you practically never see a windows fan at the Mac store right? Reality check time.
--------------
Just because he knows some switchers who have certainly liked it doesn't mean he exists in a limited circle of association. He's only listing an example and you took advantage of it just like any other opportunity you did on this forum to twist the meaning and bash him.

Quoting Raindog:
Yep there is that reality biting in again.

Can I stress how arrogant you sound? It's almost as if every word mac users utter are filled with lies and deceit. Get a grip on yourself you ego-maniac and control your slandering of light-hearted comments and statements. If you feel the need to take offense and let the dog loose on someone with a different opinion than you please do so, but expect some static. All you're full of are a few little windows facts and a LOT of sarcasm rubbish. Go troll somewhere else.

Quoting Raindog:
So rather than provide some substantiation you chose to behave like a toad and make rude replies. suit yourself.

You seem to be doing that yourself quite a bit in this thread, hypocrite.

Quoting Randog:
-----------------
Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
If you think that Apple doesn't value security, you are sadly mistaken.

Oh we dont think that at all, we think smug toads fooling themselves that OS X is totally inpenetrable are the ones that are sadly mistaken.
----------------
He never said anything about Macs being impenetrable, which they aren't. He was just stating the claim that Apple values security, which is very true. Stop twisting people's words you manipulative creep.

03 November 2009, 11:34 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (New user):

Quoting Fraxxure:
if someone wishes to switch to a Mac it takes a fair amount of teaching and explaining

Kind of flies in the face of the suggestion a MAC is simplicity in itself dont you think?





04 November 2009, 12:50 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

k8 (New user):

There is a certain bias towards Mac especially in points 2, 3, & 4. Not everything has to do with the software and errors can be due to hardware malfunction. It would be hard to argue with those points against Windows because Mac makes their own hardware while Windows is just a software. The performance of the computer also depends on the processor.

19 November 2009, 1:50 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

k8 (New user):

There is a certain bias towards Mac especially in points 2, 3, & 4. Not everything has to do with the software and errors can be due to hardware malfunction. It would be hard to argue with those points against Windows because Mac makes their own hardware while Windows is just a software. The performance of the computer also depends on the processor.

19 November 2009, 1:52 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Hypnotoad72 (New user):

After nearly 20 years of Windows experience, the dilettante, bait'n'switch swindle known as Vista - as provided by the arrogant company Microsoft - had be going to Mac fairly quickly and I haven't looked back. Especially when the fresh re-install of Vista Ultimate 64-bit PC I had was running at 3.6GHz (9x400MHz bus), with 8GB of RAM (DDR2-800), Velociraptor, and everything else, the 2.93GHz iMac (Mar 2009)should NOT have been able to have been faster or more fluid. It was. (never mind using the default 9x333MHz CPU settings, where Vista crawled. It's a RAM hog.)

I could write a book... but people would merely claim I'm jealous of their wealth or something equally baseless and idiotic.

23 November 2009, 6:15 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

nas (New user):

I'm sorry but this article is moronic. Not one of these points is sensible or truthful. I say this as a neutral computer user. I do think there are things that macs have other Windows such as some amazing software that is OSX only, yet you decide to talk about blinking lights and the inability to run osx on a PC? Absolutely moronic, and saying suspend works 100% of the time is hilarious. I've been shown by many mac users that closing the lid can often lead to reboot crashes.

23 November 2009, 1:59 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

13ulletz (New user):

This was a VERY biased article. where was the pros and cons of BOTH mac and windows? rubbish.

25 November 2009, 11:26 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

partyboy9013 (New user):

I would buy a mac if they would just stop being so high and mighty and let other companies manufacture their computers. Right now it's pretty much a monopoly over their own product. Good hardware or not, their computers cost as much (and more) as a fully customized system build and don't come anywhere close to technical specs of those. They need to be cheaper, cause they sure aren't worth what they are asking. Not even close.

18 December 2009, 7:43 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

partyboy9013 (New user):

I would buy a mac if they would just stop being so high and mighty and let other companies manufacture their computers. Right now it's pretty much a monopoly over their own product. Good hardware or not, their computers cost as much (and more) as a fully customized system build and don't come anywhere close to technical specs of those. They need to be cheaper, cause they sure aren't worth what they are asking. Not even close.

18 December 2009, 7:46 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Clay Franklin (New user):

I just bought a MacBook Pro 13" and love the look and feel. I am still having trouble with shortcuts like forward delete. I was not able to play a .wav file. I do love it and am trying to convert after many years on PC. Windows 7 has improved PCs usability alot with faster start up and shut down. I am currently running both the Mac and a PC all the time. Time will tell if I can fully convert to MAC. Thank you for the great article.

15 January 2010, 7:14 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

djdaniel150 (New user):

rubbish! Windows vista and windows 7 have fully reliable sleep modes! ofcourse you wouldnt know that because your a moron! And further more,as far as image viewing aps, there is paint.net. which is totally free from microsoft! and can edit in every way thinkable almost any graphic image, as well convert image files too. Im not sure what makes you think that make have such wonderful hardware either? Im a pc technician, and i can tell you the slot load disk drives dont work for crap! theyre broken all the time! everyone ive ever know thats owned a mac has had problems with the slot load drives! you just jump to conclusions, making comments about pc's when you know nothing about them. If you did know about them, then why did say they did not have a sleep mode?? pretty stupid if you ask me. who wants to spend $2,000 on a laptop computer (MAC) that has a life expectancy of less than 2 years. also when my friends MACbook broke last year (it was less than 2 years old!) Apple said they wanted $275.00 to fix it, despite the fact he already paid a ton of money for it. My laptop is an Asus! and theyve been building computers forever (IBM in the 80's). and they are very powerful, very reliable, and the best thing of all, unlike MAC's
PC's are modular (they can be easily repaired. macs cannot!) and PC's are standardized (they are compatible with virtually all wirless communications equipment, while macs have very little compatibility with wireless routers). everytime i go to a coffee shop, theres always someone with a mac asking me if i was able to connect to the wifi network. The macs are NOT compatible with a lot of the hardware used for wifi in public places. They never get connected. who the hell wants a laptop that cannot connect to the internet? whats the point? yeah, keep praising your crapty macs that cant even get internet access in a coffee shop, and that the drives dont ever work. Also, yes im NOT done yet...... im in college as a computer science major, and there are no classes that teach anything for mac's! out of the more than 50 computer classes my school provides, not ONE for macs, because theyre overpriced chinese junk!

26 January 2010, 6:28 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Anonymousewiuu2945u389 (User):

My personal situation:
1. Reliable sleep mode - I never use sleep mode, and Hibernate (which I do use) works all the time for me.
2. Extremely fast boot times - Why I use Hibernate when in a hurry
3. Apple uses good quality parts - which aren't replaceable when they die. And given that 100% of PC failures I've had have been power supply related...
4. Less blinking lights - form over function
5. OS X + Windows is better than just Windows - OSx86
6. Easier to troubleshoot Macs - but if you know what you're doing on Windows, it can be just as easy.
7. A culture of good quality community software - again, if you know what you're doing...
8. More useful apps out of the box - I am a power user
9. Neat and contained system settings - vs. more system settings
10. Apple doesn't load the system up with crap - why I do clean installs when possible
11. Tonnes of small reasons make Mac OS X better:
# every version of OS X has sophisticated screenshot capability built in. Snipping Tool?
# The inbuilt image viewing app is powerful OK, I'll give you that one
# Expose lets you quickly see all your open windows, or your desktop, or just the windows of your current app. And that one
# The Dock is much more efficient to use than the Windows start menu and taskbar - how (in the case on Win7?)
# Target disk mode allows you to boot a Mac into a mode where the whole machine acts like an external hard drive. And that.
# Quick look lets you view pretty much all major file formats by clicking on the file and pressing the space bar -- no need to wait for an app to launch. Windows simply doesn’t have this - yes, it does (Win Vista/7 preview pane - it just isn't that quick)
12. Still no need for additional security software - there is, if you follow the suggestion in point 5. I love it when articles contradict themselves
13. Apple seems largely to be lameness free - just ignore the 'lame' features. Sure, that isn't easily done with UAC, so I just use it to access Admin tools when in non-Admin accounts. I rarely log in to the actual Admin account.
14. Power of the Linux command line with Photoshop CS4 - I don't need Photoshop CS4. Come to think of it, I don't even use any version of Photoshop.
15. File sharing is much easier - I don't have a LAN

OK, I know that there are some people that Macs are better for. But I'm not one of them, so Macs aren't 'better' no matter what. I just use Windows because it's the only OS that can run all my programs or equivalents that fulfil the same purpose - I often experiment with Linux but the lack of Office07 support drives me back to Windows (and I know about OpenOffice.org - it just doesn't achieve much more than cookie-cutter results.) While the closed nature of Mac hardware drives be crazy, as does the lack of a true maximise button.

08 February 2010, 7:38 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

daniel19 (New user):

1) Sleep - "OS X's 100% reliable" complete lie, no computer is perfect. I have never had a problem with sleep, but i am aware that others have. Again nothings perfect.

2) Boot- watch this. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DV99BS4f1Lw... See more
Identical, wouldnt you say??
I'd like to point out that these are two computers that have other software installed and arn't just an OS, also that the mac has better specs, though i will concide they play very little importance in boot times, finally the win laptop is running RC, a beta to the full version and also less stable.

3) mac parts are made by apple and are off good quality equale to that off manufacurer, however the primary component off a computer is that off the cpu, mac uses intel cpu NOT there own. They also use nvidia gpu's again the best on the market but not there own.
Also look at this.
Screen fog http://www.biztoolbelt.com/uploads/imac-condensation-thumb.jpg
Not such great quality.

4) Bit weak for a reason 4, but anywho. prior to getting my new tower with LED fans my computer had only one flashing light for the HDD usage, also, anyone with any computer knowhow is able to remove the jumpers powering these lights as i have on several occasions.

5) good feature yes, but if mac is so good y need windows?? kind off points to the fact that macs cant do everything, not that pc's can either, but i, unlike many mac uses, am able to admit and accept that.

6) Anyone with half a brain knows that the best way to trouble shoot nowadays is to simply use google, hasn't failed me yet.
as for the programs, active monitor look an awfull lot like resource monitor, yes?
http://dotgiri.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/resource-monitor-windows-7.jpg
the console, as far as i can tell not being a mac user, looks to work ing the same way as the registry. Please correct me if i'm wrong as i am interested to learn more.
and disk utility looks a lot like a number off partitioning programs i've used in the past such as partition magic.
i also have a number of third party programs that have more features such as speedfan, cpu-z, riva tuner and many more, if you want a list i'm happy to provide.

7) Free software is available on any os, the programs i menchend above were all free. also if they are going to make that claim they should also give menchon to Linux, whos software is not only almost all free but so is the actual os.

