15 reasons Macs are still better than Windows PCs

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Dan Warne14 November 2008, 10:19 PM

With Windows 7 coming up, it's time to yet again ponder on whether Microsoft has the upper hand in operating systems. Here's 15 reasons it doesn't.



A journalist colleague of mine recently put this question out there:

"I'm sure I'll either get ignored or flamed for this but what's with all the pro-Mac stuff at the moment? It seems as though everyone […] is either using or recommending Macs these days.

I'm not wanting to start a flame war here but I'm genuinely interested in why this general shift has occurred.

Do people think Vista is truly that awful that they can't use it or even recommend a normal Windows desktop/notebook? I use it every day and I admit I don't like it much either but I don't think it's that bad that I'd jump to using or recommending a Mac instead..."

I long ago stopped actively seeking out Mac vs PC discussions (partly because Macs are now PCs -- so the argument is more about Mac OS X vs Windows vs Linux than a proprietary Mac architecture vs an x86 PC architecture), but I still find it confounding that after all these years, people still don't know the basics of the upsides of Macs and OS X. Perhaps it's because of the tiresome arguments from people like this.

So here's my answer. Note, despite what I said above about the argument really being between operating systems these days, I've looked at Macs as a hardware and software combination in this article, pitted against regular PCs running Windows.

Do you agree/disagree with the points here? Tell me why -- but make sure your points are solidly argued, and make sure you read the whole article before flaming me. There's an important bit right at the very bottom.

1. Reliable sleep mode

The killer feature of every Mac which can't be underestimated (and you don't realise how important it is until you own a Mac) is OS X's 100% reliable, near-instant suspend and resume.

Windows PCs have just never had this. Reliability on Windows is hit and miss, and it's nowhere near instant. As a result most people are in the habit of shutting down their PC totally -- or worse, leaving them on 24/7, chewing up power.

The difference between Mac and Windows in this respect is the difference between broadband and dialup internet. Back in the 90s, many people couldn't see the point of paying extra for an always-on internet service, as "it only takes a minute to connect using the dialup…"

I always shake my head in bemusement when I read about Microsoft working on dramatically shortening boot time on Windows. Boot time shouldn't be such a pivotal issue if suspend and resume worked well. Mac users probably reboot their Mac on average about once a month -- and often only to install an OS update. Which leads to my second point.

2. Extremely fast boot times

Rebooting a Windows PC can be such a painful experience that you really procrastinate doing it. Unless you're running on the highest spec hardware, Vista can take minutes to start up.

Mac OS X starts up from a cold boot in about 25 seconds on a current-gen MacBook Pro. As another journalist contributing to the discussion observed, this is not a faked boot speed, where the operating system maker has rushed to get the login window on screen, but delayed loading the rest of the OS. It's a genuine boot-to-usable-desktop time.

3. Apple uses good quality parts.

Aside from the operating system, Mac hardware is usually good quality. Apple's fit and finish doesn't generally bend and creak like the plastic panels on many PC laptops; Apple's keyboards are high quality; Apple selects good quality parts like very good LCD panels for its screens.

You can essentially buy a Mac product sight-unseen and know you'll be happy with the quality of the display, whereas PC laptops are a huge grab bag ranging from horrendous, dim rubbish to spectacular. (I have to admit I personally don't think the basic MacBook screen is of a quality that I would want to buy, but then, I think it's still better than a lot of PC notebook screens.)

4. Less blinking lights.


Apple doesn't festoon its hardware with blinking lights and inconveniently placed wireless on/off buttons, headphone jacks, etc.

PC manufacturers are starting to understand this and are producing increasingly clean designs (The HP 2133, pictured right, is quite a good example), but it's still my #1 bugbear about PC notebooks.

When I'm using my laptop in a dark room at night I don't want five bright purple and orange status lights blinking away at me. And when I'm using the laptop propped up on my legs on the sofa I don't want to be constantly accidentally turning off the WiFi. I don't want the headphone jack mounted on the front of the notebook, because when I plug the headphones in, the jack will be bumping in to my body if I've got the notebook propped up on my knees, lying on the sofa.

This lack of basic design refinement can make PC notebooks annoying to use for the entire lifespan of the unit (and it's not always something you can 'see in the shop before you buy' -- consider how many PCs are corporate-issued, or bought mail-order these days.)

5. OS X + Windows is better than just Windows

Ignoring Linux for a second, on a Mac I can legitimately run OS X and Windows (natively, or under virtualisation). On a PC I can only legitimately run Windows.

It means I can use OS X for everything, but if there's the occasional application for Windows I need to use (specialised company application; MS Access; mobile phone firmware upgrader utilities) I can easily do use Windows.

Another of my colleagues said she's found a good use for OS X's Spaces virtual desktop feature -- OS X on one desktop and Windows on another desktop. Of course, you can always pause a virtual machine, too, which means having Windows on-call when you need it doesn't need to be chewing up CPU time in the background.


6. Easier to troubleshoot Macs.

It's usually pretty easy to figure out what's going wrong with a Mac. There are three applications that help you and are all in one place and easy to find in the Applications/Utilities folder:


  • Activity Monitor (a more powerful version of Windows Task Manager)

  • Console (which shows all system logs in one place)

  • Disk Utility (which helps you identify disk integrity issues).

It's very rare that you can't get a decent hint of where a system problem lies from those three apps. On Windows, similar apps are available in the system, but they're more scattered and immeasurably more difficult for the average user to find.

7. A culture of good quality community software

There's a culture of very good quality freeware/shareware with excellent user interfaces on Mac -- probably a result of Apple leading by example in user-interface design and shareware authors emulating this.

The average Mac user could get away with only purchasing Microsoft Office and using freeware/shareware and Apple provided software for everything else.

On Windows, the signal to noise ratio in freeware/shareware is extremely high. There's so much junk software out there; it can be hard to find a tool that's good quality.

Some examples of exceptionally good shareware which I don't think there's an equivalently good Windows alternative for (taking into account both the software capabilities -and- the front-end GUI):

8. More useful apps out of the box

Every Mac comes with some very useful apps that don't come on Windows. (Of course, you can easily download them for Windows, but ubiquity of app distribution can make or break a platform -- it's why people have never really equated Symbian Series 60 phones with "useful applications".) Useful apps on every Mac:

  • Stickies

  • iPhoto
  • Expose

  • iCal

  • Time Machine.

Yes, this is no barrier to a Windows power user. But remember, the majority of computer users are not power users.

9. Neat and contained system settings.

Apple is very neat with its OS config settings. In Windows, there's many, many places you can change system-wide settings -- the registry, add/remove programs, the hardware manager, the services manager, network connections, control panel, etc.

On a Mac, the OS config settings are basically all in the control panel (with a few exceptions -- notably, the default browser can only be changed through Apple's own Safari browser -- evil.)


It makes both using a Mac and supporting other people using Macs much easier. One specific example: it is overcomplicated to guide a user to editing the TCP/IP settings for a particular network adaptor on Windows, but it's one of the most common things you have to do to resolve network issues. 

But accessing network adaptors is a cinch on Mac OS X...

And TCP/IP settings are easily accessible under "advanced".


10. Apple doesn't load the system up with crap.

Oh sure, Apple festoons its OS with hooks into online services designed to get you to spend money. But on the whole, Apple's festooning with vendor-specific services is much less intrusive than on Windows. -image-

Just about every (brand name) PC sold comes loaded up with junk that keeps popping up at you reminding you your six month trial is about to run out, and some apps are deliberately difficult to uninstall.


Macs come with iPhoto (linked to with Apple's book/photo printing service), MobileMe (stays out of your way unless you specifically activate it), iTunes (to purchase stuff through the iTunes store) and so on. Basically, Apple doesn't try to force its way into your wallet like PCs tend to -- Apple takes a carrot approach with some genuinely useful services rather than a stick ("your PC is our advertising billboard, cough up buddy").

Of course, this isn't a problem with Windows itself per se, but it is inextricably married to the Windows user experience for most people.

11. Tonnes of small reasons make Mac OS X better.

There are a large number of very small reasons a Mac is great to work on:

  • every version of OS X has sophisticated screenshot capability built in. CMD+4 provides a selector marquee. CMD+4+Spacebar takes just one window. CMD+3 takes the whole screen. You can set the format of the screenshot file and where Mac OS saves it.
  • The inbuilt image viewing app is powerful -- it can view PDF and open/export to most other image formats; you can crop, resize, rotate, adjust colour balance, etc.
  • Expose lets you quickly see all your open windows, or your desktop, or just the windows of your current app. Way better than ALT+Tab (which Macs also have) or Flip 3D (which Macs thankfully don't have.)
  • The Dock is much more efficient to use than the Windows start menu and taskbar -- the icon opens an app or returns to it if it's already open. It doesn't become crowded when you have lots of windows open.
  • Target disk mode allows you to boot a Mac into a mode where the whole machine acts like an external hard drive. Plug it to another Mac using Firewire and you have the easiest way in the world to do a system-to-system drive mirror. (Though, disappointingly, Apple didn't include this feature in its latest MacBook.)
  • Quick look lets you view pretty much all major file formats by clicking on the file and pressing the space bar -- no need to wait for an app to launch. Windows simply doesn’t have this.

12. Still no need for additional security software.

On a Mac, you don't have to run additional security software, which therefore doesn't slow down the computer, doesn't cause problems, and you don't have to shell out for an annual subscription for it.

This is an enormously contentious point. Some people will argue black and blue that you need to be a good citizen in the world and make sure you're scanning for Windows viruses on your Mac email in case you accidentally forward on a virus sent from one Windows user, to you, to another Windows user.

My opinion is: if Fords have a problem with their wheels falling off that's never going to be resolved, I'm not going to drive my Holden slowly on every road just because a Ford might find its wheels falling off at any time.

And what's with Microsoft selling OneCare anti-virus? It has decided to make money off selling a fix to a problem in its original product (Windows). That's just offensive.

13. Apple seems largely to be lameness free

On the whole Apple seems to come up with far fewer lame ideas that were non-starters to begin with. Microsoft, on the other hand, is the master of lame ideas. For example, Sideshow in Vista. Windows Ultimate Extras. 10 editions of the same OS. XPS file format to compete with PDF. One size fits all UAC -- "You just tried to change the date. Did you really mean to do that?"

14. Power of the Linux command line with Photoshop CS4

Just for a moment, let me diverge from Mac vs PC and take a look at Mac vs "all the alternatives".

There are a few key apps that are, for many people, 'must-haves'. Microsoft Office. Adobe Reader. Adobe Flash. Photoshop.

Linux can satisfy almost all of those needs. But Photoshop is a sticking point. Although there has been great progress in WINE -- even sponsored by Google --, you can still only run Photoshop CS2 (or CS3 if you're lucky.)

And don't tell me the GIMP is a total Photoshop replacement. I've tried it many times. Its user interface just isn't up to scratch yet.

The reality is, until Adobe really puts its support officially behind Linux (like Google has with Picasa, for example) it's always going to be an uphill battle.

With OS X, you get a polished OS, with the power of a UNIX/Linux command line (not the lame DOS-style prompt of Windows) and the ability to run the latest, officially supported version of Photoshop.

15. File sharing is much easier

Sharing files between computers has always been something that feels like it should be a lot easier than it is. Of course, one of the reasons for this is the need for security, which is opposed to ease of use, because security is about putting up barriers.

But it's also about user interface design. Mac OS hasn't always been easy for sharing between computers; in fact I'd say it's only 10.5 which has got it mostly right. But in 10.5 it actually is easy enough for ordinary users to use -- if you want to share the files on your computer, you switch on file sharing in control panel.

Shared computers on the local network appear in any file management window in OS X like a disk drive -- and when you try to open them, you'll be prompted for a system username and password.

It's the first form of computer file sharing that really puts it in front of the average user's eyes without them having to do anything to get to it.

Whoah, hold up there, anonymous flamer.

Before anyone tries to put words into my mouth: here's what I'm not saying:

  • I'm not saying a Mac is a remotely good choice if you're a career gamer, though there are enough games and adequate performance to satisfy a casual gamer (someone who likes to play a game once a week, isn't involved in the gaming scene and wouldn't know what LOLZ actually meant.)
  • I'm not saying Macs 'just work' and never have problems, because like any computer, they do.
  • I'm not saying hardware compatibility is the same with Macs. There are endless hardware devices that don't have Mac drivers. It's just that there's enough good ones in every category that do have Mac support for it not to be a problem.
  • I'm not saying Macs are for people who like building systems from scratch, or having maximum opportunity to chop and change parts at will.
  • I'm also not saying Apple is a nice company to deal with -- it's not. Its whole corporate ethos seems to be "be smug and arrogant; turn your back and pretend everything's fine, oh and also, polished plastic never gets scratched" as often as possible. (Though frankly, the superior hardware and software goes some of the way in actually allowing them to get away with this, and mostly, the front-end customer service is very good.)
  • I'm not saying that Apple is always good at admitting faults. While it is generally good with warranty if it admits a problem, if it is in denial about a problem, it will sometimes make people wait a year before they will begrudgingly accept the cost of fixing it across the board.
  • And finally, I'm not saying Apple's DRM (which it refuses to share with anyone else) is anything other than a repellant policy, from a company that has a monopoly position.

On balance, though, Macs just let you get stuff done, whereas Windows computers constantly find ways of annoying you.

That's my take on it. What's yours?


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Reader Comments

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Obi-Wan Kenobi (User):

Is it just me or did the last three happen to be "filler" reasons?