8) Having free software out off the box is great and something, admitadly win is missing, however much off this software if free to download. Also, you may get the software but i have little doubt that a lengthy update process is then required. My final point is that if it is such great software then y the need to port office, a microsoft aplication, to the mac.

9) Neat and contained is great for the average user and is an idea that both mac and pc now have down pat. However i use many off the more intracate features and windows 7 has a "god mode" that allows me to change almost all of the system settings, a feature that i am yet to hear about on a mac.
p.s if there is such a system please let me know as again i'm interested.

10) this has been an issue in the past and is mostly due to peole loading there system up with rubish. XP had huge issues with this and a number of 3rd party programs attempted to fix this with varying degrees af effectiveness, however vista and 7 both have a feature called system configuration in which you are able to shut off unwanted programs. If you want to check this out type msconfig into search and press enter.

11) these other reasons were obviously writen prior to the release of win 7 as it now has all these features built in, bar the "target disk" which sounds like a siplified network. this can be done on a pc by connecting them together with a ethernet cable and setting up a rudermentary network (have done this also)

12) if mac get no viruses than y have so many anti virus programs for it? http://antivirus.about.com/od/antivirussoftwarereviews/tp/aamacvir.htm
Also, if you run your antivirus properly then it will not slow you computer at all, untill there isw a virus in which case i'm glad i have it. The position that macs have no viruses is just ignorant, if the shoe was on the other foot and mac had 85% market share instead off a little over 8% then viruses would be made almost only for macs.

13) the whole idea off a mac is built on its "image" and quirky ideas such as the expanding dock menu that is able to be turned off, if its not a quirky, look at me feature, y be able to shut it off?
there are only 4 editions of windows, not the exagerated 10.
The UAC, admitadly anoying, is very much similar to the way mac's ask for a admin password when trying to do anything to the system files. Unlike the mac versin UAC has an off button.

14) while cs is unable to run on linux my own mother runs if flawlessly on her pc, so i missed the argument to this point.

15) Networking computers running the same versions is easy, the difficulty is when networking different os's. i have sucessfully networked xp vista and 7 with no issues. I'd love to see anyone do that with a OSX OS9 and OS8, not sure if it will work.

Also i'd like to say that while i don't use, nor particually like macs, i am able to see the upside to them and understand y some choise to use them, just as i can see the problems with pc's.

17 February 2010, 12:04 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Anonymousewiuu2945u389 (User):

Quoting daniel19:
while cs is unable to run on linux my own mother runs if flawlessly on her pc, so i missed the argument to this point.


I think the point is that Windows doesn't have a linux command line. Though what a non-power user is doing with a command line these days is another matter.

01 March 2010, 12:36 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

[NoX] (New user):

Quoting Anonymousewiuu2945u389:
I think the point is that Windows doesn't have a linux command line.

Wrong! Windows has the Windows Power Shell... they have scripted many of the average UNIX commands into this shell and is way better than CMD by far. And CS can be run on Linux, you just need to know what you're doing with the operating system to make it run. But you realise the only reason why Macs have a UNIX command-line is because they are based on UNIX, right?

I think Dan Warne mouths an excellent argument here and I also think that only those who have used all alternatives mentioned in his article can truly comment and agree with many of his suggestions and ideas of why Macs do indeed outbeat PCs and OS X outbeating Windows.

Everything in his article I agreed with. This article though, has become the exact of what he mentioned he was against starting in the first place; a flamewar. Dan, you should know better than to write up your own opinions on the internet, say you do not want a flamewar and not actually expect one. Where there are opinions, there are flamewars made by the inexperienced and/or ill-educated all the time...

17 March 2010, 5:46 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Anonymousewiuu2945u389 (User):

So you start by saying that Windows does have a Unix command line and Linux can run CS (although the version number was curiously omitted...), which is the opposite of what Dan Warne suggests in one of his points. And then you say you agree with everything he says? Quoting [NoX]:
only those who have used all alternatives mentioned in his article can truly comment and agree with many of his suggestions and ideas of why Macs do indeed outbeat PCs and OS X outbeating Windows.


I have used Macs and Linux before. I just do not see how Mac is actually better than PC for what I use it for. If anything, it has just been more frustrating as trying to mazimise windows on a Mac is a task only worth doing if you have time on your hands - and as I can't stand seeing glimpses of desktop while working on a word document because the window won't fill the screen. It also means that you lose access to the easy to reach close button (Win/Lin have it on the very top right corner, so it's just a simple matter of rolling the mouse diagonally upwards and you're there. And Windows 7 makes use of all four corners when a window is maximised, compared to only 2 on Mac as the dock won't fill the screen. And Macs are way too expensive for something that you have to send back to home base to get the battery replaced every five years, if they still manufacture the battery for your particular model. Although I get on with Linux all right - just waiting for WINE to improve and I'll probably be on again...

18 March 2010, 10:34 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

[NoX] (New user):

...I never once said Windows has a UNIX CLI... but they are trying to tear the Cygwin CLI users away from the open-sourced product and use their own Windows Power Shell, which if you haven't tried it and what I also said about it, does indeed have UNIX commands in-built to it.

And there was no need to omit any version in the recent post. There's always a way round things, as long as you know what you're doing. The average computer user may give up after a couple of days of trying to get something working but never succeed while you have the hackers finding a way. And by that, before any assumption is made, I do not mean those script kiddie hackers that force themselves to learn and rape weak websites with RFI/LFI and/or SQLi attacks. I mean the ones who know what they're doing and would rather call themselves, proudly by the way, "hackers" for not doing anything bad and just getting themselves round their problems.

As for you trying all of them, that's probably your opinion. I'm just saying I agree with it, I was against a flamewar like Dan Warne was but usually, from what I've seen, Macs users have took PC users away from PCs. Macs are more expensive because the hardware is hacked inside-and-out to get the best performance Apple could get into their product which often leaves PCs dragging behind with stupidity in their standards.
As for Windows Seven's use of window positions. This has been a feature in Linux that has existed since I first started using Linux. No matter what display manager you're using. This, along with their "own" CLI, the Windows Power Shell, that handy screen-shot of a little piece of the monitor thing with a countless amount of other things were all features of Linux before they become features of any Windows product.

19 March 2010, 1:13 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

James Zois (New user):

PCS ARE BETTER FOR GAMING THOUGH, GAMES LIKE MM2 OR GTA4

23 March 2010, 10:13 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

IT Expert (New user):

The difference between Mac and Windows in this respect is the difference between broadband and dialup internet. Back in the 90s, many people couldn't see the point of paying extra for an always-on internet service, as "it only takes a minute to connect using the dialup…"

What do you mean always on internet?
Having your internet modem and router in 24 hours will chew up power and will cost you money and is also bad for the environment- I unplug my wifi router and modem when I am not using it(WHEN I TURN IT BACK ON IT TAKES A MINUTE TO CONNECT BUT IT IS WORTH IT BECAUSE YOU SAVE POWER AND YOU ARE CARING FOR OUR ENVIRONMENT, ANYWAY ONE MINUTE IS NOT A LONG TIME TO WAIT TO GET RECONNECTED AGAIN)
ANYONE WHO DOES LEAVES THESE DEVICES OPEN 24 HOURS A DAY WITHOUT USING THEM IS A IDIOT FOR NOT CARING ABOUT THE ENVIRONMENT AND THE COSTS TO RUN THESE 24 HOURS A DAY.
IF YOU DO THIS YOU ARE A DUMB PERSON THAT KNOWS NOTHING ABOUT COMPUTERS.
If anyone disagrees with me please reply to me.




23 March 2010, 10:54 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Apple > Windows (New user):

Quoting IT Expert:
Having your internet modem and router in 24 hours will chew up power and will cost you money and is also bad for the environment- I unplug my wifi router and modem when I am not using it(WHEN I TURN IT BACK ON IT TAKES A MINUTE TO CONNECT BUT IT IS WORTH IT BECAUSE YOU SAVE POWER AND YOU ARE CARING FOR OUR ENVIRONMENT, ANYWAY ONE MINUTE IS NOT A LONG TIME TO WAIT TO GET RECONNECTED AGAIN)
ANYONE WHO DOES LEAVES THESE DEVICES OPEN 24 HOURS A DAY WITHOUT USING THEM IS A IDIOT FOR NOT CARING ABOUT THE ENVIRONMENT AND THE COSTS TO RUN THESE 24 HOURS A DAY.
IF YOU DO THIS YOU ARE A DUMB PERSON THAT KNOWS NOTHING ABOUT COMPUTERS.
If anyone disagrees with me please reply to me.

wow cool i'm truly glad you care so much about the environment maybe you and Al Gore could take your router and modem and go hug a tree somewhere else



02 April 2010, 2:13 PM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Jason Chan (New user):

Some of It I agree with, Some of it I don't

there is a lot more free software out the box on a mac the hardware is good quality & the sleep mode is really good & the lack of virus or requirement for security software.. & of coarse the fact you can legally buy Windows XP & install it on mac

How ever One thing that was said a mac user can just buy ms office & never buy anything else, the same thing could be said for a PC user as well, I fact there is probably 100 times more free software (I'm not saying it is all good software, But you get my point)

20 April 2010, 9:43 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Jason Chan (New user):

Some of It I agree with, Some of it I don't

there is a lot more free software out the box on a mac the hardware is good quality & the sleep mode is really good & the lack of virus or requirement for security software.. & of coarse the fact you can legally buy Windows XP & install it on mac

How ever One thing that was said a mac user can just buy ms office & never buy anything else, the same thing could be said for a PC user as well, I fact there is probably 100 times more free software (I'm not saying it is all good software, But you get my point)





20 April 2010, 10:38 AM (3 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

mike80286 (New user):

This is an old post, but I can't stress enough...

1. If you don't like cheap crap hardware with a PC, you can purchase non cheap crap hardware.

2. Yes some turnkey PC's are bad. The ones that cost 300$ and are sold by Dell in the backs of magazines.

3. Blinking lights annoy you? That is a superficial reason for liking one system over another. Don't buy a Dell or an HP if you don't like blinking lights. These machines exist for people with lower disposable incomes who do not have the skills to build a quality machine themselves. There are not macs that even exist for such people. Since you obviously have a higher disposable income such machines are irrelevant.

4. As far as Annoying crap, as well as out of the box apps... Windows comes with similar out of the box crap. Annoying crap usually is a sign that again you are buying an el-cheapo machine.

5. No need for security software is patently false. There are actually viruses for macs. They just aren't as common for a reason stated 10 million times that I won't state. However since people are under this impression, when they do get a virus it is usually too late for them by the time symptoms appear.

6. on number 11. These capabilities pretty much are the same as capabilities windows has had for years.

7. Fast boot time? Like the sort I get on my 600$ homebuilt pc which DOES have good quality parts by the way?

8. Macs are not easier to troubleshoot. PC's have the quick troubleshoot utilities too. But those don't tell you everything. In a lot of cases they don't tell you much of the real problem at all.

It seems to me you never really used PC's more than casually, but you use macs as a "power user" and thus what you are really comparing is how into one system you are, and the fact that you rarely use the other.

Use what you want, but compare apples to apples (bad pun I know) And don't assume all PC's use crap parts. The fact that low end pc's are designed to be price friendly means they should not be in the equation. Compare a mac pro to an equivalently priced PC as configured by an expert user, and you will find it becomes a question of what the user is used to.



22 May 2010, 7:18 PM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Zac Jardine (New user):

Number 5 of the 15 reasons says it all. You get a Mac, you get access to almost every OS ever made. With a PC, you can't run Mac programs, which cuts you out of a LOT of great applications, like iMovie.

22 May 2010, 7:28 PM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

rifall (New user):

If you want to look deep in the company, yes Apple is just like any other company that's trying to make money. But the fact that it's so specific about integration, and that they're all so easy to use, customer service actually ends up being much more useful. PC, there are too many specifications that make up each computer, and almost no 2 Windows computers are built the exact same way. You get it personalized, or you don't get it. Because an unpersonalized windows won't do you much good, because you won't know what they're putting inside it.

As far as I'm concerned, everything written in this document is correct. To my knowledge as both a Mac and PC user, Mac has always given me little to no problems, works with what I need, has the apps I want, and none of what I don't; Windows PC's just like to give me a hard time.

My mother is both an avid Windows and Mac user. She fully agrees with me. My dad, a software expert, and computer network engineer, also shares the same professional opinions.

There are going to be those of you who say "My PC never gave me problems, and Mac is just too weird/difficult/suckish." Chances are, you personalized your PC, and didn't care enough about your mac to learn what you were getting before you got it.

Lastly, whenever I have I have come across someone who has a problem with their computer, I always ask, "Is it a windows?" Every response has been a "Yes." Never have I heard "No, it's a Mac," or anything that remotely means the same thing.

31 May 2010, 2:59 PM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

darth.cabs (New user):

You can say that Mac OS is better than Windows, but don't you say that Mac's ALT+TAB or Expose is better than Windows' ALT+TAB because it is not. Mac's ALT+TAB just can't switch between multiple instances of a same application, such as iChat or Mac Messenger or even Safari. Window's ALT+TAB not only is able to switch to all instances of all applications but also remembers the order of the programs you've switched to, so when you have like 10 open applications, pressing ALT+TAB will always return to the last program you were on.

01 June 2010, 5:43 AM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

darth.cabs (New user):

You can say that Mac OS is better than Windows, but don't you say that Mac's ALT+TAB or Expose is better than Windows' ALT+TAB because it is not. Mac's ALT+TAB just can't switch between multiple instances of a same application, such as iChat or Mac Messenger or even Safari. Window's ALT+TAB not only is able to switch to all instances of all applications but also remembers the order of the programs you've switched to, so when you have like 10 open applications, pressing ALT+TAB will always return to the last program you were on.

01 June 2010, 5:48 AM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

CurtisGlover (New user):

The Geek Pub hit on some similar notes as you (shorter, and less detailed)... but I really loved what they said about testing the security by putting Windows and OS X on the Internet without a firewall.
http://www.thegeekpub.com/641/macs-rule/

14 June 2010, 5:22 AM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Orionis (New user):

The main reasons I still don't like Macs personally:
1. I like the expandability offered by my generic computers.
2. Many of the Mac included features (i.e. Garage Band) add no value to me.
3. Customization so that mine doesn't look like yours. Not a big fan of the Apple aesthetics anyhow.
4. I am of a different opinion on the lameness factor. I find that Windows is less lame than Mac. Do a fresh installation of Windows 7 and a fresh installation of Snow Leopard and Windows is much more bare-bones not forcing things on you. Your problem is with pre-installed windows from your typical manufacturer. I agree with its lameness but find it unfair to pin that as a plus on Mac rather than a negative on *most* manufacturers of Windows based computers.
5. Command Prompt vs. Terminal? Largely the same abilities. Primary difference is application control via Terminal is much more supported than via Command Prompt.
6. Security? I still think it is a Market Share issue. The biggest holes in security these days appear in Java and Flash. Java and Flash vulnerabilities affect everyone who has a full-function browser. It's just a question of how many fish you will catch as to what you target with those vulnerabilities. ActiveX is still a problem but that's why a shift is happening towards Firefox and Chrome.
7. Small Divergences of Opinion
- There are OEMs who design well laid-out computers
- I like wireless switches assuming the OEM put it in a good place
- Even for a technically minded person, Hardware issues on Macs require a Mac technician.
- UAC and boot times pretty good on Windows 7.
8. More and more excellent GNU software is being ported to Windows to give quality free software solutions.
9. AND MOST IMPORTANT: As you touched on at the bottom of your article, arrogant smugness as a corporate culture. It tends to rub off on many of Mac users and they become Mac Fanboys. I like my PC. I like my Windows 7. I like my Ubuntu. I'm glad you like your Mac but I don't have a Windows or Ubuntu logo on my car. Get over yourself.
10. Value: Purely on a hardware basis, I can buy quality PC hardware of equal performance for much less than a Mac.


02 July 2010, 9:07 AM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Tony Grooby (User):

Doesn't He know that Mac OSX IS UNIX and a mac is just a pc with a silver exterior. You can but a similar case from fractal designs.

27 July 2010, 4:03 PM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

crawler (New user):

Alright, lets just go through reason by reason, on why every single thing you posted here is wrong, and that the only reason you fail this much is because obviously you have 0 technical knowledge.

1. Reliable sleep mode, ok, my sleep mode is reliable, i cant prove it to you because you aren't here and you are obviously both ignorant, and arrogant, but i just put my computer into sleep mode and brought it back out, with 0 delay, I hit the space bar and the display flicked on.
2. 25 seconds? My desktop is half that! And my laptop cuts on in 8 seconds! I just timed it
3. Good quality parts? child, please, apple uses AFTERMARKET HARDWARE. Thats right, you are running first generation ram, even if it is say ddr2/ddr3 its the first generation ddr2/ddr3. I guarentee you that any pc that i go buy at any store is going to be useing higher end hardware, and if you want to come over to my house i could take apart some pcs and some macs, look up the model number, and show you how old your parts are. And as far as displays go, im 9001% sure that my old as 250 gts 1gb can render anything you can throw at it at least 3x better than any mac in the world.
4. Filler reason it up, please please, but know that you destroyed your credibility when you said that. Im looking all over everything on my computer and there is not a single light "blinking". Not to mention, manufacturers stopped useing orange for status lights in the 90's, welcome to the 21st century my young padawan.
5. Its just better -|DONT LISTEN TO THIS GUY! HE CANT COME UP WITH REAL REASONS SO HE USES FILLERS!|- Look, If I wanted to run Mac OS X on my desktop in a virtual box, it would take me the time to download Mac OS X to actualy run it, the only diffrence is, is that i could run it alot smoother than you could run xp-vista-7 due to my parts being better than yours, thats right, my parts are better than yours, live with being below me in life.
6. So your now blaming your ineptness with computers on not having repair utilities? I can look at a computer display for 2 seconds and tell you what problem its having, hardware or software. Also the repair utilities that are included standard issue on a PC are more than enough to deal with a little bad sector on the harddrive. Being that I had to use a mac for 2 trimesters I know for an absolute fact that the task manager on mac is nowhere near what a pc has for task manager. Look, apple, they hide things from you so you dont delete anything your not supposed to, so if i wanted to, i could just code a virus for a mac (yes, macs get viruses, no one bothers to make them though because only 5% of computers are macs) and set it up to run as a hidden process and no amount of apple task manager is going to save you. Also the logs on a pc are easy to access, go to control panel, event logs lol.
7. LOLOLOLOL ok, i have several PC's and I dont pay a dime for anything other than the OS, and i still get everything i need out of it, also, the shareware/freeware on a mac requires a certin program, to install it you need another program, which you cant download, that comes with the OS optionaly. I spent 3 days trying to get any kind of file other than a quicktime, even a converter that could convert my video to a quicktime, and in the end it didn't work.
8. Its called a gadget and it comes pre-installed on every pc since the early days of vista. Every user has stickies, a scrolling photo gallery, a button at the bottom right for that expose thing, a calender, and an index option on explorer for time machine, along with thousands of other apps, ones that are actualy useful sometimes too, like a cpu tempeture monitor.
9. Control panel
To change the TCP/IP settings on a pc, control panel10. QQ more? look, my computer never did any of that, also if you want to get rid of it than just click "never register" the first time, and they will never come back, its obvious that this picture is photo-shopped because i know that norton has a never register option.
11. pntscrn, and mac does not have a better alt tab, infact the alt tab is completely the same, other than the gui on the pc looks more polished, also we have windows tab, which is more pretty. Also having had to use the mac software for images I know its crap, and although i would rather use gimp, paint is way better than the mac equivilant. When you have alot of stuff open you just click the little arrow, and you must have abused your pc for your programs to not load up instantly, because mine do. you spelled tons wrong
12. FILLER ALERT! Microsoft security essentials, and its not a problem in PC's, its easy to make a virus for a mac, infact easier, because the command line is simpiler, the only reason macs dont get viruses because no one has one! Only 5% of computers are macs, why would i waste my time on making a virus for a mac when it wont catch the other 95% of computers.
13. FILLER ALERT! A PDF is not mac specific, its made by adobe, and im pretty sure what i do on my computer, eve online, bad company 2, etc would make whatever you do in your entire life, look lame.
14. FILLER ALERT! Gimp is a total photoshop replacement, i use both programs and there is nothing special about photoshop.
15. FILLER ALERT! Alright, inside of a network i just drag and drop a file. Over the internet, all i do is drag it onto whoever it needs to go to on skype


Get your punk A off the internet and hit the books a little harder

19 September 2010, 5:06 AM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

alienwarepro (New user):

yea i mean im sorry but all of those reasons are not main computer things. if you want a computer that runs well and can actually do stuff get a pc. all a mac is good for is looking pretty on your coffe table. i mean jesus they suck so much i want to cry for apple. you cant even give 15 good reasons. pcs are better then macs in every way possible. and the only reason they dont get viruses is because their compatability rate is so low that 99% of files and viruses cant even get on the operating system. no one ever buy a mac put them out of buisiness for their inferior products.

23 September 2010, 12:58 PM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

alienwarepro (New user):

yea i mean im sorry but all of those reasons are not main computer things. if you want a computer that runs well and can actually do stuff get a pc. all a mac is good for is looking pretty on your coffe table. i mean jesus they suck so much i want to cry for apple. you cant even give 15 good reasons. pcs are better then macs in every way possible. and the only reason they dont get viruses is because their compatability rate is so low that 99% of files and viruses cant even get on the operating system. no one ever buy a mac put them out of buisiness for their inferior products.