14 November 2008, 10:21 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Hemma (User):

Dan, my PC never asked me what's G20.... and The Mac, throws personal insults to the PC (Obama is very different to Justin Long... who is just a dousche). That's just.... nevermind.

15 November 2008, 1:10 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Halcon (Cornerstone member):

Dan, I know you as a journalist have to cover a lot of information, Apple is a very arrogant company.
This company could have been on par with IBM if none of the stupid idiosyncrasies on how to limit the hardware and software for a certain line of product made by Apple only.
It could have benefited everyone, not just a few, in the way computers are made today, you should know well, IBM PCs are easy to upgrade and maintain Apple does not have such commodity, for another part is very expensive.
Apple also is losing a good opportunity to snatch the disgruntled Windows Vista users and let them buy OS X for the IBM PC.
If the trend could be established, I could buy the Mac OS and install on my machine.

14 November 2008, 11:54 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

McBanjo (Senior member):

You can't be serious. You want Apple to sell you a cheap version of their market-leading software for your cheap custom hardware? They would then have to spend millions of dollars making it compatible and writing thousands drivers for it, making it as bloated, crash-prone and incompatible as Windows. Then on top of that they'd loose millions from the sales of their premium-priced hardware.

Apple is a business and if they followed your advice, we wouldn't have an OS X to save us from Windows hell for very long. Exclusivity is the main benefit of OS X and to change this would cause it to exist no longer.

Though I do agree with you that Apple should allow for more significant upgrades, this has never been part of an Apple business philosophy and it probably never will.

This was also the reason for the downfall of IBM. IBM used to be a great, powerful brand, but since they started running with the crowd and entered an almost perfectly competitive environment, everything became about cost-cutting instead of building a brand or value for the customer (something sorely missed in I.T.) Apple still stands strong after all these years with miles of attainable ground, while IBM has little chance of gaining any market-share over its countless other hardware competitors.

15 November 2008, 12:14 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

jake (User):

Rubbish, i CAN get os-x to run on my windows pc,

15 November 2008, 12:53 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

iroarloud (New user):

One problem, the V word!!!!

15 November 2008, 3:06 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

k2 (New user):

I would have to agree with jake, even though i love everything about macs, the price of the sleek imac makes me cringe. the only reason i like mac is because of the operating system. to avoid this barrier, i successfully hacked my PC and made it run OS X leopard. And my OS X PC is 1.25 times stronger than my friends imac and cost $300 less than it:

HP pavillion:
680 GB of memory (added 220 GB)
2.3 GHz (this was a toughie, had to hire a techie to get things right)
4 GB RAM
Really cheap graphics card that works,
It runs exactly like the mac, with a few issues. Though the legality of this is questionable, I don't want to pay apple money for the finish.


06 October 2009, 3:48 AM (1 month ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

NetR@nger (Cornerstone member):

Quoting McBanjo:
You can't be serious. You want Apple to sell you a cheap version of their market-leading software for your cheap custom hardware?
Market leading??,You can't be serious.Anyway i will give you a list of my "cheap"hardware,and you tell me if its "worthy of your beloved OSX"
CPU - E8600 at 4.21Ghz (on water).Best cpu EVER made by ANYONE.
HDD - 3 SCSIs at 15000rpm (And matched with a $2799 scsi contoller card),NO other hard drive even comes close.
MEM - 16Gb Hyperlink pro,fastest ram on the planet(So hard to get that a lot of "so called"experts have never heard of it).
VID - 3 9800GTX+(tri sli) also on water,stock gap till the next gen comes out.
PSU - 2 1100W Coolermaster Ultimates.
MON - 4 32 inch lcds
OS - Vista 64bit ultimate

System Cost - About the same as a good second hand car
Would you call this a quality system??. I certinly do
So WHOs is the cheap system? I know.




15 November 2008, 10:22 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Obi-Wan Kenobi (User):

There's no call to show off your fancy specs.

15 November 2008, 11:02 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

NetR@nger (Cornerstone member):

Lol,when u paid this much for a system,u tell everbody about it whenever u can.

15 November 2008, 6:24 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

mcmurphy510 (New user):

Yeah... you might make a Mac user cry!

10 May 2009, 4:18 PM (6 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

TheBakedBaker (New user):

The problem is (as stated in the article) that most users don't spend the same amount on their computer as they do on their "good second hand car." So, for you, yeah, you're stuck using a terrible operating system, which is likely less burdensome since you probably have a great deal of experience and knowledge, allowing you to work around all the BS the rest of us just have to deal with. You also still have to worry about viruses and all of that crap, while mac users don't. So, if you need a bleeding-edge, state-of-the-art machine, stick with Windows. If you have more "basic" (common) computing needs, save a few grand and get a computer you can actually use.

18 November 2008, 1:39 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

TheBakedBaker (New user):

The problem is (as stated in the article) that most users don't spend the same amount on their computer as they do on their "good second hand car." So, for you, yeah, you're stuck using a terrible operating system, which is likely less burdensome since you probably have a great deal of experience and knowledge, allowing you to work around all the BS the rest of us just have to deal with. You also still have to worry about viruses and all of that crap, while mac users don't. So, if you need a bleeding-edge, state-of-the-art machine, stick with Windows. If you have more "basic" (common) computing needs, save a few grand and get a computer you can actually use.

18 November 2008, 2:53 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

nerdo (New user):

Obviously cheap enough to come troll this site lol. So what do you do with all this soon to be out of date uberhardware anyway? Play Quake 4?

18 November 2008, 11:19 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

NetR@nger (Cornerstone member):

Hi mate,no its mostly used for web design,photo editing and for my other passion,air traffic control simulations as im about to become a controller.Its one of the hardest things ive ever done,but very rewarding.

19 November 2008, 10:07 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Balus (New user):

Quoting NetR@nger:
Here is a site i built for brisbane centre) http://www.balus.info/Radar.php

No you didn't. That's my site!




07 December 2008, 11:35 PM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Balus (New user):

Quoting NetR@nger:
(Here is a site i built for brisbane centre) http://www.balus.info/Radar.php

No you didn't. That's my site!




07 December 2008, 11:42 PM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

NetR@nger (Cornerstone member):

It seems ive stuffed up and pasted the wrong link,sorry bout that.I have nothing to do with the link that got posted.The one i was supposed to put up is a beta and has been 8 months in the making,and after taking advice from from my client (Brisbane Centre),can not be made public.Once again sorry for the screwup...

08 December 2008, 8:30 AM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Decimated (New user):

Well then you are pretty dumb. If you had a brain, clearly you would see that photo editing is far superior on a mac, compared to a windows pc. If mac is so crap, why do people use them professionally for photography, video editing and music? I work closely with people at Nikon and Canon, the majority of users use Mac's. Maybe you like jacking off to your pc specs, but others really don't care? Macs "just work", I used to be for Windows, but after using macs for quite a while now, they are alot better than Windows for reliability, speed and its interface. I can't see how you can say dual quadcore processers is slow to be honest. Hell, you could even had 32gb of ram if you REALLY wanted it.

To add to your ATC sim, I worked for NATS in the UK and you don't need a ridiculously expensive pc for them at all. Its not exactly like you are gonna have much traffic to control in Australia anyway, play with the big boys at Heathrow and London TMA + Area my friend, thats where the REAL controllers are.

18 December 2008, 9:12 PM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

Quoting Decimated:
Well then you are pretty dumb. If you had a brain, clearly you would

Well there is a pointless way to begin presentation of your argument. A mindless insult and a suggestion of anatomical impossibility. Your not off to a good start, are you?


Quoting Decimated:
If mac is so crap, why do people use them

People drive french cars, people wear platform sandals, people drink warm creaming soda, people watch an entire series of "Big Brother". Popular personal choice is never and will never be a reliable indication of quality.


Quoting Decimated:
I work closely with people at Nikon and Canon

So do janitors, the proprietors of the local tuck shop, couriers drivers and even that little man who comes to change the indoor plants.


Quoting Decimated:
Maybe you like jacking off to your pc specs

So you though you'd aid your flagging argument with another insult did you? It didn't work, your argument is still looking feeble.


Quoting Decimated:
I worked for NATS in the UK

Ah that explains it, a Pom, the misguides personal belief of some superiority, based on industries of nearly two centuries ago.
A nation that cannot build a car that doesn't look like something out of a Noddy book.
A nation that cannot field a cricket team that isn't a joke from a population of how many million?
A nation whose only remaining industry is investment banking? Oops that is gonna hurt.


Quoting Decimated:
play with the big boys at Heathrow and London

you really are a sad little Herbert, but thanks for your contribution, we know now the Mac is the clear favorite for braggarts, train-spotters and Walter-Mitty-esque dreamers across the globe.


20 December 2008, 10:52 AM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Russell Hicks (New user):

Isn't the minimum spec's needed to run Vista?? LOL

20 November 2008, 1:06 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

NetR@nger (Cornerstone member):

Russell Hicks (New user):
Isn't the minimum spec's needed to run Vista?? LOL you twat

If your talking to me russell,Plain undisputed fact of life:Its a windows world-deal with it

20 November 2008, 4:19 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

DeadLetter (New user):

CPU could be better, why do you need 16GB of ram you'll never use it unless you are a serious power user, tri sli has been proven to have very poor scaling, OS is Vista.

And to your comment about "cheap" hardware, well the majority of the market want cheap PC's, the small manority which you belong to that know how to make a PC etc don't really matter.

17 October 2009, 10:47 AM (1 month ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Jimbo2K8 (New user):

So what you are saying is "if you can't afford it, you don't deserve it". Yes, very inclusive. Just the image a company wants to shoot for.

In case you hadn't noticed, you still can't touch an Apple MacBook for under $1200. I can get 2 HP's for that much, and that includes 1 yr of support. And it's much more upgradeable.

It's annoying comments like these that make me dislike Apple. Before you bash Windows, get a clue. It has introduced many more users to computers than Mac has. It's the prevalent OS in home AND business, and the choice in places where brains are required by almost 8 to 1.

20 November 2008, 8:12 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Izzy (New user):

I agree with just about everything you have to say. But I diverge on one issue, I don't think IBM makes PC's anymore, they sold their laptop division to Lenovo and I think (not sure) that Lenovo also is making their desktops now.

15 November 2008, 12:39 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Hemma (User):

IBM is more oriented at providing services for major corporations such as banks for their bread and butter. I think Lenovo only has rights to the Thinkpad marque for a certain number of years.

15 November 2008, 1:05 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

McBanjo (Senior member):

Very good points and ones I would definitely use to best describe the goodness of the Mac. What's most annoying about Mac is that we still have to interact with Windows some day in one way or another. Whether it be trying to change everyone's old PC habits (like shutting down or putting everything on the desktop) or trying to solve problems through tech-support, which simply wouldn't exist in a Mac environment.

I'm constantly (seriously, constantly) telling myself, "If only this were a Mac, I'd be able to do this so much better/easier/faster......." or "If this were my Mac, I wouldn't have to do this." Like: "I wouldn't have to find, purchase and install this lame 3rd-party dictionary/PDF reader/Video Player/DVD player software," or, "I wouldn't have to be downloading this Windows Defender update twice a week." or "I wouldn't have to wait for 10 seconds while Windows Explorer decides it wants to hang." or "I wouldn't have to waste all these hours getting rid of this virus, or installing this driver."

It all adds up, and I think most Mac users find that they actually use their Mac (rather than fix it) more than they've ever used a PC before.

14 November 2008, 11:55 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

jake (User):

Quoting McBanjo:
If only this were a Mac, I'd be able to do this so much better/easier/faster


im sorry i dissagree, i have trouble auto arraging icons on a mac where as on windows you simply right click then go view then select auto arrange, keep in mind these macs were osx 10.4

my VISTA laptop has no antivirus and yet has never ever had a virus.

i agree with explorer hannging, when was the last time i updated windows defender, oh wait it updates itself through windows update

15 November 2008, 12:50 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

lantzn (New user):

Auto Arrange on Mac 10.4
2 ways
1. From Finder choose View/Arrange By and pick your poison.
2. From Finder choose View/Show View Options, Desktop Window opens, go to the bottom and check the box that says Keep Arranged By and used the pop down menu to pick your poison.

I like the second option because it's automated and gives you a lot more options. I also like the Label Position to the right for a more organized icon/list sort of view.

15 November 2008, 7:30 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

hutriest (New user):

hahaha... very funny if you said that auto arrange is your problem in a mac. Too many option you can do @ mac desktop, include resize the icons, arrange all icon position.

About vista, sorry i'm not agree that vista is stable OS. I'm back to XP after get to much annoying error and hang-and-hang in many application include when running ms Office, fanny huh, compatible issue with their own product ^^

15 November 2008, 11:47 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

jake (User):

i didnt say vista was stable. i just said mine doesnt catch viruses, the STABLE vista is the 64bit version.

im sick of vista it decides it wants to hang, crash or fail when ever it wants, i cant have a day where i have vista not failing at least once, no one say its my hardware either my computer has a hell of enough power to run vista

15 November 2008, 11:56 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Hemma (User):

Fair enough. However, i think that you can't exactly say its annoying to have to interact with windows. Its just a fact that most corporate environments runs on a Microsoft environment. Its up to Apple to make the interactions easier for guys. Microsoft to a certain extent (although market driven more than anything) tried to make communications between macs and pcs easier by providing microsoft products like office for mac. Things could be worse off i think...