23 September 2010, 1:00 PM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

alienwarepro (New user):

i hate to break it to you but all of those reasons arent really important about computers. if you want a real computer that can actually do something right get a pc (preferably an alienware). the alienware computer is better then any mac ever made. the windows operating system can do everything mac can do and more except windows does it better and faster. and the only reason macs get less viruses is because 99% of files and viruses are not in a compatible format with the operating system. so that does not benefit you. im sorry but in no ways are macs better then pcs and they never will be

23 September 2010, 1:03 PM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

daedelus (New user):

Lets face it people who use macs just want pretty and simple, thats why u dont get as many errors and stuff, but the reality is windows does more so of course its gonna crash once in a while, windows is the big boys OS so step up all you shiny mac lovers :D come join us. (windows is the most sold for a reason :D)

14 October 2010, 4:40 AM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

k2 (New user):

Windows is most sold, because it was made from the ground up for business, not for home use. Macs are simple for the newbie user, like you, but have such a great UI that more experienced users (like me) can use them. I can accomplish tasks MUCH quicker than on a PC. for example on a Mac press: cmd+space and type in the first 2 letters of an application and hit enter, it opens. drag a picture onto the photoshop icon on the dock, it opens in photoshop. The reason Windows gets more errors is because it's badly scripted and is on a bad kernel. I mean, what kind of OS gets viruses?

03 December 2010, 9:50 AM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

MircoWindowsGuy (New user):

lol, go buy a laptop, "Gateway NV95" retail price - $699, running 64bit windows 7. With a intel core i3, 5860 1gb grapics card, which blows the pants off the mac book pros 9600m <-- LOL. And 4 gigs of ddr 3 ram, a 600 gig baracuda 7200 rpm harddrive, and led lcd screen, producing 1080p HD performance. Sorry mac users, but your sad over priced laptops just dont stack up! And for the record, i have my massive hard drive partitioned with windows 7 and mac panther OSX, sooooo why would i ever spend the money for something as heavy as a brick that cant even out perform a PC thats HALF the price? haha. im sure you mac obsessive people will think of something to say back!

21 October 2010, 10:30 AM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

k2 (New user):

1) Gateway is the worst computer manufacturing company EVER.
2) You are a liar. Panther can only run on PowerPC processors
3) Weight isn't important, and MacBook Pros aren't THAT heavy
4) I said something back, and proved you to be a liar, now GTFO

03 December 2010, 9:41 AM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

hopperms (New user):

-Windows still has much more compatibility than Mac.
-It may get more viruses, but if you know remotely what you are doing, you should know how to install an antivirus software.
-It may take longer to put the computer in standby and to boot windows, but if your computer has at least decent specs, it is really not that big of a deal. -Blinking lights: who cares?
-Better hardware: the enclosure is made a little better. The hardware is exactly the same as any PC.
-Troubleshooting: it is not even very hard to troubleshoot in windows.
-Preloaded crap: god forbid you go into add/remove programs and spend maybe 2 minutes uninstalling them.
-Photoshop:I don't even know how this was mentioned in a page like this. Photoshop is also compatible with windows. Comparing it to Gimp: sure it doesn't do quite as much. On the other hand, for a FREE software, what can you expect? It is already MUCH more than I would have expected. Besides, who can really afford hundreds of dollars for a software?

Comparing it to Linux: Linux has no viruses, never gets fragmented, has MUCH more capability than Mac or Windows, and also has, by far, the best personalization. It also boots and shuts down very fast as well. Best of all, its FREE! The only bad part is the compatibility. You can't get very many well-known softwares for it. However, almost every single device hooked up to it will automatically install. Every software you wish you had, there is a free alternative of it.

28 October 2010, 12:39 PM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Dodders (New user):

Well, I came here looking for real reasons for why MAC/ MAC OS is better than a Windows PC/ OS. Now all you have done so far, is point out that a start-up button, which is inevitably chosen by it's manufacturer (not windows) is not as good as a MACS start-up button. Not to be a flamer as such, but you must be an idiot to think that there is only one windows PC in the world. The next one about the lights, Again... Manufacturers choice....... Reliable sleep mode? All windows pcs come with sleep mode, completely adjustable to user preference. Faster boot time? My Asus netbook boots in 15 seconds.
Easier file sharing? Not really sure if you meant network sharing, or by Web sharing, but honestly, Windows 7 has revamped the network file sharing.
From what I see you point out far more opinion than fact,and still really can't see why people spend £1000s just to get a Laptop which is glossy and has no hardware advantages over a £200 netbook. I'm pretty sure for £800 I could get it trimmed with some diamonds!

13 November 2010, 9:58 PM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

isfeldt (New user):

since no one failed to mention it, or probably isn't aware of it, or that it doesn't matter, most all apple products now come with and have for the last 3 or so years voiceover this includes the ipod/ipad/iphone as well as the computers themselves. as a primary windows user, I think that microsoft has no excuse! for not building in a screen reader in to there os and windows phone 7? hahah what a joke. at least with a mack i can walk in to a store, or purchase a mac product, fire it up and it will talk, no damn sighted eyes required. all windows could do in the past 10 years is include narrator which won't even read webpages! and the voices are horible! thats one of the many reasons i would own a mac, also to comment on 5 and running windows naitivly, vmwhare fusion works out of the box with voiceover and windows can be installed as well with out an additional screen reader.

01 December 2010, 7:12 AM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

partyboy9013 (New user):

You're just like those people that complain about all the reading they have to do on the internet. It's a text based environment. If you don't like it, don't use it. To spend over a grand on a machine that you want to just read for you... do us all a favor and just stop using your computer.

01 December 2010, 5:07 PM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

isfeldt (New user):

you pay $1700 for jaws for windows, then $250 for a software maintenance agreement for every 2 updates and then tell me a mac isn't worth it.

01 December 2010, 5:36 PM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

partyboy9013 (New user):

No no, I don't pay anything cause I have the ability to read.

03 December 2010, 11:40 AM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Nexven (New user):

I guess anyone can be a journalist nowadays. Even the uninformed ignorant masses. I spent $1050 about 6 months ago on a self built Windows based PC.

i5-750 quad core CPU
Radeon HD 5870
4 Gigs of ram
1TB WD Caviar black 7200 HDD
CM 690 ADV II case
and a 750TX Corsair power supply.
Windows 7 Ultimate x64.

It boots up in about 6 seconds. If I were to get a Solid state drive I could get it to even 3-4 seconds. I haven't gotten a virus since my first PC was a eMachines etower. Yeah a whopping 555 mhz processor.

One thing I hear alot is how Macs don't get viruses, but that's coming from the same crowd who thought Mac vs PC commercials were quirky. Hint: Macs ARE PCs. Then again though, of course there aren't many viruses for a computer company that barely has 7% of the market share, no one gives a crap.

12 December 2010, 8:07 AM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Mcbagpipes (New user):

BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

**gasp**

BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

This is what mac users actually believe. Enjoy your outdated, overpriced hardware wrapped in smug.

12 December 2010, 1:25 PM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Jdeadevil (New user):

The sentence about getting stuff done at the very end is why I want a Mac, I hardly ever play any of the "Mainstream" games and mostly all I do is check Internet websites and listen to music whilst on Live Messenger. Sure I play Stepmania and am about to be playing the original Sims with a few of its expansion packs but overall they aren't games that require godlike speculation, and I really like the fact it doesn't cram (sometimes corrupt) crapty trials on install. I just don't know if it's still going to give me errors that only a computer programmer would understand, and take ages coding to fix it.

05 January 2011, 6:46 AM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Nexven (New user):

I don't understand why you need to pay 50% more to use about 10% of the computers capabilities, but ok. Also, what trial bloatware? My Windows 7 Ultimate PC builders version never came with it, odd. Let's just say, Macs are nice.... for people who barely know more than grandma about computers. Because honestly, It took me an hour to figure out how to build a PC when I've never built one before.

05 January 2011, 11:16 AM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Alienwareftw (New user):

Fair enough, as you have made a point about what you are NOT saying about Apple, I will not 'flame' you for any of those things.

However, I do take issue with your remarks about Windows PCs trying to get more money out of you with pre-installed software. At the end of the day this only ever happens if you buy a computer from a cheap brand; I use several Alienware and Dell PCs and have never had this issue seeing as you are given a choice whether this software is installed before you buy.

Apple is far worse for trying to extract additional money - their 'one to one' service essentially moves your files from your old computer to your new one and helps you get set up on your new mac - well that's nice.

It would be if Apple didn't demand £80 for the service.

Also I take issue with number 13, claiming that Apple is largely 'lameness free'; admittedly Windows have come up with several fail ideas - the Xbox for instance, which now works fairly well but initially had record highs for failure rates, or the windows phone or 'Zoom' MP3 player.

However, Apple are far worse for this! Take the iPad - a larger, more expensive version of the iPod touch, with all the features which the iPod touch should have had in the first place. Take the Apple trackpad - a trackpad for desktops, despite the fact most users replace the trackpads on their laptops for conventional mouses because they are so much better. This trend may be less prevalent in mac laptop users, but it doesn't mean that a trackpad is better than a mouse - and as with all Apple products, it is massively overpriced.

That leads me to another issue which isn't covered. I know you mentioned that macs aren't friendly for people who build from scratch, and whilst I will not direct this issue directly I will say this: If you add up the costs of the hardware in a mac, you will find that the price which Apple charges for the product is between several hundred and over a thousand pounds higher than the total cost of the hardware. How Apple can justify this, I have no idea whatsoever. Yes, they need to make a profit, but adding on over £1000 for the OS and software is extortion, plain and simple.

Somehow though, people fail to see this and continue to invest in the Apple Macintosh brand.

11 January 2011, 6:29 AM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

SoMeOnE123 (New user):

Every PC user is just jealous so they get Mac on their Windows and then it runs slow like hell.

14 January 2011, 3:38 PM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

SoMeOnE123 (New user):

you guys are just jealous that you don't have a mac. Even if you have mac on windows it will run slower and if you drop a PC your screwed

14 January 2011, 4:11 PM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Anonymousewiuu2945u389 (User):

Quoting SoMeOnE123:
if you drop a PC your screwed


A bit of care though should circumvent this. Also, not all PCs are equal in this respect. El cheapo commodity PCs will suffer more than, say, something built to withstand anything - but the latter costs a lot more...

Quoting SoMeOnE123:
you guys are just jealous that you don't have a mac


No offence, but on the contrary I have used Macs and PCs and just prefer the PC - I love just getting into the 'guts' of the computer and messing around etc. (Hardware and software). Also (and probably due to bad IT staff and not representative of all computers, so don't take this as gospel!) some of the Macs I have used have left a sour taste in my mouth - I have been one of the select few to have experienced the Kernel Panic on Snow Leopard! Quoting SoMeOnE123:
Even if you have mac on windows it will run slower

Do you mean Mac OS X on a PC? (I don't mean to be pedantic, just clarifying.)
True. It will also be buggier, and you risk bricking the machine when the next update comes out.