In relations to drivers, its something that's more to do with the Mac being quite strict about its hardware specifications. In the PC realm, people like to build their own, so think about the number of combinations that Microsoft has to deal with in terms of drivers. Only if Microsoft started to design and build their own pcs to their specifications, i'm sure that they would run just as smooth. I understand this because i triple boot Vista, Ubuntu and OSX86 on my laptop. The one with the least issues is Vista, followed by Ubuntu, then OSX86. It's because my copy of Vista was preinstalled, so the configurations are just right (fingers crossed). OSX86, as everyone knows has issues with every non-apple laptops... it might be sleep, might be wifi, and might even be touchpad.... but its because of the drivers available. Apple is smart in controlling the hardware. Unfortunately for microsoft, they are just a bit too big to control it. Its good though, to read about how they are trying to come to terms with their issues...

Viruses... i'm not trying to insult you (because people just report abuse), but most major corporations like banks, schools, government agencies run on a windows based environment. There's a larger interest in creating a virus for this platform. Whereas, for the 8? 10% of predominately graphics designers or web designers... there needs to be a real incentive.
Other than that, i think OSX is a more user oriented product, where they will try to cover everything, however, with Windows, its still (meaning Vista) in the era of 'Just an operating system'. Therefore, i'm quite excited about the release of 7, as it would be a make-or-break for microsoft in the OS environment. There's a benchmark set by Apple here.... and microsoft knows for a fact that they just need to meet it.

15 November 2008, 1:01 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

Quoting McBanjo:
the goodness of the Mac

Take your hand off it.


Quoting McBanjo:
What's most annoying about Mac is that we still have to interact with Windows some day

Uh-oh goodness breakdown!, If it was all goodness why would you ever have to interact with Windows? Ever?


Quoting McBanjo:
Whether it be trying to change every one's old PC habits

Last time a religious fanatic tried to change my habits I set the dog on him, sort out your own habits, and stay the hell out of everyone else's.


Quoting McBanjo:
while Windows Explorer decides it wants to hang

Ah yes Safari hanging is a so much better experience, I think its all that goodness.


Spare us the evangelism, enjoy your MAC it may suit your needs, It isn't adequate for mine, to each their own, and if you still see fit to wish to change other peoples habits, then the dog is keen for a run.

15 November 2008, 12:20 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

thegnu (New user):

Quoting McBanjo:
What's most annoying about Mac is that we still have to interact with Windows some day in one way or another.
--
yeah, the real bummer is that neither apple nor microsoft are actually interested in interoperability. they just want THEIR product to be the most compatible with the other product, and they both achieve their goal by making it hard for the users of the other product.

i am actually relatively unhappy with my mac, but i bought it because i needed a laptop, and at the time, i wasn't sure about linux power management. i do prefer mac over windows. i just dislike the fanboyism and revisitionist history that often comes from the mac camp. i do, i suppose, just cackle madly at the windows fanboys. :)


15 September 2009, 10:25 PM (2 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

itd (User):

"15 reasons Macs are still better than Windows"

I think you missed the most obvious reason of all...
A "Mac" is a hardware/software combination that forms a working entity; "Windows" is an operating system. Give me a full computer system over an operating system disc any day :)


15 November 2008, 12:26 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply
15 November 2008, 1:01 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

mcmurphy510 (New user):

Quoting itd:
A "Mac" is a hardware/software combination that forms a working entity; "Windows" is an operating system


Yep... very true... can't argue with that... Mac is a rigid, un-flexible combo of hardware and software that limits your choices... Whereas Windows is just an OS that allows you much more room in terms what you can put in your computer.

Quoting itd:
Give me a full computer system over an operating system disc any day :)


But, yeah... a full computer is better than just a software disk... that's why I generally put my Windows on my computer, rather than just leave it on the coffee table...

10 May 2009, 4:40 PM (6 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

MiCCAS (Frequent poster):

I'm sorry but this is the stupidest post I have ever seen from APCMag. Firstly, I'm not a Windows fanboi or a Mac fanboi - it's whatever suits the person that I care about.

However:

#3 - Windows has nothing to do with the software it runs off, they can't help if it's not "quality parts". If people want to get quality parts, they get quality parts. If they don't, they don't. Apple mac however forces you to use what they want you to use.

#4 - This ONCE AGAIN depends on the manufacturer. Less blinking lights.. has nothing to do with Windows.

#5 - An opinion, not evidence.

#6 - Windows comes with similar tools...

#7 - Windows has this too, more software than Macs do

#8 - Of course, jam pack it with crap people may not want to use...

#9 - I don't see any difference to what Windows has.

#10 - This is stupid.. What you see there is not Windows products, or Microsoft products - they are THIRD PARTY products!

#11 - When I have used the Mac dock I have found it very hard to differentiate what is what in terms of what's open and what is links.

#12 - Yet, when a virus or security hole is found for Macs they take forever to patch it - Windows does it in very short time - and, just because a Mac isn't popular enough now and therefore doesn't have as many outbreaks as Windows users, what about if it did - if the company won't even patch holes then how do you suppose it to cope?

#13 - *cough* Safari for Windows *cough*

#14 - Oh, and guess what.. Windows runs Photoshop too :O

#15 - I won't comment on this one because I simply haven't used it in a Mac and it would be unfair to comment on my opinion.

Just wanting to reiterate what I said before, if Mac suits you then Mac is the way to go for YOU.. I am sick of people thinking Windows is good for them so it's good for them.. The same with Mac, Linux, etc.

15 November 2008, 12:32 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Woodgrain (New user):

Agree 100%

You are absolutely right.

It's not about which is the better operating system, but which one works best for you. It's like buying an F1 sports car and trying to compare it to a Toyota Corolla & complaining that the F1 is harder to use and you need technical knowledge to use it.

This article frustrates me because there are a lot of readers that trust APC, as it is a good magazine, and will assume that this article is based more on fact than opinion.

The other point I'd like to add, as a System Administrator, is that Mac's are not designed for a corporate environment. They are great for little home workgroups, but nothing more.

I think it a very dangerous position for APC (or anyone for that matter) to suggest that users on Mac's don't need antivirus or antispyware. Please, let me encourage Mac users to get these for their computers, in many cases you do not know you have a virus/trojan until you install antivirus software to point it out to you.

If you find it difficult to use or to deal with Windows (or Linux), let me encourage you to try a Mac, my friends that struggled with Windows find it much easier. But please, don't try and convince all of your friends that use and like Windows/Linux that Mac is better, it's just different.

26 November 2008, 12:05 PM (12 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

matthewlowery (New user):

Quoting MiCCAS:
Of course, jam pack it with crap people may not want to use...

They're the best design apps in the business. If you didn't want them, why would you have bought a mac? Mac's are for design lol! Quoting MiCCAS:
*cough* Safari for Windows *cough*
sucks.




Quoting MiCCAS:
This is stupid.. What you see there is not Windows products, or Microsoft products - they are THIRD PARTY products!


Still, all WINDOWS computers come with them. Not windows OS, but windows computers. Quoting MiCCAS:
When I have used the Mac dock I have found it very hard to differentiate what is what in terms of what's open and what is links.

One word - glasses.


11 July 2009, 7:58 AM (4 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

thegnu (New user):

Quoting matthewlowery:
Quoting MiCCAS:
*cough* Safari for Windows *cough*
sucks.

*cough* Google Chrome *cough*?

also, i failed to point out that there have been some really horrible hardware decisions and terrible hardware components included in apple computers in the past. the difference is with a PC, you can choose to buy something else.



15 September 2009, 10:30 PM (2 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

jake (User):

the booting of my vista is 25 secconds and thats a cold boot, no3 the screens arent microsoft or windows problems its the hardware manufacturers,

15 November 2008, 12:32 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

itd (User):

Seriously though, my previous post was just drawing attention the confused nature of the article.


After stating at the beginning of the article
“partly because Macs are now PCs -- so the argument is now really Mac OS X vs Windows vs Linux”
You then go on to mention;

“3. Apple uses good quality parts.” – you will get arguments for and against this but seriously what does this have to do with “so the argument is now really Mac OS X vs Windows vs Linux”

“4. Less blinking lights. ….. Apple doesn't festoon its hardware with blinking lights and inconveniently placed wireless on/off buttons, headphone jacks, etc. ….. This lack of basic design refinement can make PC notebooks annoying to use for the entire lifespan of the unit” Once again this is debatable eg; non user replaceable parts like batteries meaning the whole machine becomes a brick because of one small failure, lack of ports or those that are custom/obscure or lack wide support meaning you lose or break something and you either do without or if you can find it, it costs more than a generic part.

“5. OS X + Windows is better than just Windows” – ummm yeah but once again “the argument is now really Mac OS X vs Windows vs Linux” but suddenly a new contender emerges which is the first two at once.

Can you see where I am going with this, I disagree with “the argument is now really Mac OS X vs Windows vs Linux” because I think what you are actually comparing is a turnkey solution – the Apple MAC with its Apple OS – and a piece of a bigger modular system – the Microsoft Windows OS and hardware provided by a variety of vendors.

What I think is the most amazing thing about all of this is that Apple Macs don’t perform better and PCs are not significantly worse. Apple designs the entire product; hardware, operating system, and even a large amount of the software and yet they produce a product that is largely comparable to a PC running Microsoft Windows; an operating system that manages to run on infinitely diverse combinations and permutations of hardware, with equally diverse software.

Given that Apple controls virtually the entire product design process, both hardware and software, I have long wondered why they don’t manage to produce an infinitely superior product. As it stands, based on sales figures, more people prefer the mix and match of PC/Windows than the total integrated design of Apple Macs and you will get large numbers of people arguing that one is better than the other. The Apple Mac SHOULD be the no-contest winner and yet it is not, what is wrong?

15 November 2008, 1:13 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Dan Warne (Administrator):

Quoting itd:

After stating at the beginning of the article
“partly because Macs are now PCs -- so the argument is now really Mac OS X vs Windows vs Linux”
You then go on to mention;


Fair point :-) What I meant was that the argument in general is more about the operating systems these days, though my article looks at Macs (as a whole) vs Windows PCs.

15 November 2008, 9:08 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

itd (User):

Thanks for the reply Dan, I respect that.

I understood the overall intention of the article, and I think in general the article provided some interesting and thought provoking material. It certainly has people responding with some equally interesting points.

I think the heading; “15 reasons Macs are still better than Windows” highlights the concerns I have with what you attempted to do. Comparing “Mac Operating System version XYZ” with “Microsoft Windows Operating System XYZ” is a fair comparison and that is part of what the article did. But comparing Apple on one side with everybody else combined on the other side introduces problems, and you did this on many fronts including hardware, design, and customer service/warranty.

It would be unusual to see a motoring magazine do a comparison of say, BMW alone versus all other brands of cars combined. This sort of comparison is what leads to the words “fanboy’ and “religion” being bandied about.

Point number 3; “Apple uses good quality parts” and then some assertions that all other brands combined use a “huge grab bag ranging from horrendous, dim rubbish to spectacular” could be equally applied to cars. Of course the “others” group is variable in quality it represents ALL OTHER PRODUCTS COMBINED !!! – this is hardly an argument that proves Macs are better. You could just as easily put Apple Macs in the “others” group and then argue against them with the exact same reasoning.

If I gave you the choice between BMW, a known product, versus some random vehicle from the group titled “others” of course you would rather buy the BMW “product sight-unseen and know you'll be happy with the quality” compared with the huge variety of others you might potentially receive.
(If you hate BMWs insert your brand of choice – I have never owned one, I just chose a name to illustrate the point)

The whole comparison of a “known” with a huge group of what is effectively “unknown” weakens any arguments made. For example you say;
“I have to admit I personally don't think the basic MacBook screen is of a quality that I would want to buy, but then, I think it's still better than a lot of PC notebook screens.”
That same sentence could be re-written as;
“I have to admit I personally don't think the basic MacBook screen is of a quality that I would want to buy, I think it's WORSE than a lot of PC notebook screens.”
The comparison of a specific or known with a non-specific or unknown means the argument can be stated either way and is therefore not really useful or valid.

In short, I think comparing “OS-ABC” with “OS-XYZ” is fair and valid but comparing “Product-ABC” with “Product-everything-else” or what is effectively “infinity” leads to something that is not really a comparison.


15 November 2008, 2:11 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

NetR@nger (Cornerstone member):

Can i ask you one question ?.IF macs are so good,WHY is it that 92% of the world uses windows???.The stats make your argument,rather silly eh

15 November 2008, 9:29 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Dan Warne (Administrator):

Ah, that's one of the circular arguments I mention at the top of the article. Windows' success isn't due to it being good, it's due to Microsoft being a good marketer, and being very good at involving companies in its ecosystem.

15 November 2008, 10:20 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

NetR@nger (Cornerstone member):

Ok,Ive thought alot about that and ill have to give you that one.

15 November 2008, 6:15 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Rod Rye (New user):

The growth rate of a single bacterial colony is greater than the human race, but that bacteria isn't going to be the dominant species on the planet any time soon.

What's sad is that the incredibly successful iPhone is still being outsold in most quarters (including the Christmas quarter) by phones running several year old Windows Mobile software.

20 September 2009, 1:49 AM (2 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

UbiquitousGeek (User):

I think it's more telling that the Mac's growth-rate is three times that of the PC industry. Apple is continually gaining market share and eating away at Microsoft's. Record profits and record numbers of Macs sold pretty much every quarter indicate an explosive growth in the Mac's popularity.

20 November 2008, 2:52 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Jimbo2K8 (New user):

When you are at the bottom, up is the only way to go...

20 November 2008, 8:12 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
I think it's more telling that the Mac's growth-rate is three times that of the PC industry.

If you want to play the growth rate care then you have to consider the total market penetration of non windows OSs, and at that point your argument looks a little sad, a three times growth rate for the next five years would still result in a distant 2nd place.


20 November 2008, 8:22 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

UbiquitousGeek (User):

Actually, I believe analysts predicted that should the current trend continue, they could hold 50% of the U.S. home market.

They're notebook penetration is even more exciting. If they were as doom and gloom as you'd like to have us believe, they wouldn't have more cash on hand than Microsoft, which they do. They also have zero debt. And to top it all off, look at their stock performance, especially before the economy took a nose dive. Even through all of this financial chaos, they're selling record numbers of Macs.

Now your argument looks a little sad.

20 November 2008, 2:05 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
Actually, I believe analysts predicted that should the current trend continue, they could hold 50% of the U.S. home market.

Ah analysts, what like the analysts that just happened to miss a worldwide recession completely.


Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
They're(sic) notebook penetration is even more exciting.

Does it have party hats?


Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
If they were as doom and gloom as you'd like to have us believe,

Your the one playing the doom & gloom card, I said nothing of the sort. Personally I can see no better situation than for Apple and Linux to gain market share. The fact remains when your proportions are relatively small it's much easier to achieve meteoric gains.


Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
And to top it all off, look at their stock performance, especially before the economy took a nose dive.

Yeah especially before the market took a dive. How many of those analysts warned shareholders to get out quick?



Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
Even through all of this financial chaos, they're selling record numbers of Macs.

And even with apple breaking its own records, and with MS releasing a somewhat stillborn version of Windows, PC sales still dwarf those from Apple.


Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
Now your argument looks a little sad.

No the only thing sad is a lack of open mindedness and an inability of some to accept simple realities.


20 November 2008, 2:21 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

UbiquitousGeek (User):

Back to the original argument here... Windows' market share has nothing to do with being a "superior" operating system. The lack of open-mindedness comes from the sheep who buy PCs because they don't know what their options are. They don't know why or how a Mac could benefit them. These people make up most of Windows' market share. If I take these people and show them exactly what the benefits are, nine times out of ten, they would choose the Mac, if money weren't a factor. These days, everyone wants something for next to nothing, and that's what a lot of the PC market is made up of. People want $300 throw-away computers. Well, they don't want throw-away computers, but they believe that for $300, they might get lucky and end up with a "good" computer. Well, Apple doesn't do that kind of hardware. If they did, they'd have the same reputation as Dell or Compaq. Also, there's a very thin profit margin in budget PCs. Apple is thriving well in it's current state. As long as that continues, I really don't care if the sheep continue to buy PCs. Apple, regardless, will continue to be highly profitable and continue to make computers that I want to use. They're not going away any time in the foreseeable future.

26 November 2008, 5:17 PM (12 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

mcmurphy510 (New user):

Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
The lack of open-mindedness comes from the sheep who buy PCs because they don't know what their options are. They don't know why or how a Mac could benefit them. These people make up most of Windows' market share.


Please! Apples' minuscule market share has little to do with non-open-mindedness. For the majority of folks, buying a computer is not a small matter. It's discussions like this one that seep into popular culture and mainstream awareness that make it so. Most people who buy a new computer either already know computers or consult one or more people who do (weather it be their kid, the IT guy at work, or their programmer brother in law). They're aren't uninformed sheep who blindly go and buy PC's. They make a decision based on facts provided by people in the know, whom they trust!

Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
If I take these people and show them exactly what the benefits are, nine times out of ten, they would choose the Mac, if money weren't a factor.


It sounds like you do this a lot. Your very statement implies that when you do have an opportunity to consult someone on a new computer purchase, you either fail to mention PC's or just trash talk them like you're doing right now, rather that letting them see the benefits and drawbacks of both and letting them decide. With your highly negative attitude about PC's it seems like those you consult are the ones who 'don't know what their options are.' Of course they are gonna go with Mac in that case, with you leading them astray - uh... I mean in that direction.



10 May 2009, 6:08 PM (6 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

UbiquitousGeek (User):

Tell that to Commodore, Tandy and Atari.

20 November 2008, 1:59 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Russell Hicks (New user):

Just beacause a product is popular doesn't make it better...big mac anyone?

20 November 2008, 1:12 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

nribecca (New user):

WHY is it that 92% of the world uses windows???.

Same reason so many people like Rap Music!
Like Tommy Lee Jones said to Will Smith in Man in black after Will asked "Why the big secret? People are smart. They can handle it".... "A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals and you know it. Fifteen hundred years ago everybody knew the Earth was the center of the universe. Five hundred years ago, everybody knew the Earth was flat, and fifteen minutes ago, you knew that humans were alone on this planet. Imagine what you'll know tomorrow."

So, just because more people like something, that doesnt make it the SMARTER or BETTER choice. It all comes down to preferences. I like FAST, I like Less crashes, I like no Viruses, so far, I like MAC, and I have been using Personal Computers since 1986!!! TI994A And this is the first time I have purchased or even USED a Mac, because I tolorated the garbage of windows/MS all of the MS BS, believing th's what EVERYBODY uses!!! Everybody's dumb, then ;)

27 October 2009, 1:27 AM (3 weeks ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Nk (New user):

Seriously its too early in the morning for this cr@p! MiCCAS has pretty much stated what I am thinking. Maybe you can do a follow up with why PC's (Not just Windows) are better than Mac's - I can think of a dozen off the top of my head hopefully you can too!


15 November 2008, 10:17 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Dan Warne (Administrator):

One of my best journos is on it! :)

15 November 2008, 10:20 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

todd_h86 (Cornerstone member):

Dan.... are you wanting your servers to come crashing down in rain of hellfire and brimstone? Come one I bet if you think about it you will notice what you have said is just complete and utter flame piece!

Are APC journos gettings paid on a commission of how many reply's get posted to their article?!

15 November 2008, 10:46 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Rosefisted (New user):

What about superior Mac ergonomics?
The Mac mouse is nothing more that style over function. I find them uncomfortable to use for extended period, the scroll wheel (ball?) is painful to use, and what's with the "squeeze" function? You have to caress the mouse, because if you grab it, it "alt-tabs" your open apps....

Then there's the ability to right click and "open with" from one app to another. Unless you have set up your file association in Mac, good luck.

Isn't the Dock a great idea.. especially when using Entourage for emails... That little bouncing icon is soooooo NOOOOOOT annoying.

Which reminds me... When, exactly, are Apple going to introduce an email program that allows hyperlinks and embedded images? And it's not Entourage's fault... after all, that's a Microsoft application. I enjoy sending my emails to Mac users and letting them navigate through the 20 embedded images that have suddenly become attachments.

Apple seem to use the same arrogant marketing ploy Rolls Royce did years ago...
Rolls Royces don't break down, they simply fail to proceed...

Apple Macs don't need lock-up, they simply need time to reflect...

15 November 2008, 11:24 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

UbiquitousGeek (User):

The simple fact that you used the "right click" argument, which hasn't been true for years, completely discredits your intelligence and voids and nullifies your entire argument.

20 November 2008, 2:57 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

gravyboy (New user):

1: OK, you can buy a Logitech bluetooth mouse and it will work perfectly.

2: Yeah, but on a mac you can right click, Open With. It shows you a list of the most recent applications you have used to open the file, it's own suggestions of programs that are capable of opening the file, and an option to choose another application all inside the menu. No annoying dialog pops up.

3: You can turn off the bouncing just like you can turn off blinking in Windows. Mail shows a neat red icon with the number of new messages.

4: Mail can show hyperlinks, html formatted email, and embedded images.

5: My Mac locks up when I am running Office 2007 in Crossover. :(

05 January 2009, 1:40 AM (10 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

AnthonyBrisbane (Regular user):

#3 - If you can't afford to or buying it for a 5-year old, PCs let you buy less expensive parts. Macs don't let you. They only let you buy good quality parts.

#6 - Windows has exactly the same.

#7 - Windows has a lot more good quality freeware than the Mac.

#8 - The reason MS is removing some apps from Windows 7 is because people don't want their system filled with the MS/Apple crap and want to use a third-party tool.

#9 - The tools in Windows are incredibly easy to find.

#10 - Nothing to do with Microsoft. That's the manufacturer. Not all brand name PCs come with that, and no custom built systems do. Tell them you don't want it, and they won't give it to you.

#12 - Only because Windows is much more popular so no one bothers to write viruses for the Mac. And if you know what you're doing it's not essential to have, just helpful.

15 November 2008, 11:47 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

UbiquitousGeek (User):

3. If you want inferior hardware, buy a used Mac. A lot of people do, which is why Macs have the highest resale value of any computer.

6. Not really. Activity Monitor is much more robust than the Task Manager. I don't recall ever seeing anything like the Console in Windows. The Disk Utility does things that Windows still doesn't do, including burning disk images. I don't remember seeing any RAID configuration tools in Windows either, but I could be wrong on that one.

7. Nope. First of all, most of the freeware available on Windows is also available for the Mac and it's usually better on the Mac. VLC is a great example of this. Our freeware is plenty and it's much more polished and useful. I use a lot of freeware, such as Adium, X-Chat (which isn't free for Windows users), Cyberduck (awesome FTP client, not available on Windows), iSquint (awesome video conversion, not available on Windows), HandBrake, various emulators and software to use the Wii Remote as a controller for those emulators, which I don't think is yet available for Windows...

8. No, I'm pretty sure it has to do with bloat, as well as fit and finish.

9. No, they're really not. Especially in Vista. Option are so scattered, it's ridiculous.

10. The writer was also comparing Mac hardware to all PC hardware, in general.

12. Completely untrue. The Mac is a high profile target. I've personally monitored the activities of groups *trying* to write malware for Mac OS X. It's not easy. If you don't use anti-virus, how do you know that you don't have a virus? It's easy to tell in Mac OS X because Unix doesn't allow things to be hidden from a competent user. If there were a problem, it would be easy to spot. This is not the case with Windows.

20 November 2008, 3:15 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

I'd like to start with your title Dan, and simply state that Macs are not better than Windows, which is simply a nonsense. Now before the Gamer fan boys claim a victory thinking they have won over Raindog, and before all those evangelistic Macophiles jump forward to defend the honour of their curvy designer plastic cases, I'll also clearly state that Windows is not better than Mac.

The whole "better than" thing is a nonsense and akin to, what is the ideal length of string, what is the ideal motor vehicle, what is the best colour, when is the preferred time of day, what is an ideal height. Well you get the idea.

For any "better than" to ever be meaningful it requires an application, and it may come as total surprise to fan boys of all persuasions that those applications will differ, yes lads some people even use their computers to write, design, create, and seldom ever feel the need to shoot pixelated bad guys in 7.1 surround via a plethora of small plastic speakers.

As for Dan's set of reasons

1. Reliable sleep mode. I could not agree more, Windows has never got this right especially in any form of networked environment.

2. Fast Boot times. Again I could only concur, but it is heartening to see from the drip feed media releases that MS is finally addressing this in Win7, how well they do that is yet to be seen, but at least it is admission the problem exist and any improvement is a good thing.

3. Apple Uses Good Quality Parts Well while I'd agree as a very sweeping generalisation, you have to consider this a little further. Aston Martin uses the best parts too, but you don't see too many Businesses offering them as company cars. One of the strengths of the PC is they can be had in a variety of quality levels as can the associated peripherals. There are plenty of PCs to be had that are built to an equal quality of the Apple MAC and there are also plenty of accessible PCs to be had for bargain prices. I'm no fan of buy now throwaway later products whatsoever, but just observing the number of sub $20K hatchbacks on the road, or observing the number of brightly coloured cheap thrill cartons emerging from the neighbourhood Harvey Norman on any given Saturday morning, I'd say the market for throwaway is substantial.

4. Less Blinking lights. Again I'd agree , and also note PCs can still be had without, Solar Flare or bamboo coloured shells, retina burning blue LEDs, spider web theme fan guards. Vacuum Fluorescent display panels showing the speed of all 14 accessory fans plus or minus 300 RPM, or even glow in the dark drive cables.
And while apple may not be as guilty on the blinding LED front, they are just as guilty on the dubious fashion front, those clear covered CRT innards displaying 12 months of accumulated office dust and the carbon tracking were real attractive, and even to this day we have apple to thank for all those iMac inspired iridescent blue ended USB leads.
And thankfully most of the extra PC LEDs occur in peripherals of particular brands, and as usual there is a very wide range of PC peripherals available, both with and without the gaudy lights. I am told the species know as Gamer actually finds all the flashy flash to be an enhancement. To each their own.

5.OS X + Windows is better than windows Well no it's not! And windows will never run as well in such an environment as what it can naively. You might have a good run with office applications, but try running anything that is hardware or network intensive and see how you get on.

6. Easier to troubleshoot Macs Um no! Troubleshooting via on-board apps will only work under certain circumstances. Hardware wise a modern Dell or HP can be serviced without tools with everything accessible, No Torx screws that Nana just never felt the need to kit herself out with. Apple has a strong "your too stupid to touch our hardware policy". As for software troubleshooting Windows is not difficult, but is victim of its own success with a myriad of poorly written games, drivers and apps likely to have the registry in knots.

7. A culture of good quality community software. This is not a win point for MAC, there is just as much, if not more, good freeware and shareware available for the PC. Linux would hold the clear lead over both PC and MAC in terms of community supported software, particularly considering the OS itself is community supported. The fact that Windows has a greater selection of junk shareware available is more a mark of PC success than a damning of the architecture. It's just not that hard to work out which are the worthwhile apps to load.
the Average MAC user can pretty much get away with MAC plus Office, and the average PC user can pretty much get away with PC plus office, the choice to load Maim & Bludgeon IV or Super-Handy-File-Sorter are choices available for the PC user, most of us neither need or load such things.