14 January 2011, 7:37 PM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

mastershadow2005 (New user):

Well i know how to properly operate windows so i don't run into those problems. But have fun on your dumbed down mac, i hear its easy for those simple people.

11 March 2011, 10:38 AM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

gunz (New user):

I agree with many of these annoyances and "Inconveniences" especially the wifi button and clatter of windows. Although this is true, i still much rather use Windows for a large number more of programs and applications you can download, as well as the ability to play high spec games.

22 March 2011, 4:02 AM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

gunz (New user):

I agree with many of these annoyances and "Inconveniences" especially the wifi button and clatter of windows. Although this is true, i still much rather use Windows for a large number more of programs and applications you can download, as well as the ability to play high spec games.

22 March 2011, 4:05 AM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

gunz (New user):

I agree with many of these annoyances and "Inconveniences" especially the wifi button and clatter of windows. Although this is true, i still much rather use Windows for a large number more of programs and applications you can download, as well as the ability to play high spec games.

22 March 2011, 4:05 AM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Will44isme (New user):

Look... Anyone one who posts negative comments on this subject is either working for Microsoft, or can't afford a Mac (no offence!). Mac OSX is simpily brilliant to use, with so many great apps (I love iMovie!). It's system is great, the icons are all HD (unlinke window's pixelated style) and the whole thing is just much better!

23 March 2011, 2:35 AM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

SteveL114 (New user):

Say what you want, numbers don't lie. Why are 85% of the PC's in the world Windows based? Eh!

23 March 2011, 11:26 AM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Barnacules (New user):

Today I purchased my first Mac. A 17" MacBook Pro Core i7 with 8GB. I must say I am impressed beyond belief. I am running Parallels with Windows 7 64bit on bootcamp and I never had any idea everything could run this fast on a laptop of all things. I'm very pleased. The apple experience however was horrible. It took me 2 days and 5 hours of constant mistakes at the Apple store before me and my laptop came home. I almost just said screw it and wanted a refund but stuck with it and I must say I'm glad i did because this is one powerful, well built and awesome machine. I also have been slamming OSX for years saying that it is crap and I need to retract that statement right now. OSX is a fantastic OS and there is a lot Microsoft could learn from Apple.

23 March 2011, 6:49 PM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

AndrewPCWire (New user):

Comparing an Apple computer to a Windows computer with similar specs, Windows costs less by... well, a lot. I know how to get rid of those stupid pop-up thingies, and make my computer faster by getting rid of all those processes running in the background. I think I'll save my $1000 to buy an over-sized i-Pod touch... Lameness free, eh?

19 April 2011, 3:16 PM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

idealist (New user):


I'm not a guru (I was, some years ago, but times have changed), but having started with a Commodore Vic-20, and gone through DOS in all its incarnations, then Linux (Slackware, 10 floppy disk images) and Unix and EVERY version of Windows, on all kinds of hardware, to building and running university servers, I HAVE to admit to the unmitigated JOY of buying my first Mac.

It's a 21.5" iMac, and from the moment of opening the box, I felt more positive about THIS computer than I had about any other.

I feel the same way today.

Yes, the interface is slightly different, and takes some getting used to, but in the main, it just WORKS.

And the screen is magnificent.

And yes, I too, have some Windows apps I NEED to run. So I installed Parallels virtualisation software and Windows 7. And just for the heck of it, DOS 6.22. (Anyone got a copy of OS/2 Warp?).

At 63, I am no longer a power user, but I still use two Windows laptops as well, one of which I am typing this on. So I'm no Apple fanboy. I think some of Apple's business practices are a bit dodgy, and can't understand people who would queue around the block to be the first to buy a new iToy for God's sake...) but their hardware and software is first class, in my opinion.

Another point in their favour, though, Apple software upgrades are MUCH cheaper. Why then does Micro$oft charge such ridiculously high prices for Windows versions...?

And another small point I'd like to make. I personally believe Macs tend to make one more productive, in the sense that most Windows users (mea culpa!) tend to spend a LOT of time "fiddling" and "tweaking". (Sometimes this is the cause of problems Windows users complain about.) Macs don't generally encourage this, as there is less opportunity to do it.

All the above are PERSONAL opinions, from someone who has been 20 years in the I.T. industry, and been playing with computers since 1981.



22 April 2011, 10:23 AM (2 years ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

AIheg (User):

I think 13 should be 1. and 2 shouldn't exist. If your PC takes ages to boot its your fault. W7 boots faster than Snow Leopard and Lion on both my 2010 Mac mini and my brands spanking new iMac. And yes, I do shut them down, because OSX is a memory whore and it seems like the only way to get it to clean itself up is a reboot.

And I built it in 2008.

21 August 2011, 2:11 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

alonzomarkkenneth (New user):

Can you help me answer this question

How Operating Systems Software differ from other software?

25 September 2011, 2:04 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

alonzomarkkenneth (New user):

Can you help me answer this question

How Operating Systems Software differ from other software?

25 September 2011, 2:06 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

calambanga (New user):

Wow you have a very good taste in computers realizing that those cheap, worthless computers (windows) sucks compared to the superior macs

26 October 2011, 3:08 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Blatos (New user):

1.
Entirely correct as long as you overlook the sleep/standby feature on a PC, that works very well.
2.
Firstly, they only use vista as an example. Vista is obsolete. Lets take a look at many of the holder OS X's and see how they perform shall we? Windows 7 beats the latest OS X in load-up time in every test, google it. Too much bloated GUI weighing it down.
3.
Again, google it, many, MANY articles about the "quality" parts apple uses.
4.
Thats the only place a Mac will beat SOME pcs, which is in looks. And don't forget you are easily paying twice the price for looks in a Mac than a pc with the same specs. And don't forgot aesthetics is subjective, so looks cant be looked at as a pro/con. lrn2argument.
5.
This is not an argument. I can just as easily say that OS X and windows is better than just OS X. lrn2argument
6.
Really? Activity monitor = task manager. Console = command prompt. Disk utility = disk utility + loads of other diagnostic tools for windows, significantly fewer for macs.
7.
This one makes me weep. Visualhub = less user friendly version of hundreds of other conversion tools. Adium = cluttered pidgin. Onepassword = port of the original onepassword which was for windows, also keypass which encrypts passwords, all accessible with one password. There are 2 of other crapty programs listed, which im not going to bother explaining. Equivalents in order: ANY FTP program, control panel ffs.
8.
link this to point 10. "Crap" is subjective, i think all the programs he listed are crap and would load up the system with crap. Again, lrn2argument.
9.
Another weepworthy one. Control panel you verbally incontinent imbeciles.
10.
refer to 8
11.
I guess the print screen button is old and outdated.
HOLY crap BATMAN! THEY HAVE A PROGRAM THAT IS ALWAYS REPLACED BY PS! ITS STILL GOOD THOUGH ITS NEVER USED!
maybe alt+tab is terrible, but ever try win+tab your ignorant lemming?
CLEARLY they havent seen the win7 taskbar, which is functionally the same. I'm going to reuse an insult here because it fits well a second time. IGNORANT LEMMING!
CONGRATULATIONS! YOU HAVE REDUCED YOUR R20000 MAC TO A R1000 EXTERNAL. Oh, and google something called lan (wired or -less).
This makes no sense to mac or windows users. Calmly ignore this point and move on.
12.
Why? because the majority of people who use computers use windows. You're not going to steal things from a minority, its easier from a majority. The flip side to having fewer viruses for macs, is that each virus is 10 times more potent as OS X isnt experienced enough. And third point is the writer is a dick. How the hell does slowing down your own car help another cars wheels stay on. A more accurate analogy is that of a police department that doesn't prevent crime as long as it doesn't affect them. Wouldn't that PD be lovely?
13.
For the FOURTH fricking time, lameness is subjective. lrn2argument. And secondly, it doesnt seem like apple has any lame ideas, most of their "good" ideas are just recycled ideas from other companies that were considered lame. The reason why they are successful is because they have a following of ignorant cash-vomiters.
14.
So PS is the only weakness? Darn, i better change OS's then. And the gimp interface isnt up to scratch? That made me have a stroke from the laughter. Takes about an average of ten minutes to learn the GUI, so if you can't do that you must have total brain cell count of three.
15.
My god. Does this point really need rebutting? lrn2google you moronic elitist.

30 October 2011, 10:48 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

n0xx (New user):

Couldn't agree more. As an IT professional for more than 15 years, i would say Macintosh > Windows even more now. Now don't get me wrong, i do use various OS for my work : Windows (XP, Vista, 7), Linux (Fedora, Ubuntu, Backtrack), Macintosh (10.4 Tiger -10.7 Lion), but all of the reasons stated here in this article are mostly still valid for me in the real world.
Like i always say it, you can use a Mac to fix a Windows PC, but you can't use a Windows PC to fix a Mac.

01 December 2011, 10:09 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

n0xx (New user):

Couldn't agree more. As an IT professional for more than 15 years, i would say Macintosh > Windows even more now. Now don't get me wrong, i do use various OS for my work : Windows (XP, Vista, 7), Linux (Fedora, Ubuntu, Backtrack), Macintosh (10.4 Tiger -10.7 Lion), but all of the reasons stated here in this article are mostly still valid for me in the real world.
Like i always say it, you can use a Mac to fix a Windows PC, but you can't use a Windows PC to fix a Mac.

01 December 2011, 10:10 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

n0xx (New user):

Couldn't agree more. As an IT professional for more than 15 years, i would say Macintosh > Windows even more now. Now don't get me wrong, i do use various OS for my work : Windows (XP, Vista, 7), Linux (Fedora, Ubuntu, Backtrack), Macintosh (10.4 Tiger -10.7 Lion), but all of the reasons stated here in this article are mostly still valid for me in the real world.
Like i always say it, you can use a Mac to fix a Windows PC, but you can't use a Windows PC to fix a Mac.

01 December 2011, 10:10 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

n0xx (New user):

Couldn't agree more. As an IT professional for more than 15 years, i would say Macintosh > Windows even more now. Now don't get me wrong, i do use various OS for my work : Windows (XP, Vista, 7), Linux (Fedora, Ubuntu, Backtrack), Macintosh (10.4 Tiger -10.7 Lion), but all of the reasons stated here in this article are mostly still valid for me in the real world.
Like i always say it, you can use a Mac to fix a Windows PC, but you can't use a Windows PC to fix a Mac.

01 December 2011, 10:11 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Tattle Tale (New user):

Oh, maybe all that I said could be boiled down to the fact that with Windows, the user has an abundance of software and hardware options and customisability. Often, those users who express frustrations with Windows are frustrated because they bought something that was of poor quality or didn't know their options. In that sense, perhaps you have to be more savvy or smarter for Windows to work for you?