8. More useful Apps out of the Box. I don't particularly want apps out of the box. I'll concede that windows has included some tragedies of half baked apps, and desktop Linux builds see fit to load 4 terminals, 3 calculators and at least 1 partridge in a pear tree application, but these are easily removed from positions of annoyance. OS apps may be fine for preparation of a Sunday school newsletter, or a 3rd grade school project, but anything serious will usually require purchase of a professional application.

9. Neat and contained System Settings. All looks nice, all that neatness but it also equates to controlled system settings. Those neat setting only allow options within the managed confines Apple wishes to offer.

10. Apple doesn't load the System with Crap. Yes I'd have to agree this is a MAC plus, with the MS, PC manufacturers and every peripheral supplier seeing fit to festoon your system with crud. However the moment you open the browser, (which is in the end where most of the crap is now delivered) then the stakes equalise. That annoying Nokia pop-out on this APC site is just as present regardless of your OS unless your browser is broken.

11. Tons of small reasons make OS X Better. We are back to the "Better" again I couldn't be bother doing a plus and minus comparison of shortcuts, but I would note that for dozens of Small reason, many software vendors of specialist applications chose to avoid Apple. How is the choice of SCADA packages for the MAC for example. There are dozen of reason why the MAC is not the better choice for particular applications.

12. Still no need for security software. You being very brave saying no need, but there is not denying Linux and MAC are miles ahead in terms of security architecture. MS has dithered around for years because users might not have wanted annoying passwords, or had thought it an insult for Dad not to automatically have super-user rights. And of course PC is again victim of its own success, with every backroom hacker in upper and lower Kyrzikstan writing malware for Windows, it being the largest potential target.

13. Apple is Largely free of lameness Come on Dan pull the other one, the very notion of "Genius Bar" says Apple can do lame as well if not better than the opposition. Steve Jobs doing product promos while dressed like one of the Thunderbirds is not lame?

14. Power of the Command Line This is one dear to my heart, for those far enough up the gene pool to exist beyond Zombie Clicking, the command line will at times be the best (read most productive) tool for the job. I do not agree that the DOS prompt is so bad, although successive windows command lines are becoming less and less powerful, which is just dumb. Id rather use the best tool for the job and it's not always a mouse or a multi coloured custom skinned GUI.

15. File sharing is much easier Well across a workgroup it may be, but integrating MACs into a multi system environment is where that cotton wool covered utopia turns into a major PITA.

To make some very generalised observations of workplaces I encounter, MACs still dominate the desktops of the publishing related organisations, yet its almost universal that the accounts department will still be PCs only. MAC just wont be seen around any of the SCADA, CCTV or Automation system installations, this is a PC only area without exception, both Windows and Linux.

As for embedded applications MAC is nowhere to be found, and it appears they have poured all their R&D into their walkman thingys and touch screen gigglephones.

There is no "Better than", Dan has noted some strengths of MAC, but still MAC as it stands is not a universal replacement for a PC. The gaining of market share by both MAC and Linux is likely to continue even if Windows 7 proves to be the popular success that Vista was not, and that can only be a good thing.

It would be nice to see some more real innovation from all players and an end to this period where case colour is rating as a feature.

Dissenting fan boys with low self esteem and a need to defend the honour of their OS of choice need not reply.

15 November 2008, 11:58 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Me In Oz (Advanced Forumologist):

Quoting Raindog:
Dissenting fan boys with low self esteem and a need to defend the honour of their OS of choice need not reply.

Your comments were quite topical and interesting until this sentence.
Why do you feel the need to be condescending to others ?

That's that target I was referring to earlier !

And 'need not reply' ? ............ Again, thank goodness it's not up to you !




15 November 2008, 12:08 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

Quoting Me In Oz:
Again, thank goodness it's not up to you !

I never made any claim it was!


Quoting Me In Oz:
Why do you feel the need to be condescending to others ?

Why have you felt the need to shout someone down!!


Quoting Me In Oz:
Your comments were quite topical and interesting

That was the intention.


15 November 2008, 12:25 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Papa-Raboon (New user):

Quoting Raindog:
5.OS X + Windows is better than windows Well no it's not!

Sorry dude but you're wrong on that one.
Even Microsoft are experimenting running Windows as a VM. I run Windows as a VM to test sites that I build and the whole thing is backed up via time machine automatically. If I get a virus in Windows or the registry is destroyed somehow which again has been known I can just delete my VM disk image and restore from one that was backed up an hour ago because Time Machine on Leopard allows for a quick and safe backup.

Try doing that with a native install on Windows on a PC.



17 November 2008, 5:36 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Sorry dude but you're wrong on that one.

Um no! Tried virtualising a windows application that requires 3 NICs and or multiple serial ports lately? Tried running them natively on Apple hardware? Tried finding OS-X software for similar tasks?


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Even Microsoft are experimenting running Windows as a VM.

Which is probably why MS are not saying much about the negatives of VM systems. It depends entirely on what and how you wish to run windows. Tried to run any serious communications apps via a VM lately?

Try doing that on your Os-X VM! Good luck?

There are some exciting advances in VM technologies now that hardware has made a march ahead of available software, but VM is not a universal panacea, and there is still many instances where "one box for one function" should still apply.





17 November 2008, 7:27 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Papa-Raboon (New user):

Quoting Raindog:
Um no! Tried virtualising a windows application that requires 3 NICs and or multiple serial ports lately? Tried running them natively on Apple hardware? Tried finding OS-X software for similar tasks?

Yeah because so many regular users want to do that!
Come on. you're reaching Raindog.
Anyway. If you had a Mac why would you want to run many Windows apps on it anyway?

I run IE and that's all. Just for testing sites I develop. CSS, that sort of thing.

As IT moves to open standards, the OS is becoming a matter of choice.

Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Even Microsoft are experimenting running Windows as a VM.

Which is probably why MS are not saying much about the negatives of VM systems. It depends entirely on what and how you wish to run windows. Tried to run any serious communications apps via a VM lately?

OK, name one and I'll have a go!
We'll call it research. I could also try it in Crossover Mac to see if it works. And that's NOT a VM. It's WINE for OS X.

Try doing that on your Os-X VM! Good luck?

There are some exciting advances in VM technologies now that hardware has made a march ahead of available software, but VM is not a universal panacea, and there is still many instances where "one box for one function" should still apply.

OK, point taken.
But for the average user and most Pro users too, OS X is a great environment to use and Fusion or Parallels will cover you for the majority of stuff you still need to transition from.


19 November 2008, 2:19 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Yeah because so many regular users want to do that!

Applications with multiple NICs or serial adaptors are hardly out there esoteric. And regardless of what proportion of users run them it still makes a nonsense of the original sweeping statement that "Windows under OS X is still better than native windows". Even though you did quote one valid plus for running that way, there is always a going to be performance hit, and you well know how that will be received, particularly by the shoot-em-up set.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Anyway. If you had a Mac why would you want to run many Windows apps on it anyway?

Add a tick to your MAC fan-boy slogan score. You know already why people want to run Windows Apps on a mac, and reading your own reply you even quote reasons why you have to do so yourself. So whose stretching huh?


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
I run IE and that's all. Just for testing sites I develop. CSS, that sort of thing.

That's not something the average user would do everyday now is it? So there goes that angle you were taking. Actually I routinely do pretty much the same thing when testing, but it's hardly a strength of MAC at any stretch.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
As IT moves to open standards, the OS is becoming a matter of choice.

If only that were true. How many MAC applications run under Windows or even Linux? There are plenty of port and re-codes. But those open standards are a long way off, which is a real pity and an immense cost to software developers and to users of of more than one OS.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
We'll call it research. I could also try it in Crossover Mac to see if it works. And that's NOT a VM. It's WINE for OS X

It's all great stuff, but regardless it will not run Windows apps better than they run natively. Adequate may be more than acceptable but it will never justify the "better than" tag.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
But for the average user and most Pro users too, OS X is a great environment to use

No argument from me on that one. Great environment - yes, Better than -no, a personal preference - well that's a maybe.

I'm not trying to run down MAC, its a well refined mature option, but the suggestion it is a universal panacea for all computing ills or the suggestion it is a substitute for each and every or even most PC applications is far from reality.


19 November 2008, 8:42 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Papa-Raboon (New user):

Quoting Raindog:
Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Yeah because so many regular users want to do that!

Applications with multiple NICs or serial adaptors are hardly out there esoteric. And regardless of what proportion of users run them it still makes a nonsense of the original sweeping statement that "Windows under OS X is still better than native windows".

Well actually I think the article meant that being able to run both on a Mac was better than only being able to run Windows on a PC (obviously not taking into consideration that you can run Linux on either).

Now it sems you don't know that you can either run Windows in a VM (Parallels or VMware fusion) or you can dual boot using Apple's Boot camp natively into Windows so no performance hit there! In fact I have read articles that state that running Windows natively on a Mac is really fast compared to most PCs.

Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Anyway. If you had a Mac why would you want to run many Windows apps on it anyway?

Add a tick to your MAC fan-boy slogan score. You know already why people want to run Windows Apps on a mac, and reading your own reply you even quote reasons why you have to do so yourself. So whose stretching huh?

I stick by it and why does that make me a 43 year old Mac fanboy. I think at 43 I can be regarded just as a Mac fan :-)

But calling someone a fanboy because you have no real argument is a cop out which kinda makes you the fanboy. So here goes. I seriously do NOT know a single person that prefers to run Windows who has switched from a Windows machine to a Mac (and I know quite a few switchers). So since I use the words "Want to" rather then the words "Need to". I can say; hand on heart; that the average Mac user who has to run the odd Windows app would prefer it if they could get a proper Mac version. However, since there are equivalent Mac versions of all general Windows apps there is rarely any need to boot Windows on a Mac.

Quoting Papa-Raboon:
I run IE and that's all. Just for testing sites I develop. CSS, that sort of thing.

That's not something the average user would do everyday now is it? So there goes that angle you were taking. Actually I routinely do pretty much the same thing when testing, but it's hardly a strength of MAC at any stretch.

Running IE on a Mac is something I can hardly avoid since many ignorant users who don't even know what a web browser is (I talked to two of them this week alone) use IE because it is on the computer they bought and they just refer to it as "The Internet".

Mainly because IE is so crap but widely used is why I have to use it for testing. Otherwise I wouldn't bother.

How many Mac users have their own personal web site. I would guess, a higher percentage per userbase then their Windows using counterparts. A bigger percentage of Mac users are creatives, graphic designers, home users etc. The vast majority of Windows users are cubicle jockies inputting data, writing letters sending email etc.

Quoting Papa-Raboon:
As IT moves to open standards, the OS is becoming a matter of choice.

If only that were true. How many MAC applications run under Windows or even Linux? There are plenty of port and re-codes. But those open standards are a long way off, which is a real pity and an immense cost to software developers and to users of of more than one OS.

Seems you didn't understand what I meant by open standards. I was referring to file standards, not applications. PDF, XML, TXT, MPEG, etc. They are making the different software we use more compatible with each other. As Microsoft can only compete using "lock-in" tactics rather than quality they always try to develop their own closed standards versions of every file format WMV, WMA, etc to hold onto their desktop monopoly. If they eventually decide to compete on quality and actually start to care about the quality of their products they may actually finally use open standards. However, anti-trust cases in the US and Europe regarding anti-competitive practices have shown us this is the way MS play in the software arena.

Quoting Papa-Raboon:
We'll call it research. I could also try it in Crossover Mac to see if it works. And that's NOT a VM. It's WINE for OS X

It's all great stuff, but regardless it will not run Windows apps better than they run natively. Adequate may be more than acceptable but it will never justify the "better than" tag.

Well WINE and Crossover Mac are a reverse engineered version of the Windows API, not an emulator so you can run a good number of Windows Apps natively on Linux or OS X.

Agreed, some apps don't run as well as the API is closed source. And some don't run at all. But it also means that the bugs in the Windows API don't get built into the software either. So those apps that are classed as gold standard in WINE can quite possibly run better then they do on Windows. Any WINE or Crossover Mac users on here care to comment?

Quoting Papa-Raboon:
But for the average user and most Pro users too, OS X is a great environment to use

No argument from me on that one. Great environment - yes, Better than -no, a personal preference - well that's a maybe.

I'm not trying to run down MAC, its a well refined mature option, but the suggestion it is a universal panacea for all computing ills or the suggestion it is a substitute for each and every or even most PC applications is far from reality.

OK. Care to elaborate on that?

Each and every, fair enough. But neither is Windows! And Most Applications. Well we will have to agree to differ because you have yet to define what you mean by "Most PC applications" and I have yet to comment on which of those applications would be impossible on a Mac. But if I had to hazard a guess based on the fact that I am a power user and used both platforms (and linux on servers) I would state that Macs can be a panacea for most and nothing can be a panacea for all. So what it finally comes down to is which has the best security out of the box, best ease of use, most consistent user experience through the majority of it's software and is more reliable and I'm sorry, you can contradict me if you think I'm wrong but I would say Mac on all four counts.

I am saying this because of my own personal experience. Macs may not be perfect. But Apple cares about the quality far more than Microsoft does and they have the hardware to design as well as the software. Microsoft can't even get the security of their flagship product right. And they are only software developers!

19 November 2008, 10:00 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Now it sems you don't know that you can either run Windows in a VM (Parallels or VMware fusion) or you can dual boot using Apple's Boot camp natively into Windows so no performance hit there!

It seems you are making sweeping assumptions, believe what you wish, but any form of virtualisation will involve a performance hit. Where do all those virtualisation CPU cycles come from? The super magic stress free no loss virtualisation chip. Multiple boots are fine to get you out of a pickle, but anyone who has considered jumping from OS to OS as a practical or productive means of working has usually ended up with one box of each type under his or her desk pretty quick smart. Argue all you like but its simple reality.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
In fact I have read articles that state that running Windows natively on a Mac is really fast compared to most PCs.

I've read articles that suggested defragging daily and other that claimed the Apollo moon landing was a hoax. Don't believe everything you read, especially when advertisers have a strong sway on much of what is published.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
I stick by it and why does that make me a 43 year old Mac fanboy. I think at 43 I can be regarded just as a Mac fan :-)

The fan-boy tag is hung on the choice to evangelise and otherwise bang on about a personal choice supposedly being something all others should adopt. Or belief in some form ignorant superiority that all those who do not use their chosen OS are somehow wrong.

As for the age, well I'd still be entitled to call you boy. I've known many stupid and ignorant people of every age I've see children and teenagers capable of real insight. Even if the latter is rare in the extreme and almost creepy.

Quoting Papa-Raboon:
But calling someone a fanboy because you have no real argument is a cop out which kinda makes you the fanboy.

No cop out. If your the one trying to push the single answer argument the your a fan-boy, end of story.

Quoting Papa-Raboon:
So here goes.

This'll be good

Quoting Papa-Raboon:
I seriously do NOT know a single person that prefers to run Windows who has switched from a Windows machine to a Mac (and I know quite a few switchers).

So you exist in a narrow and limited circle of association, you practically never see a windows fan at the Mac store right? Reality check time.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
So since I use the words "Want to" rather then the words "Need to". I can say; hand on heart; that the average Mac user who has to run the odd Windows app would prefer it if they could get a proper Mac version. However, since there are equivalent Mac versions of all general Windows apps there is rarely any need to boot Windows on a Mac.

No argument it would make much more sense to run an apps written for your OS of choice, the simple fact is that there are still lots that are written only for windows, as much as you and I wish that was not the case.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Running IE on a Mac is something I can hardly avoid since many ignorant users who don't even know what a web browser is (I talked to two of them this week alone) use IE because it is on the computer they bought and they just refer to it as "The Internet".

There's that fan-boy arrogance surfacing again. "Ignorant users" Ignorant why, because their live are not as computer focused as yours or mine? Ignorant because almost every quick start guide or reference uses IE as a base. IE was thrust at most people, and just because you and I know there are better options about does not make everyone who uses IE ignorant.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Mainly because IE is so crap but widely used is why I have to use it for testing. Otherwise I wouldn't bother.

Very much to do with how many copies of Windows are out there, isn't it, while MS might not have got much right of late there is no arguing the success and penetration of Windows. And news for you not all those purchase decisions were made from a position of ignorance.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
How many Mac users have their own personal web site. I would guess, a higher percentage per userbase then their Windows using counterparts. A bigger percentage of Mac users are creatives, graphic designers, home users etc. The vast majority of Windows users are cubicle jockies inputting data, writing letters sending email etc.

That one gets you "Fan-boy of the Month", you'd better loosen the skivvy and take a reality check. Personal web-site, yeah those are mark that will noted in the memoirs of of the universe, all those photos of the kids and the house and some caravan park holiday.

A bigger percentage of mac users are creatives? Take your hand off it, or are you suggesting Mac is specifically tailored for poets, advertising copywriters, school fete organisers. If you were to take that parallel the given the PC is the usual choice for engineers, architects, scientists, accountants etc, then you could claim the PC was tailored for those who intended to actually do something useful.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Seems you didn't understand what I meant by open standards.

Seems you were making assumptions, maybe even creative ones.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
I was referring to file standards, not applications. PDF, XML, TXT, MPEG, etc. They are making the different software we use more compatible with each other. As Microsoft can only compete using "lock-in" tactics rather than quality they always try to develop their own closed standards versions of every file format WMV, WMA, etc to hold onto their desktop monopoly.

Only a fool would suggest that Apple was a champion of open standards. Their systems are as closed if not more so than anything from Microsoft. Apple have no choice but to embrace common file format or they would bee doomed to obscurity. Of course Apple make efforts to read windows formats, they could not exist without maximised efforts to interact with Windows. The reverse is not so crucial.



Quoting Papa-Raboon:
If they eventually decide to compete on quality and actually start to care about the quality of their products they may actually finally use open standards.

Yeah one day Windows will be able to handle PDF, XML, TXT, MPEG files right? reality check time.



Quoting Papa-Raboon:
However, anti-trust cases in the US and Europe regarding anti-competitive practices have shown us this is the way MS play in the software arena.


And the way Apple plays, take the blinkers off.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Well WINE and Crossover Mac are a reverse engineered version of the Windows API, not an emulator so you can run a good number of Windows Apps natively on Linux or OS X.

As long as your prepared to take a performance hit.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Agreed, some apps don't run as well as the API is closed source. And some don't run at all.

Yep there is that reality biting in again.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
But it also means that the bugs in the Windows API don't get built into the software either.

How does that work? Oh yeah that's right the apps don't run at all. like it or lump it.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Any WINE or Crossover Mac users on here care to comment?

I run wine from time to time, but anything serious end up setting up another box running the app and it's native OS, it's that productivity thing again. probably not as much an issue for the poets though, at a rough guess.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
But if I had to hazard a guess based on the fact that I am a power user and used both platforms (and linux on servers)

Woo-Hoo do your wear your power user badge while power using? meanwhile back here on earth reality is in progress.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
I would state that Macs can be a panacea for most and nothing can be a panacea for all.

You've almost got it, now substitute some for most and you'll be on the money.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
So what it finally comes down to is which has the best security out of the box, best ease of use, most consistent user experience through the majority of it's software and is more reliable and I'm sorry, you can contradict me if you think I'm wrong but I would say Mac on all four counts.

You could say Mac on all for counts you are entitled to miss the point entirely.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
I am saying this because of my own personal experience.

Well I choose to comment not only from my own viewpoint and my own particular set of needs but also from the experiences of needs of customers, colleagues, systems developers and specialist manufacturers.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Macs may not be perfect.

They are far from perfect, far from universally applicable to every task, and nowhere near as adaptable as that many faced beast we know generically as a PC. That said they can be a tool of choice for particular applications. (not just poetry)


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
But Apple cares about the quality far more than Microsoft does


Oh rubbish. They are both large corporations anyone that thinks they care for anything other than profit and shareholders is kidding themselves. Apple have a better record for quality and consistency, but that comes hand in hand with a record for limited hardware and software choice, and from a lack of adaptability of architecture. The support task taken on by MS servicing a vast range of hardware, peripheral and other software is immense.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
and they have the hardware to design as well as the software.

And the locked up proprietary model and monopoly pricing that goes with such a design.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Microsoft can't even get the security of their flagship product right.

Well actually they can, millions of Microsoft boxes are configured and operating daily in relative safety. The difference is choice, those who choose to disregard security on PC are free to do so.

You have presented some excellent comparison points, and some considered argument, all good stuff, it's just such a pity to see all that spoilt by the "better than" and the assumed superiority.


20 November 2008, 10:13 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Me In Oz (Advanced Forumologist):

As a gamer, Apple will never be an OS of choice (at the moment) !
Thanks Dan, for including the things OSX CANNOT do !

15 November 2008, 12:11 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Ash (User):

Yeah, yeah. I'm a Linux user, go ahead and stereotype me as an extremist.

But guess what. DRM is a big issue. Hardware Lock-in is a big issue. Anti-competitive software locks is a big issue (you can't even have Opera on your iPhone, because Apple doesn't want you to). Yay, Mac hardware is shiny and the Operating System is sexy. Let them take your freedom away from you if it's so important to you that can look like a hipster. Just move into stylish computing over smart computing and surrender your knowledge. You don't need it any more.

If Apple were to dominate the market, where would AMD be? Where would the sophisticated computer user be? Where would Open Source and Alternatives be?

To be honest, this article disappoints me. I love APC a lot, but I don't want to hear this rubbish from an intelligent magazine for power users.

And while you're at it, could you stop printing letters from clueless children who deem adults that game to have no lives? Enthusiasts are the market for your magazine, not condescending individuals who think they can tell us how to spend our money,

15 November 2008, 3:44 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

Quoting Ash:
Let them take your freedom away from you

Quoting Ash:
but I don't want to hear this rubbish from an intelligent magazine for power users.

Quoting Ash:
And while you're at it, could you stop printing letters from

So lets get this right Ash, you want software to be free and open source, but you want forums and publications censored to eliminate any opinions you don't agree with, and you want all article to be from your viewpoint?

Do you see the irony in your requests?


Quoting Ash:
Enthusiasts are the market for your magazine,

And Market research too! News for you Ash, APC has readers, focused on things other than the back page shoot-em-ups section too.


Quoting Ash:
but I don't want to hear this rubbish from an intelligent magazine for power users.

Quoting Ash:
who think they can tell us how to spend our money,

Nobody is telling you how to spend your money, whether you wish to spend it on computer software or new bicycle clips I doubt anyone gives a fig, your free to spend as you desire.

Curious though, that while baying for your rights of free purchase you see fit to tell other how to run their magazine and website and what they should include, and you see yourself as having a right to decide who should contribute on a forum.

I think you'd better take stock of exactly who is telling others how to behave! Don't you?






15 November 2008, 6:15 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Ash (User):

Quoting Raindog:
So lets get this right Ash, you want software to be free and open source, but you want forums and publications censored to eliminate any opinions you don't agree with, and you want all article to be from your viewpoint?
I don't really see the relation between free and open source software and children whining adult gamers have no lives. They have the freedom to say what they want, and I have the freedom to suggest changes to the publishing of APC. The nature of open source and freedom is not 'everyone do what you want' but rather 'everyone gets a say'. I'm having a say.

Quoting Raindog:
Curious though, that while baying for your rights of free purchase you see fit to tell other how to run their magazine and website and what they should include, and you see yourself as having a right to decide who should contribute on a forum.


I pay for APC, I at least have the right to make a suggestion as to it's content. I don't really care about what that kid said, and he can take part on any forums he likes. I'd just prefer that APC would give the title of 'Letter of the Week' to you know, intelligent, insightful letters.

Quoting Raindog:
I think you'd better take stock of exactly who is telling others how to behave! Don't you?


Well, you are the one who excluded the actual points of my comment seemingly to attack my integrity for the sole reason that I objected to a letter of the week in APC. I would say you are very much telling me how to behave.

16 November 2008, 9:44 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

Quoting Ash:
I don't really see the relation between free and open source software and children whining adult gamers have no lives

and your point is?


Quoting Ash:
They have the freedom to say what they want, and I have the freedom to suggest changes to the publishing of APC.

And you exercised that freedom by suggesting onions you did not care for be restricted from publication, leaving me freedom to point out the flaws and contradictions in your stance. And was the insulting reference to other posters as children meant to add weight to you argument?

You've suggested everyone is free to say what they want but on opinions you choose to agree with should be heard!


Quoting Ash:
I pay for APC

That's great, but it does not entitle you to seat on the editorial committee now does it, a lot of other folks purchase APC too.

Quoting Ash:
I don't really care about what that kid said

As long as you don't have to hear or read it right?


Quoting Ash:
I'd just prefer that APC would give the title of 'Letter of the Week' to you know, intelligent, insightful letters

It is only your opinion that says this was not the case, others may disagree. Perhaps APC had tried to encourage a younger poster, or tried to allow a voice that differed from the noisy rabble. Regardless of how they made their decision it was their decision to make. I'd also ask why you chose to take this thread off topic rather than airing your grievances in the appropriate place? You'll find a forum section is available where your feedback would be welcome.


Quoting Ash:
Well, you are the one who excluded the actual points of my comment

No I pointed out the contradiction in what you said, and question your requests to have opinions other than your own suppressed!


Quoting Ash:
seemingly to attack my integrity

But it's OK for you to attack the integrity of other posters by calling them children etc? I've had a look and your definitely not listed as a protected species. You throw mud, expect mud thrown back.


Quoting Ash:
for the sole reason that I objected to a letter of the week in APC

No because you chose to belittle and name call others and chose to do so in an inappropriate location. No that there ever is an appropriate location for name calling.


Quoting Ash:
I would say you are very much telling me how to behave.

Well I am as far as rudeness is concerned, if you cannot express an opinion without name calling and attempts to shout others down then don't bitch about any dressings down you may incur.


16 November 2008, 11:49 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Ash (User):

Quoting Raindog:
And Market research too! News for you Ash, APC has readers, focused on things other than the back page shoot-em-ups section too.

Oh, don't get the wrong idea. I use Linux only and do not own a current gen console. I rarely game. I'm not a gamer by any means, and the back section is of only marginal interest to me. I'm more of a PC builder. I like reviews on GPUs, CPUs, motherboards, esc.
The thing that gets me is that comment basically applies to me. Some would say I have no life because I don't simply go to Dell when I want a new computer. When I use a rarely used operating system. When I spend hours reading about new tech. Stupid comments like that letter irritate me because they assume I have no life because of my hobby.



16 November 2008, 9:52 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

Quoting Ash:
The thing that gets me is that comment basically applies to me.

If the shoe fits! Actually that comment was made to your assertion that APC readership only consisting of enthusiasts (which going by your prior comments suggested PC gamers). I made the suggestion that the readership was perhaps a little wider and diverse than that.


Quoting Ash:
Some would say I have no life because I don't simply go to Dell when I want a new computer.

Some would say the planet is likely to be over-run by killer lizards but I'd ignore those comments too.


Quoting Ash:
Stupid comments like that letter irritate me

Hijacking an interesting and though provoking thread with unrelated grievances irritates me. Anything to add on 15 reasons Mac v Windows?