But oh well, I've used Windows and really never had a problem with it... conversely, I'm surrounded by Mac users who vacillate between boasting about their Macs and complaining about it.

23 December 2011, 3:33 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

NateDawg (New user):

i could build a PC comperable to a $1400 mac for roughly $350-$500. No mention of that in the article. And with overhauling extending the life of the PC well beyond the macs life span saves even more rediculous money. If you dont like money, buy a mac. FYI, i hate microsoft just as much as apple but facts are facts

30 December 2011, 1:33 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

NateDawg (New user):

THE only reason mac's dont get viruses because so little people have them. It has nothing to do with mac security. Virus programers are smart (though evil). Why spend all that time writing a virus for a computer percentage wise no one uses. Trust me, if everyone went out and bought a mac like mac lovers suggest, you would see a surge of mac viruses. If you honestly think that mac "security" is the reason why they dont get viruses, you have no clue about the how and why people right viruses..

30 December 2011, 1:49 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

DaDro159 (New user):

To be honest, I have used Apple computers and they just suck in EVERY aspect, I have a custom built PC that I built two weeks ago and it is 1/4th the price of an Apple MAC Pro and beats it to shame when compared to processing power, boot speed, RAM, application launch. you name it it beats it. Apple is just the name... I do like my iPhone though :D

31 December 2011, 9:16 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

DaDro159 (New user):

Ok everyone, to be honest I have used Apple MACs as equally as Windows Computers and I just have to say one thing, They suck. They sell you extremely expensive software on an under-powered piece of plastic/aluminum. Last week I built myself a custom computer that was 1/4th the price of a MAC Pro desktop and beats it in every aspect (Processing Power, RAM, Boot Speed, Application Launch) you name it it beats it. iTunes starts up faster than on a mac, 2 seconds after done booting (which takes 9 seconds from after pressing the power button), even Photoshop starts in 2 seconds, all running on Windows 7 Pro x64... Yeah Apple is nice I like the way they design their products but just too expensive for what you get....I do love my iPhone though :D

31 December 2011, 9:16 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Tolamano (New user):

PC's are much better than Macs:

1. Reliable sleep mode.
HAHAHA. That's baloney! The sleep mode on PC's are no different than the sleep mode on Mac, and even if it is, that is not a good point at all!

2. Extremely fast boot times.

I have used many macs; my friends', at my school... They are all ridiculously slow. They often freeze when using imovie, garageband...

3. Apple uses good quality parts.

WOW. That's actually true. BUT you are paying too much for those parts. THEREFORE: NOT WORTH IT.

4. Less blinking lights.

The only one of 15 points which is true.

5. OS X + Windows is better than just Windows.

Exact same thing on PCs. You can dual boot, have three,four,five operating systems. Whatever you want. In fact, a hard drive is a hard drive: if you have a hdd with windows and macOS, is it different than a hdd with macOS and windows? HAHAHA...Ironic

6. Easier to troubleshoot Macs.

There are more PC users, more community, more support.

7. A culture of good quality community software.

There is 10x more freeware for windows. 10x more users. 10x more support. (aka 10x better)

8. More useful apps out of the box.

I guess technically that's right. However, Once you get it out of the box, there are 10x more software, apps, programs for PC.

9. Neat and contained system settings.

The control panel has everything you need to use to do 'minor' customizations to a PC. However, the System settings are the ONLY customizations you can do on a mac. lol.

10. Apple doesn't load the system up with crap.

Neither does Microsoft. If you have crap software, that is what you installed on you computer.

11. Tonnes of small reasons make Mac OS X better.

-Windows 7 has screen shot too.(print screen) AND you can get FREE software online that can take screen shots.
-windows photo view? ever heard of it? pdf: Adobe Reader: photo editing: many photo editors.
-windows key + tab, control + tab, alt + tab, windows key + d.
-I like the task bar more than the Dock. That is just preference. (and you can get the Dock for Windows)

12. Still no need for additional security software.

I guess so.

13. Apple seems largely to be lameness free.

I think that Apple is really LAME. And I know many other PC user who do also.

14. Power of the Linux command line with Photoshop CS4

Just a list of SOME Photo editor that works amazing with Windows:
Corel Paint Shop Photo Pro
Adobe Photoshop Elements
Serif PhotoPlus
Xara Photo & Graphic Designer
ACDSee Photo Editor
Photo Explosion
Ulead PhotoImpact
Photo Impression
PhotoStudio
Photolightning

Free:
PhotoScape
GIMP for Windows
Paint.NET
Serif PhotoPlus
Photo Pos Pro
Pixia
VCW VicMan's Photo Editor
PhotoFiltre
Ultimate Paint
Picasa

15. File sharing is much easier.

WRONG! I have never had a problem sharing files between PC-PC. The problem comes when someone tries to connect a crappy mac to a pc.

11 January 2012, 2:35 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

windowstomac (New user):

I have to agree with this - after running Windows for years I switched to Mac, and once I had gone through the learning curve I wished I had done it sooner.

B

http://www.windowstomac.net

28 February 2012, 11:53 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

booliminator2 (New user):

15 reasons why this article is not true.

I own a macbook and a PC laptop, hardware wise, my PC is far superior, OS wise my PC is far superior, Quality wise.....you know....my PC is far superior.

1) My macbook has gone into sleep mode(with the power adapter attached) and never come out! Requires the battery to be removed and on the new Macbooks....well good luck with that!

2)Boot time depends on many factors besides the NAME of the computer! RAM, CPU, Harddrive, OS verison, updates, with my experience, my PC boots much faster.

3) The quality of the parts depends on what manufacturer you buy from. "WINDOWS" doesnt make your computer! They make the OS.

4)Blinking lights.....really??? My pc doesn't blink, God help you if you close the lid of your macbook without shutting it off and trying to go to bed because that pretty white LED will remind you that the thing is still alive every 15 seconds.

5)Considering Windows is a much more stable OS (by my experience) there is no reason I need OSX.

6)Actually, if your are technologically illiterate....this is true...Macs are easier to troubleshoot because you CANT troubleshoot most things. My PC requires more troubleshooting but the answer is a Google search away. Easy fix.

7)Apps? When i used my macbook more, I had to search for a software I wanted and then look for one that was made to run OSX, PC has more free applications online than any mac will ever have.

8)I agree, I love iLife, but when it crashes every 15 minutes you won't love it anymore.

9)Neat control panel, i agree once again, but the OSX control panel only allows for basic system changes because apple doesnt want you to change most things.

10) Neither does windows, they only give the OS, the manufacturer adds the extra software and if you don't like that software, you can easily uninstall it.

11)All this nonsense with "tonnes of other reasons..." is just more annoying reasons why OSX is worse. The annoying dock that blocks half of my screen, the usless "expose" thing that bothers you while doing work, non of it is needed.

12)Well if you need a computer to watch porn, get a mac! There are viruses for macs, they do exist, they make virus protection software for macs as well.

13)The fact that this writer uses lame in their article shows their lack of professionalism. At least Windows doesn't make a new OS that costs you $60 every 8 months!

14)I don't use photoshop and i guess i can't fight this point.

15)Windows has homegroup that is MUCH easier to use than the Apple knock off equivalent. I can easily share files to and from all my PC's.

Please disregard this article for all reasons, this guy obviously just bought a cheap PC and blew $2000 on a mac and thinks its the best thing ever. I hope everyone who reads the main article also reads my comment to understand the truth. Thank You.

16 March 2012, 5:50 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

booliminator2 (New user):

15 reasons why this article is not true.

I own a macbook and a PC laptop, hardware wise, my PC is far superior, OS wise my PC is far superior, Quality wise.....you know....my PC is far superior.

1) My macbook has gone into sleep mode(with the power adapter attached) and never come out! Requires the battery to be removed and on the new Macbooks....well good luck with that!

2)Boot time depends on many factors besides the NAME of the computer! RAM, CPU, Harddrive, OS verison, updates, with my experience, my PC boots much faster.

3) The quality of the parts depends on what manufacturer you buy from. "WINDOWS" doesnt make your computer! They make the OS.

4)Blinking lights.....really??? My pc doesn't blink, God help you if you close the lid of your macbook without shutting it off and trying to go to bed because that pretty white LED will remind you that the thing is still alive every 15 seconds.

5)Considering Windows is a much more stable OS (by my experience) there is no reason I need OSX.

6)Actually, if your are technologically illiterate....this is true...Macs are easier to troubleshoot because you CANT troubleshoot most things. My PC requires more troubleshooting but the answer is a Google search away. Easy fix.

7)Apps? When i used my macbook more, I had to search for a software I wanted and then look for one that was made to run OSX, PC has more free applications online than any mac will ever have.

8)I agree, I love iLife, but when it crashes every 15 minutes you won't love it anymore.

9)Neat control panel, i agree once again, but the OSX control panel only allows for basic system changes because apple doesnt want you to change most things.

10) Neither does windows, they only give the OS, the manufacturer adds the extra software and if you don't like that software, you can easily uninstall it.

11)All this nonsense with "tonnes of other reasons..." is just more annoying reasons why OSX is worse. The annoying dock that blocks half of my screen, the usless "expose" thing that bothers you while doing work, non of it is needed.

12)Well if you need a computer to watch porn, get a mac! There are viruses for macs, they do exist, they make virus protection software for macs as well.

13)The fact that this writer uses lame in their article shows their lack of professionalism. At least Windows doesn't make a new OS that costs you $60 every 8 months!

14)I don't use photoshop and i guess i can't fight this point.

15)Windows has homegroup that is MUCH easier to use than the Apple knock off equivalent. I can easily share files to and from all my PC's.

Please disregard this article for all reasons, this guy obviously just bought a cheap PC and blew $2000 on a mac and thinks its the best thing ever. I hope everyone who reads the main article also reads my comment to understand the truth. Thank You.