16 November 2008, 12:00 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

$teeve Pink (User):

Hey Dan.

Is this what you do for work?

You're fired!!!

15 November 2008, 4:15 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Dan Warne (Administrator):

Thanks $teeve -- however I think you're confusing yourself with my boss ;-)

15 November 2008, 4:25 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

znosko (New user):

The Windows users who defend the adequacy of their platform make accurate points. But the adequacy of Windows just proves the author's general point, even if he forgot to include one additional reason why Macs (or Mac OS) are still better than Windows: MS depends on Apple to maintain its adequacy, because MS needs Apple to steal ideas from. Examples abound from the entire history of both companies, but for modern examples, one need only examine Gadgets or refer to the internal MS emails revealing their anxiety over Spotlight.

15 November 2008, 4:44 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Halcon (Cornerstone member):

Let's get this straight! The article written by Dan Warne is about software.
Even though there are comparisons of the strength and weakness of both operating systems, this can't be generalized.
IBM PCs can be built form humble to high class components, costing several thousands of dollars.
Always when there is talk of this kind, the loyalists of one band try to bash the opposition with a lot of poisonous expletives.
know that My computer is not so cheap, I like the way it works.
Another point is that the Operating system should be free of tyranny, both companies Microsoft and Apple are guilty of using deceiving methods like DRM, Genuine Disadvantage, Product hacktivation and a lot more.
Neither companies can claim victory, as the ideologies are completely divisive!

15 November 2008, 10:12 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

BN (Regular user):

LOLZ @ Dan

Sure some of your points are valid, but most of them are just user preference bias.

sleep/Suspend works perfectly on my vista rig, and i don't think any part in my system is cheap either....quad core, 4 gig low latency DDR2, Asus MB, Antec Quadro power, Nvidia 280GTX etc etc Samsung LCD.

Sure theres issues with windows and some PC hardware, but being a hardware technician for well over 15+ years I've i had a dollar for every user who had a issue with a mac id probably own half of Google by now. Problems and issues go both ways.

So I think the real question that needs to be asked is HOW MUCH H DID DAN GET PAID FOR THIS BIAS WRITE UP ???

16 November 2008, 1:45 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Dan Warne (Administrator):

LOL!! If you think Apple would pay me, I don't think you know me or Apple very well ;-)

16 November 2008, 6:27 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Nicolas Gheeraert (New user):

Not being particularly a mac fan, I still find something quite striking : the difference of design between PCs and Mac, wether it concerns the OS part or the body part of the computer. Even PC users generally agree, compared to the simplicity of shapes and colors of the macs, the design of PCs is nothing. The argument has already been considered by Dan but not emphasized enough in my opinion.

For a lot of us the computer has become a central tool of our work/life and it's obviously important to enjoy your computer and its environment that you already fashion by personalizing wallpapers and screensavers in order to make it more likable. And to really like it I believe the design of the system is essential and should be given a lot more credit. I just don't see how some ridiculous modern-art PCs are to appeal to anyone. I am under the impression a lot of users (even some mac users who don't realise) give more importance to useless gadgets, like 200 more MHz or 50 more GigaBytes, than to things that have a truer value.

Design, it's a little bit like art, it has no palpable value. So we just consider it hasn't any. But I guess this is what makes the difference between a mac and a PC (to me the border still stands). Macs are a sub-group of computers just as Sony, Dell, Toshiba... form an other. And it justifies as a consequence the price paid for a mac : the prices are just not comparable. As long as the PC world doesn't make an effort, Macs have the upper-hand.

(off subject) Even more amazing is that this is the case in other areas : mp3 players, phones (OS of the iphone).

16 November 2008, 1:22 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

techdribble (User):

Better for you but not better for me. Great the mac works for you but I have tried and I will take a PC with Windows or Linux any day it just suits me.
"On balance, though, Macs just let you get stuff done, whereas Windows computers constantly find ways of annoying you. " See I have the opposite view and both a valid because you have no idea how everyone works and what they want out of a computer. I use what gets the job done for and in my case what I can build myself from quality components. For points 1 & 2 it would be bad if Apple couldn't get is its os to works with its software. Microsoft doesn't build hardware so those points dont mean much
Point 3 : So you know what components every other manufacturer uses in their PCs and laptops ?
Point 4 my PC has 1 light and my laptop 2 i wouldn't call that to many. Again I assume you have checked every PC and laptop on the market to make this comparison valid.
Point 5. I would run OSX on my PC but APPLE wont allow it.
Point 6. I have no problems troubleshooting my PC again this is your personal opinion and mine is the opposite and your opinion is no more valid than mine.
Point 7. Dont know about that I ran across my fair share of crap when I was using a Mac.
Point 8. If Microsoft add more apps everybody gets upset. On Linux this point is debatable.
Point 9. Again your opinion and not one I share.
Point 10. Microsoft doesnt either other companies might. My laptop came with 1 piece of crapware my PC with none. My linux pc came with no crapware at all.
Point 11. Again your opinion doesnt hold true for every user.
Point 12. Agreed
Point 13. Excuse me while I fall over laughing.
Point 14. Yeah hows your 64bit version of Photoshop going on OSX ?
Point 15. I dont have a problem sharing files on my windows box. Again your personal opinion and not a fact.





17 November 2008, 8:43 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

SeanFinn (New user):

I have used Macs at lans, friends and school but have never wanted to own one for the pure simple fact they are not as compatible as a Windows (or even Linux) based PC.

This article seems to be very pro mac, i made the unfortunate mistake of thinking the title to this article read "15 reasons why Windows PC's are still better then macs" But instead it read "15 reasons to prove i am a mac fanboi"

You dont buy a computer just for its software or UI, you buy it for actually doing a thing called 'work', not just because it looks pretty and feels smooth like your ever balding Steve Jobs.

I hope W7.0 blows Tiger out of the water, Apples tree need a shakeup, they have not even bothered to make their OSX 64bit native and they have been running the 64bit CPU's for 2.5 years!

Also OSX is still painfully slow on basic tasks and only really shines on apple exclusive apps which makes most of the reasons of this article totally BS.

A PC is also a open platform, you can change the hardware, software and even the UI to whatever you want.

But with MAC you are getting a locked platform, unable to change the specific specifications of the hardware in model you bought, no upgrading, overclocking, tweaking or any other glorious nerdage that could be had.

I hope this article crashes and burns like Steve Jobs health.

17 November 2008, 9:39 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Truckasauras (User):

I really think you're struggling to come up with 15 credible reasons. I honestly think the price tag is sufficient to cancel out the majority of these reasons.

17 November 2008, 11:24 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

pmx (User):

What planet are you people on ?

A Mac is not a PC .. and vice versa.

The 'comparing apples and oranges' statement here is not just a poor pun.

Despite the broad general similarity of both being computers than run software, the two systems have completely different design philosophies.

Windows PC's have slow boot times because of the wide range of hardware that have to support. If you reduced the amount of gear the PC had to support you'd have faster boot times and the resulting decrease in market share and you'd call it a Mac.

The wide range of 3rd party devices and sofware that Windows PC's support also effects the sleep mode. Having said that though, it has always worked for me. This is especially evidenced by Virtual PC's. I never 'reboot' my Virtual PC's .. they are always suspended and resumed and this always works.

Due to Windows vast market share any move Microsoft make to increase 'useful apps out of the box' will result in an anti-trust suit. When you've got close to no market share no-one cares what you do.

Microsoft doesn't load my system up with crap, Dell does that, Adobe does that, Yahoo does that. With the latest Yahoo Messenger, the opt-out of installing the Yahoo toolbar is 'hidden' in the advanced options .. nice ! Now When I get a new PC to setup I get my trusty Tiny XP image out out and have a lean mean XP install in no time. Boots quickly too.

I just looked at my PC and all the PC's (including laptops) around me .. not a blinking light to be seen .. headphone jacks are in the side so no problem there. You know if these are important issues for you then you should probably factor that in to your purchases. Maybe you should take some remedial shopping lessons instead of tilting a large corporate windmills. If I thought it was a good idea to pay extra money for subjective fit and finish issues that makes no overall difference to the system performance and usabilty then I guess I'd be a Mac user :)

'lameness free' .. is that the scientfic term .. 'New Apple Mac ! Now 90% lameness free !'

I work in mining and heavy industry. Windows PC's have 100% of that market due to their flexibily and reliabilty. If you buy the right PC, install the right software they just work. All the time. I managed the plant control network at a major industrial site for a number of years. It was a Windows PC network. The main file server, running NT 4.0, ran for 5 years, 24/7, no reboots, no problems, it was fully UPS backed and so it never shutdown even during extended power outages.
For home I bought a Dell PC 18 months ago and am running Vista Premium as a media centre. Pulled it out of the box, installed the TV tuner card, turned it on and use it everyday to record and watch TV, play games, use email, browse the web. Never had a problem with it .. not one.

So I don't know what you're all doing with the computers, but I think you should stop it, you'll go blind. If a major concern is 'Neat and contained system settings' then you're problably fiddling too much with them and that it was is stopping you from getting stuff done.


17 November 2008, 12:16 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Nicolas Gheeraert (New user):

Quoting pmx:
A Mac is not a PC .. and vice versa.
Quoting pmx:
If I thought it was a good idea to pay extra money for subjective fit and finish issues that makes no overall difference to the system performance and usabilty then I guess I'd be a Mac user :)
Quoting pmx:
If a major concern is 'Neat and contained system settings' then you're problably fiddling too much with them and that it was is stopping you from getting stuff done.

What you don't see is that all the "neat and well-organized things" of the OS X and mac apps have a lot of importance. Saying design is useless for work is naive, it has a lot to do with quality. Better organization and interface will obviously enable you to work faster while well chosen icons, colors and shapes will just make everything clearer on the screen. Mail, Safari, Pages... are good examples.

When you work on both systems like it is now possible on macs, as I do, you realize that very quickly. Even if some apps work only work with XP, you don't hestitate to switch to OSX for everything else, just to get a usable interface. It's obvious for picture, movie, music apps, but you realize it's the case as well for many other types of apps which have no acceptable equivalent on PC.

"A neat and contained" work environment, as you call it, is far from being a detail or even subjective. It has a direct consequence. I'd even say in lots of cases the interface compensates the lack of options compared to the tiring windows equivalent (as rare as this may be).

I agree the mac is not a pc, but they both fill the same consumer needs and so they can and have to be compared. And finally I'd like to remind you your personal experience is not an argument. You can't generalize your experience to the millions of PC users.



18 November 2008, 4:38 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

pmx (User):

What I see is that 'neat', 'contained', 'well organised' in this context are subjective concepts that all people interpret differently.
If there was some sort of empirical defintion of 'neat' and 'well organised' that could be applied consistently to different applications, I agree it could improve the user experience and productivity.
However that would only be of significant benefit in the case of the applications that are used a lot (Browsers, Office Apps etc) and still would not apply to 'System Settings' which the majority of users have minimial, if any, interaction with. Did you read point 9 ?

It is the argument of window dressers and interior decorators everywhere that form is as important (if not more so) than function. It is not and it doesn't have anything to do with quality and everything to do with image. I've used Safari and keep going back to Opera and IE. I've used iTunes and keeping going back to Windows Media Player. The more Microsoft tries to modify its interfaces to copy the Mac, the less usable it becomes. I turn off all the design features to get a consistent usable interface. I've only started using Office 2007 now because I found a program that recreates the menu structure.

My experiences are just as valid as yours and everyone elses, especially in the case of this PC-Mac argument which is entirely specious.

The Mac addresses a segment of the consumer market very well. Windows PC's address the entire consumer market and industrial markets as well as possible. Sports cars go faster but that doesn't mean they're a better cars that you're basic sedan.



18 November 2008, 12:59 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

WarwickBrown (New user):

CMD+SHIFT+3, CMD+SHIFT+4, and CMD+SHIFT+4 - SPACE for screenshots, not just CMD+.

What's annoying about Quick Look is that the system-wide icon previews didn't come along until late Longhorn as far as I remember, then Apple announced they'd be adding the same feature to Leopard in 2006 at WWDC, but would go one further and have the space bar trick. Microsoft could have done that and it would have been the single killer feature of Vista. Being a user of both Leopard and Vista, Quick Look really is that one thing that would make me upgrade my OS.

Oh, and Expose and Spaces are the shiz. Shame barely any Mac users know how to use them. "Why do you have it so that you need to hold Fn while you press the function keys to get them to do what it says on them" "So F8, F9, F10, F11, and F12 function normally" "What do they normally do?" Urgghhh!!!!

18 November 2008, 8:51 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Jitsukablue (New user):

I agree on nearly every point, however MS office is almost obsolete due to Open Office, and Macs iworks is far better than MS's offering anyway (with the exception of mail merge, take not Mac. sort that out!).
This is a real petty hate, but it winds me up.
Less and Fewer are not the same words. You cannot have less blinking lights.
Fewer blinking lights. Less Light.
Fewer Coffee beans. Less Coffee.
It's a bit like the countless journalists who can't say "debut". It is not DAY'BOOOOOO, it is more like Dey'Beau (as in beautiful). “Niche” is also not pronounced Nitch.


18 November 2008, 11:04 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

Quoting Jitsukablue:
Less and Fewer are not the same words. You cannot have less blinking lights.