16 March 2012, 5:50 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Cridifer (New user):

You're fricking retarded. 15 reasons why all your arguments are invalid.
1. My PC was as expensive as my roomates Mac. I use sleep mode constantly, and have not once had a problem with it. The only reason I even bother turning off my computer is because it boots in a couple of seconds, so it feel pretty redudant to leave it on with that speed.
2. See above.
3. Hold the frick on. Mac uses quality parts? I'm fairly certain that they use roughly the same parts, and charge about 1.7 times as much for them. I'm pretty sure you're a fricking idiot talking out of your ass here.
4. Blinking lights, huh? You want to bitch about lights? Your annoying ass macs have a light in the back, so when I'm trying to sleep, and my roomate wants to use his Mac, there's no way he can position himself to avoid waking me up .Thanks for the fricking apple symbol in the back. So you're one to talk.
5. Really? I like the justifications you provided in your arguemnt. Do you know a damn fricking thing about operating systems, or, are you talking out of your ass?
6. Easy huh? It''s easy to troubleshoot? Cause I haven't met the Mac user that even knows what troubleshooting is, let alone how to do it. All I ever hear is bitching aobut how it doesn't work. Sorry, I figure my own problems, google is the best troubleshooter by far, I'm not dumb enough to ask the machine.
7. I mean, I guess this argument is valid, considering that almost nothing is compatible with Mac, obviously the good choices are few and easy to find. I mean, it would be hard to choose from the plethora of window compatible programs, but then again, I like my choices. Apparently you don't- no doubt why you made this article.
8. Well, sorry, but I actually kind of enjoy customizing my PC. Of course, you, being an ape-minded Mac user, want everything set up. Honestly, the first thing I do when i get a PC is uninstall all the unnescary programs, and then install all the badass ones.
9. Once again, we have choices. You leave out that most (I'm fairly certain ALL) of the system settings can be changed in control panel in both OSs, its just that windows has more options. And you want to talk wireless? Tell that to my roomate, every 3 days he has to reinput the security code to access our internet. Awesome, Mac.
10. If your desktop looked like that while you had a "real" computer, then I completely understand. You're one of those fricktards that don't know how to not play myspace games and click on random links. Well, Mac is perfect for you then. It never spends time loading unnescary programs because it never kills unneeded tasks to begin with.
11. None of these are correct, the last one especially is laughable, and proves how little you know.
12. Prepare yourself, Mac user. I have some math for you. If a windows pc costs $1000, and its mac equivalent costs $1700, the most you will ever spend is $100/year (And that's an overestimate). So after 7 fricking years, the Mac is a better deal. Of course, holding onto a laptop for 5 years is unlikely for either brand, so really, you're actually saving money. And that 200 dollars extra spent on processing power will free up memory so that you're not screwed over by the virus scans. So at BEST, it's an equal deal. I pay 30 dollars annually, and my computer is $3000. If I had bought the Mac Equivalent, it would take 70 years to be a better deal. And by that point, I would be protecting something that wouldn't run.
13. Way to go hipster fag. You think people dying in China and all that crap is lameness free? Sorry, I think not being able to use flash on my Ipod is pretty lame. Most people would agree. So Get stuffedr rubbish reason.
14. I really don't use photoshop. And unlike you, Mac user, I refuse to talk out of my ass. So I will be silent when I don't know what the frick I am talking about (had you followed this logic, this article wouldn't exist.
15. No, it's not. File sharing is hard as frick on Macs. Buisnesses use windows for a good fricking reason. I'm not even going to go there.

I'm not an anomynous flamer. And I'm not by any means a Window's fan boy. I just have computer common sense.

27 April 2012, 3:02 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

iCFX (New user):

Article Author is most likely a uneducated sheep that has no idea what he/she is talking about. Please go get educated before spitting trash. My £3000 workstation and a £1200 day to day machine will destroy any Mac out there, from benchmarks to software availability to running a intensive task. This is coming from a MB Air and iMac owner.

What a utter sheer moron.


28 April 2012, 2:23 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

iCFX (New user):

Article Author is most likely a uneducated sheep that has no idea what he/she is talking about. Please go get educated before spitting trash. My £3000 workstation and a £1200 day to day machine will destroy any Mac out there, from benchmarks to software availability to running a intensive task. This is coming from a MB Air and iMac owner.

What a utter sheer moron.


28 April 2012, 2:24 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

iCFX (New user):

Article Author is most likely a uneducated sheep that has no idea what he/she is talking about. Please go get educated before spitting trash. My £3000 workstation and a £1200 day to day machine will destroy any Mac out there, from benchmarks to software availability to running a intensive task. This is coming from a MB Air and iMac owner.

Only 30% of this can be debated with valid statistics and other 65% is pure nonsense and last 5% person preference.

What a utter sheer moron.


28 April 2012, 2:24 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

homo 1 (New user):

I have no comment


09 May 2012, 2:38 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

homo 1 (New user):

I have no comment


09 May 2012, 2:48 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

homo 1 (New user):

I have no comment ...commenting is stupid..y would comment if u have nothing important to say ...see I'm not gunna comment cuz its stupid and there is nothing to say .. Only stupid people would comment on this ........ If u have something important to say just ....... Say it to yourself

09 May 2012, 2:48 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

homo 1 (New user):

I have a mangina

09 May 2012, 2:48 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

iCFX (New user):

You are Crazy, stop spamming. Social Retardation Support -----> that way.

09 May 2012, 3:03 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

icanfly (New user):

The one thing that puts me off Mac OS is that it just looks so basic. I mean all menus and text and simple black and white. Dialog boxes etc simple colours. Very simplistic. I guess that's what people like going for but I still love the UI of Windows with lots of use of colour, animations, icons, etc etc.. Not a valid reason why which OS is better I know but cosmetically Windows 7 is beautiful compared to Mac OS black and white arial text theming..

10 May 2012, 11:46 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

SteveNZ (New user):

think your full of it everything you just said is as easy if not easy-er to do on windows sounds to me like your just another apple snob

20 May 2012, 5:38 PM (12 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

rahul702 (New user):

I own both, a windows computer(Toshiba satellite) and a "state of the art" iMac 27.5". Regarding what's better...

"1. Reliable sleep mode"...you're a complete idiot if you think Windows doesn't have a reliable one. Been using it on my computer since forever and have had no problems. And yes I have used an apple and am familiar with the instant on speeds on both the systems. To say the least, they are identical if not nearly identical.

"3. Apple uses good quality parts" You have to be kidding me. The macbooks they used to make were made from plastic ALL OVER. Even the low end PC laptops have metal rims. The result...I have seen macbooks like they were hurricane victims. Now...you might claim that that is the reason Apple discontinued that product..well..Apple has been claiming to use good quality parts since way before they launched the macbook. Besides, ever been to an Apple store and checked out the 27.5" imac(the most expensive imac)...it runs SERIOUSLY hot. You might think that the ones in the store have been on all day and that is the reason. Not true, I do only light computing and it still gets hot(seriously hot). I am now regretting my purchase. And no I don't have a defective piece. I know this because I exchanged the one I first bought thinking it was defective, but that wasn't the case.

And how is it that no one has ever mentioned on forums like these that the pain caused by uninstalling a program on a mac is the equivalent of sticking needles in your eyes. You have to literally go to all locations and physically delete the programs.

Here is another reason why mac's suck. Usability: Resizing windows...Mac users and Apple inc. are constantly boasting about the design factor involved in macs...well design in not just limited to aesthetics. Usability is a major design factor. Nearly everyone multi-tasks and windows 7 comes with the aero theme....while mac is still lagging in developing a regular maximize/minimize button. Don't give me that line..."you can always buy an app"...I spent $1700 on a computer which claims it is the most advanced OS in the world. The why would I have to buy an app which imitates the capability of an "inferior" OS.

Now regarding the desktops feature...you can't close them all at once. If there is an open window in an added desktop and you try to close it, the window goes into the other desktop. Now I again would like to raise a design principle issue: Why would a user close a desktop if he would still want to use the windows on it? You can't even move a windows from one desktop to the next. Also, if you have safari in full screen and navigate back to another desktop, you can not open a new safari window from that desktop, you are re-directed to the safari window. The same applies to most full screen apps.

I could go on forever...but I have some work to be done.

28 May 2012, 7:25 AM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

christian prag (New user):

right now im on a 6gb, i5 prossesor, radeon 6750 graphics card, 620gb or hard drive space for about 700 dollars in a pc, for a mac that would cost more than double!!!! ya psh say macs are better and they arent and i have a mac and preferably prefer the pc cause its faster. you will need to get all of those worthless piceces of retarted software off first, and the start time is still faster. 26 seconds to start up and open google chrome while my mac took 2 minutes 3 seconds!!!! go with the pc

04 June 2012, 11:12 AM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Ruth Walker (New user):

I AM KINA SKITISH ABOUT BUYING A DESTOP COMPUTER. I BOUGHT AN HP THINKING IT WAS GOOD., FROM FRY'S ELECTRONICS. I WAS CONSIDERING REPORTING THEM TO BBB. THEY WOULDN'T GIVE ME MY $ BACK. NOW, I HAD IT FOR A YR IT WAS CRASHIING SO OFTEN AND IT WAS 8 G. WITHIN 1 YR I HAD MY HARD DRIVE WIPED 2 X ... NOW, THAT IS NOT A GOOD COMPUTER. I WENT DOWN TO FRY'S AND RAISED HELL., I WANT A DELL, I HAD 1 BEFORE AND IT NEVER GAVE ME TROUBLE. BUT, I LOVE TO MAKE MOVIE'S INTO VIDEOS, CAUSE MU DAUGHTER AND MY NIECE ARE SINGERS. I BURN DISKES AND GET ON FACEBOOK THAT IS IT. I GET MY $ BACK TOMORROW TUESDAY THE 5TH OF JUNE. I DO NOT LIKE WINDOWS 7 ... IT SEEMS TO CRASH MORE OFTEN. I HAVE BEEN FAMILAR WITH COMPUTERS FOR ABOUT 16-20 YRS. BUT, I'M NOT SURE IF WINDOWS XP MAKES MOVIES AND VIDEOS. BUT, I CAN GET THE SOFTWARE ... MY EMAIL ADDRESS IS: thisisawrap@yahoo.com PLEASE GET BACK TO ME SOON THANK YOU, RUTH WAL;KER

05 June 2012, 3:27 PM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

iCFX (New user):

Too many brain dead idiots on these forums. Get you machine assembled or do it your self and you have a strong machine without hickcups (unless you are demented imbecile which clicks on virus.exe) and the machine will blow any mac out there out of the water, you simply cannot argue this.

Oh wait, I can install hackintosh as well, oh snap oh and Linux and pretty much any other OS.... Yep I win.

05 June 2012, 7:57 PM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

SteveNZ (New user):

Personally windows wins no question I can run most programs on winXP or windows 7 my experiences with Mac is you cant run anything that's more than 3 months old you have to have the latest OS and the latest version of the app. I has a I-phone with my last job I synced it regularly then I broke it got a replacement from the insurance tried to sync it wouldn't let me the replacement I-Phone had the latest OS on it told me my version of I-Tunes was to old at that time I lived in a area ware Broadband wasn't available 3 days to DL the latest I-Tunes on dial up What a joke not everyone has to money or internet access to have the latest at least with windows I can run anything on anything

14 June 2012, 4:38 PM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

MrUnicorn12 (New user):

People always complain about the MacBook pro; it's too slow, the screen isn't HD, and it's not thin. Then apple released the new Pro. Deal. With. It. . http://www.apple.com/macbook-pro/

17 June 2012, 12:05 AM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Person who knows more then you (New user):

i agree completely, Microsoft is failing and there slowly dyeing if anyone has cared to realize this, apple is the future people, unlike windows they don't spend 30$ dollars on materials for computers ment to break the next month so you are forced to buy another and build unrepairable parts that they quickly outdate so it cannot be sold again so you are forced to poor money into it, with dirty business practices like that windows will die and there end is only a few years away, before you write a negative review to this comment look for yourself the value of apple vs Microsoft apple is worth several 100 times what Microsoft is and going up wail Microsoft is falling apart

27 June 2012, 4:17 AM (10 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Cridifer (New user):

Most of the fricktards that buy Macs are dissatisfied with a crapty computer that they bought for less than $1000 they then spend over $1000 on a new mac and think they are incredible. You guys are fricking retarded.
Apple is the only one that makes Macs, so obviously Windows users have less control over what parts other companies put into their machines. And an FYI, usually they're the same fricking parts. So those of you that are bitching about how "cheap" their parts are are truly fricking retarded.

27 June 2012, 4:29 AM (10 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Kanea (New user):

All of this is completely true. I have both macs and pcs all my life, and in that time, I have needed to change 8 different pcs, when all my four macs still work great and have not died once. I've never gotten viruses, I have played any game that I could on the PC and I don't get annoying pop ups every five minutes telling me to buy something.

01 July 2012, 8:11 AM (10 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Kanea (New user):

All of this is completely true. I have both macs and pcs all my life, and in that time, I have needed to change 8 different pcs, when all my four macs still work great and have not died once. I've never gotten viruses, I have played any game that I could on the PC and I don't get annoying pop ups every five minutes telling me to buy something.

01 July 2012, 8:13 AM (10 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Kanea (New user):

All of this is completely true. I have both macs and pcs all my life, and in that time, I have needed to change 8 different pcs, when all my four macs still work great and have not died once. I've never gotten viruses, I have played any game that I could on the PC and I don't get annoying pop ups every five minutes telling me to buy something.

01 July 2012, 8:16 AM (10 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

AIheg (User):

Did anyone notice that this was such a poorly disguised advert that they put Bush's face on the PC and Obama's on the Mac at a pre-election time when everyone loved Obama and hated Bush.

05 July 2012, 12:23 PM (10 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Windows dominates (New user):

Macs are bad, just face it. For the price you could buy a mac you could get a super computer, and for viruses you can get free security check ( microsoft security essentials). Also the £1500 imac which has an i5 processor and 4gbs of ram and 1tb hard drive. For that I could get a speedy i5 3570k which out performs this by a lot, I also could get 16 gbs of ram all at 1600mhz. As for the graphics cards, they are meant for little netbooks and you could replace this with a nvidia gtx 690 and I would still be £500 clear of the price for a mac. Furthermore I could even go into the stage of watercooling and have loads of power in it and you only need £160 for windows 7 ultimate and it's easy to install! I hope you take this in and please stop using a mac and just get a pc they can be better for the price of a mac!

17 December 2012, 2:17 AM (5 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Windows dominates (New user):

Macs are bad, just face it. For the price you could buy a mac you could get a super computer, and for viruses you can get free security check ( microsoft security essentials). Also the £1500 imac which has an i5 processor and 4gbs of ram and 1tb hard drive. For that I could get a speedy i5 3570k which out performs this by a lot, I also could get 16 gbs of ram all at 1600mhz. As for the graphics cards, they are meant for little netbooks and you could replace this with a nvidia gtx 690 and I would still be £500 clear of the price for a mac. Furthermore I could even go into the stage of watercooling and have loads of power in it and you only need £160 for windows 7 ultimate and it's easy to install! I hope you take this in and please stop using a mac and just get a pc they can be better for the price of a mac!

17 December 2012, 2:18 AM (5 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

DanWarneIsFuckingStupid (New user):

1. No, OS X fails to even resume majority of the time when left off for more than a couple hours.
2. Boot times are longer with windows as all required services (DirectX, svc, etc) are loaded at boot and not on program launch as *nix and BSD retardations do.
3. No. They use a company called Foxconn who is always a generation behind on manufacturing anything and has the HIGHEST suicide rate of workers for any "sweatshop".
4. That's the manufacturer choice. Indicator lights are useful, very useful.
5. If OS X is so important why is the #1 downloaded program BootCamp? Why does Photoshop CS5 for Windows work better on a Mac than Photoshop CS5 for OS X?
6. Same tools available for Windows, most of them were on earlier versions of windows first. cmd/powershell, disk management, task manager, and many MORE.
7. So... iTunes is good quality software? The piece of software that has 0 optimization and even on top-end machines freezes (both OSes). Lets not forget OS 9.
8. No.
9. Menus such a hard thing to navigate? Remember windows 95? It was ALL THERE. Same settings, if not easier to modify on 7.
10. That isn't Window's fault but that of retailers, e.g. BestBuy, Dick Smith and sometimes manufactures, e.g. HP, ASUS, Acer that have contracts in which they are paid money to ship their computers with trial software, of which now there is almost none, even on store machines.
11. No. Want a stupid dock? Download RocketDock.
12. You have no use for security BECAUSE you have minimal market share. You seem to lack any knowledge of how attacks are carried out, a lot of the time it's not the fault of the OS. Although web based, look at XSS.
13. "Apple is a recipe company" - Logan, TekSyndicate. UAC is modifiable, but of course you were too stupid to figure that out. Look at what Microsoft R&D is working on compared to Apple, simple google search.
14. No. And WINE can run CS5/6 fine. See #5.
15. Oh and what was this adopted from? Oh yeah, Windows XP.

I have no problems with Macs in general, as I myself have an i7 MacBook Air solely for iOS app development when on the road. However I DO have a major problem with people like you who pretend to have even the vaguest idea of what they're talking about then there wouldn't be stupid articles like this misleading others.

As well, watch: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wFeC25BM9E0



07 January 2013, 11:17 AM (4 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

loc_luke (New user):

Get stuffed. mac fanboys are frickin snobs. Windows fanboys: make it professional, allow tweaking, provide a variety of different hardware suiting different budgets and preferences, give me the option to upgrade almost all my hardware. Mac fanboys: oh make it pretty. Nuff frickin said, i'm out. one

08 January 2013, 7:00 AM (4 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Jack1998blue (New user):

1. You're doing it wrong
2. £1000 pc could kick a mac's ass at boot times
3. Apple uses good quality parts- Hahaha, I lost it!
4.Filler
5.Windows with OS > OS with Windows
6.Implying you can't just fix a pc by typing the problem into google.
Also, more powerful task manager- I actually lolled at that
7.Well done, you just listed 50% of the applications that you can run on OS
8.Your a moron, you get sticky notes on a windows pc, stopped reading after that
9.You can do the exact same thing on windows, moving along...
10.The lack of a good startup programs function is a con not a pro, you can always configure it to not load the things up, you know
11. I'll give you the first one but 2 and 3 are standard on windows, 4 is annoying, you cant fill the screen with a window.5, yay, now I have a £1000 external hard drive with barely any memory
12. Not valid, macs can get viruses as easy, its just that the people who make viruses don't waste there time with macs, as well as the fact macs only make up 5% of the market.
13.Apple maps :D
14.With a mac you get the power of a potato
15.Homegroup on windows

Sorry, but is it really worth paying 3 times as much for something when you can barely come up with any good reasons why?
People who buy macs need to stop, let Apple die...
/rant

21 January 2013, 10:16 PM (3 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

J876 (User):

These circular arguments keep going on for years and years and I am sick of it.

In my opinion IBM compatible PCs are better than macs or the following reasons:

In general, when you buy a PC you can replace upgrade parts easily, PC makers (the good ones anyway) don't do dodgy practices like solder RAM onto motherboards like Apple does with their laptops.

Apple discourages users to tinker with their computer and learn something they rule their software stores with iron fists and stop developers from making software that may be remotely counterintuitive to the Apple walled garden philosophy. With Windows and Linux, there is more freedom and choice in software and users can in most cases install whatever they like without big Apple telling them they can't.

The recent crop of Apple computers (besides the retina displays) have identical motherboards, chipsets, graphics cards and CPUs as the IBM compatible counterparts. Quality Intel and nVidia parts not Apple parts. Remember those rubbish PowerPC processors laptops that cook your laps? Another quality product from Apple.

The OS cost is incorporated the price of the Macs that is why they cost more than PCs. That teaser price is a marketing ploy. There is no such thing as a free lunch in business, people need to get paid.

As macs gain popularity more security holes in OSX will be exposed and exploited there have been some recent Apple targeted attacks of late.

A computer is only as good as the person is at operating it. The amount of times I had people asking me for help with Apple stuff is about the same as Windows. Apple stuff breaks too and Apple users are just as smart or dumb as Windows users are.

Also, before the Apple fanatics start foaming at the mouth with the malware arguments. If users are more careful on the Internet and understand that it is a lawless place people will actually read before they click and take necessary steps to secure their computers and data no matter what brand they use.

People need to get a life, it’s a free market and people will buy whatever they want anyway.

06 March 2013, 2:10 PM (2 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

FlyingPies155 (New user):

You don't need antivirus software on a Mac because there aren't many programs, which includes viruses, for Macs, the stuff on the desktop there is because you installed a ton of crap, Windows's settings are just as good, if not better than, a Mac's. Blinking lights depend on the computer you buy or build. The command prompt in Windows doesn't need to be fancy. How many people who use computers just for regular things at home or work would actually use the command prompt? And why can't you install a Mac OS on a PC? And from the price my friend who loves Apple gave me, Macs are 3x the price of a good Windows laptop. If you can't tell from all that, I hate Apple more than almost anything I can think of right now.

22 March 2013, 10:52 AM (1 month ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

kkdsfasf (New user):

He says that he isn't taking account for people who build from scratch. So why not just build from scratch it's much cheaper and you really get to choose what kind of performance you perfer. Personally though windows manufactured computers are a hard bet you really to find one that is made well and dosen't include poorly made choices on the manufactuers part. Saying that windows is bad just because some manufacturer put a bunch of crappy lights and made a bad design that you didn't like is like say that a banna is bad after picking one spoiled one out of a pile of sixty. I see why people enjoy macs though because apple is the only manufacterer of mac computer which makes it easy to find a good one. But the fact that he is claiming mac is better because of a bunch of design issues and never speaking of performance is a poor choice for the price you pay for a mac you should be getting much better performace not just design.

11 April 2013, 2:27 AM (1 month ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

pavan532 (New user):

what about software compatibility in mac os x....... is it better than windows xp,7

and one thing that all developers almost try to develop their programmes for windows not for ma os x.....


I am a user of MAC OS X 10.8.3 , WINDOWS 8 , FREEBSD , DEBIAN......


i think unix have more powers lol.....

14 May 2013, 5:40 AM (6 days ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

anonymous user Anonymous user