Dan may well have been referring to less blinking of the LEDs or Lamps on his MAC, rather than what you have assumed, being fewer blinking lamps. :>


18 November 2008, 11:40 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Jitsukablue (New user):

Quoting Raindog:
Dan may well have been referring to less blinking of the LEDs or Lamps on his MAC, rather than what you have assumed, being fewer blinking lamps

It wasn't assumed, it was judging from the pictures and the content that followed thereafter. I think anyone reading that section can tell he is referring to the quantity of the lights, not the quality or how frequently each light blinks. I appreciate what you're saying, but even if that's the case words such as 'brighter' or 'frequent' come to mind.

18 November 2008, 12:08 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Papa-Raboon (New user):

Quoting Raindog:
Dan may well have been referring to less blinking of the LEDs or Lamps on his MAC

Highly doubt it mate. I have a Mac Pro, two MacBooks, a Mac Mini and an iMac and the only light on them is the power light which extingiushes when the Macs are running or shut down and gently pulsates when the Macs are sleeping. So there are no "blinking" lights on Macs at all. I have always wondered what the point is of having them on PCs Some have so many.

If you don't need them on the Mac.
Why do they put them on a PC.

And what about all those ugly high tack stickers. uuuugggghhhh!
:-)



19 November 2008, 2:53 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Highly doubt it mate.

I very much doubt it too, but speeling and grammer Nazis(LOL) that wish to be pedantic to the point of criticizing easy to understand sentences need to be dealt with. :>


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
and gently pulsates when the Macs are sleeping.

Ahah!, now you've done it the windows fan-boys will be onto that one. :>



Quoting Papa-Raboon:
If you don't need them on the Mac.
Why do they put them on a PC.

You don't need handlebars on a Ford Fairlane, but they are fairly useful accessory on a Kawasaki. And as I've stated previously some see all the flashy flash as a plus, even if you and I see it as being tat to the extreme.


Quoting Papa-Raboon:
And what about all those ugly high tack stickers. uuuugggghhhh!
:-)

Not one you can blame Windows for, well apart from the COA tags, but yes I agree 100% with your observation. Stickers suck, they are praise points for those who haven't quite made it.
I can't say I've ever once felt the need to look at the top cover of a notebook to know it was a Core-2 Duo, mind you Vista users may need such reassurance from time to time. :>
No sticker has ever made a PC work better, or made a car go faster, or made some knob of a user look clever.
I'll concede P-R you've added another plus point for the MAC cause and while MAC would not solve many of my computing needs it would save me a small fortune in Eucalyptus Oil come sticker removal time.


19 November 2008, 9:05 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Jitsukablue (New user):

Quoting Raindog:
Quoting Papa-Raboon:
Highly doubt it mate.

I very much doubt it too, but speeling and grammer Nazis(LOL) that wish to be pedantic to the point of criticizing easy to understand sentences need to be dealt with. :>

Lets see.
A) Thank the person and correct the mistake, or just correct the mistake and delete the evidence, or
B) Personally attack the kind person pointed out a mistake?
Hmmm... which one should I choose?

No need to get personal, I guessed as you are a publisher, then spelling and grammar would be important to you? Obviously not. It might make sense (because I know what was meant), but that doesn't make it correct, does it? That example is just as wrong as saying "I'd like 1st pizza with extra geeky cheese and 1st pizza with none". They may guess what they mean, but it wouldn't be correct.
Do I need to point out that 'speeling' and 'grammer' are also incorrect, or was that supposed to be some form of irony? Even then, that would be acceptable to have mistakes in forum comments.



25 November 2008, 9:02 PM (12 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

ESC (New user):

regarding #12: apple was hacked in 2 minutes flat, far ahead of windows, etc. see http://dvlabs.tippingpoint.com/blog/2008/03/27/day-two-of-cansecwest-pwn-to-own---we-have-our-first-official-winner-with-picture. I can't recommend apple to clients who have sensitive data on their computers. I have to recommend secured computers to them.

18 November 2008, 8:25 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

FilmCrzy (New user):

I hope i don't insult anyone saying this, but the reason why the masses like MACs are because they are idiot boxes. You don't have to "know" how to use a MAC, you can get on one do your thing. MACs have very few choice configurations for that specific reason. If they were as customizable as a PC they would have the same problems. Apple KNOWS this, this is why they sell RAM and other parts at a ridiculous costs and thats because what "Joe Ignorant" doesn't know, won't hurt him. So as a company they completly take adavantage of this. I own a MAC PRO and a MAC BOOK PRO and Custom PC. I use the MACs for Editing and the PC for Fun, but i can tell you right now, if the MAC OSX was actually released for any PC, you know damn well APPLE would go out of business and OS would have almost 100% of the same problems Windows does.

It has nothing to do with which operating system is better, it's how many users are on which. A good anology of the MAC user base and the PCs is Look a Large City like New York. This city has a extreme amount of people living in it, thus it can get quite dirty and crowded. Now compare it to a small city, more then likely it's less crowded and there is less trash. Hopefully that makes sense to some!

19 November 2008, 11:58 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

billythegates@web.de (New user):

First of all – I'm a Windows (XP) user and have never owned a MAC yet. But what really pisses me off at the moment is that I have just bought the new Adobe Creative Suite Master Collection for my IBM ThinkPad and I cannot install it due to repeatedly occurring BSODs. I tried it with another ThinkPad and the result was again repeatedly occurring Blue Screen at DVD #2 of #5. And what also pissed me off is that the installation of one DVD needs about 20 minutes to complete and the installer needs 280MB of RAM just to install programs – copying files from A to B while doing some changes to the Windows registry.

I have now spent 2 working-days on the installation of all CS4-programs and the only solution was to download all single test-versions and install them on-by-one. I do not want to know how much time – and as a freelancer MONEY – I have spent with installing Windows-based programs throughout my (professional) life. I'm about to switch because I am really sick of that over-dimensional time waste with Windows-based systems!

I know this was kind of off-topic because my special problem seems to be caused by Adobe's engineers – but I really wonder why installing programs in Windows can be such a mess!

@Dan, could you tell anyone out there if this kind of failure is likely to occur on a MAC? Thanks in advance!

19 November 2008, 8:22 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

renny (New user):

Every time I suggest to my coworkers that they dump their wintel hardware and get a Mac, their first response is 'expensive'. I've spent the last 4 years on a 'consumer' iBook G4 with only 2 outlays past the original - I typed all the letters off the keyboard and the battery finally gave up after 3 years. None of my coworkers can even use the computer they had 4 years ago - they are on their 2nd or even 3rd machine. (think total cost of ownership) I agree that Macs let you get your job done and put the controls that you need in a sensible and logical place. The Dock, though much maligned, is far superior to any other app switcher on the planet. Last night on my outdated machine, I spoke with Hong Kong by Skype, ripped a DVD for my iPod, and worked through quotes in Excel - all at the same time. Not bad for a 4 year old antique.

20 November 2008, 5:10 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Artie (New user):

In an ideal world, we would have an Operating System which is completely invisible from the user's perspective : how many of us interact directly with the OS in our phone/DVD player/games console ? The exception is development, and this where you really need a *nix shell, IMO. Microsoft finally got the message and we now have PowerShell (it had earlier incarnations, but this is the first time I have felt comfortable at a Windows command prompt). If Google has its way, the OS will occupy the position currently held by the BIOS - you need it to crank up the 'real' system, but only a chosen few get excited over it. As consumer hardware becomes ever more powerful, technologies like virtualisation will be increasingly viable as an alternative to multi-boot machines : hopefully, we will continue to have a choice re the user experience. I dont care whether they call it 'WinLynx OS XII' or 'FancyPants 1.0', and I dont really care which corporation funds it - it has to be fast, seamless and painless. Thanks, Santa.

20 November 2008, 2:55 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Artie (New user):

Dan, I just want Apple to continue innovating and forcing the other guys (hardware and software) to lift their own games. HP, for example, now have a range of consumer desktops and laptops that show real flair for design, even if they do come preloaded with mountains of crap and Vista. I have their DV9 17-inch laptop and am very happy with it, but I opted for the XP 'downgrade' when I bought my 'generic' gaming desktop : as much as I love the iMac, I cant see Apple ever selling a sub-$1500 iMac that gets 33 FPS with Crysis on high settings. My old 2.2GHz Macbook Pro sits quietly in the corner, waiting for the next time I want to access the Net without attracting every slimeware merchant on Earth :)

20 November 2008, 10:05 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Truckasauras (User):

We all know that the Apple 2e was kick a$$. Now there's a computer you can trust.

20 November 2008, 2:16 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

psharkauburn (New user):

I'm always amazed when people write articles like this because they never get things quite *right* or really *fair*. I've been using both OSs for years and each obviously has pros/cons. Two extremely important things to qualify before going further significantly effect most of the items on the authors list - 1. Microsoft Windows is the predominant market leader (somewhere in the 90-95% range Link; 2. Windows based PCs support vastly more hardware configurations/devices (and Microsoft in no way dictacts the hardware you purchase).

Reason 1: Personally I've never had issues with sleep mode, but I've supported users with issues on Windows PC. The vast majority of the problems came down to device drivers either being faulty or not updated. Nothing to really fault the Windows OS for, just a by-product of people being able to choose the hardware inside of their PC instead of having it dicated to you.

Reason 2: Yep, Mac's boot faster. This is one I could care less about, I only reboot on the occasion Windows Update requires it, or a major software install. Windows software installs definitely require more reboots post installation which is annoying, but it almost always comes down to the software manufactures and their coding skills. A good example is that MS Office 2007 doesn't require a reboot post install - software done right. I still give the Mac props though.

Reason 3: Just stupid - obviously isn't Windows related because Windows doesn't make parts. So which arbitrary vendor do you go up against? Apple vs. Dell, Apple vs. Sony, what? Dollar wise Apples products are inferior - for the same dollars spent you can get vastly superior parts from a multitude of Windows PC vendors (whether superior in quality at the same quantity level, or superior in quantity at a similar quality level). Maybe it's not common knowledge, but neither Apple nor Dell make very many components inside their machines, they buy them from hardware manufactures and assemble them together. What is common knowledge is the price premium charged for Apple products. On the Windows vendor side you have a choice to have the vendor use premium parts or not.

Reason 4: Same as 3 above, nothing to do with Windows, just a vendor by vendor thing. Some are better, some are worse. I personally love the new Dell Latitude E series. To be fair I also love the MacBook designs as well.

Reason 5: Very true - Boot Camp/Parallels is fantastic. Windows PCs had virtual server software ages before Mac recently got it, this is simply an Apple doesn't play nice with others issue - points to MSFT on this one. If only Apple didn't make so much profit on their hardware side, they might be inclined to attempt making their software product work on 95% of the computers out there.

Reason 6: Don't get it. Same utilities on Windows side - and in Vista it's all in one place - "Computer Management". I love the note the author puts on "console" - like Event Viewer doesn't put all the system logs in one place.

Reason 7: Plain ridiculous. I totally agree Mac has a good community of software out there. There is NO denying that Windows has an infinitely larger community of software out there - that's the number one reason to purchase a PC because it can run more software (maybe #2 reason, cost is a huge factor). Listing software is truly pointless here.

Reason 8: Damn skippy! Love the built in Mac software. On defense on MSFT side is that when they tried incorporating software into the OS they got sued to death - downfall to being the market leader. This would probably naturally be reversed if Apple dominated.

Reason 9: ??? Uh...everything the author listed is located in one place in Windows - in the control panel...which he listed. They're the same. I'm going to assume it was a brain fart on the authors part here. Even keel.

Reason 10: ??? Don't get it either. Windows doesn't include any *junk*. Back to the Apple Vs. Dell Vs. Sony Vs. Billy-Bob issue. Some better than others, but the consumer ultimately has the choice on the Windows side due to a massive number of vendors to choose from. No choice on Apple side.

Reason 11: item one = print screen (along with PS + Alt/Control/Shift) - don't get it. Rest of items I agree with.

Reason 12: Like the author says, huge point of contention - but oddly the author gets the point of contention wrong. Because Windows is absolutely market dominant, the bad guys out there target it. If roles were reversed we would naturally see the opposite. Macs definitely have security flaws - and like Windows they obviously provide updates to patch them. For some reason it reminds me of a very crappy gym in town towting itself as the best because there are no lines to use it's equipment...but what if it was a good popular gym?

Reason 13: Uhh...maybe? I won't criticize anyone for trying new things, I know Steve Jobs wouldn't either. Multiple editions of the OS - kind of lame, kind of nice to have some choice (authors addition skills to get to 10 seem troubling to me). XPS format - who cares? Why would trying to compete be bad. Adobe tried to sue MSFT in 2006 over them including PDF support in OS - another case of being leader being a detriment.
Of course you get prompted on changing the date - it should be left alone! Too many critical things depend on the date to function - same as in any OS.

Reason 14: Agreed - Linux has a better command line than DOS. Windows has the powershell which is better than Linux (incredible if you haven't tried it). Obviously command lines aren't for average users on any OS so I'm assuming you mean to target IT folks in this arena. I have no clue where Photoshop came into this reason - I assume the author knows there is Photoshop for Windows.

Reason 15: Just flat out wrong. Network Neighborhood in Windows has existed since 98...I have no clue how right clicking a folder and choosing share is difficult.

OK - analyzing reasons done. I really think the author needed #4 to be MacBook vs. all other notebooks and could have summed it up with "magnetic power cord", I would have been yelling "hell ya!".

I really hate coming off as a Windows fanboy, because truly I am not (I really am a PC fanboy that that includes pretty much all OSs) - I really love Macs. I just hate seeing these wacky lists that don't make sense.

My number 1 reason to like Macs more is that they repond much much faster to consumer demands. Again though, its just a by-product of having a small market. If Windows developed a new OS every year people would rail on them (why do I have to upgrade all the time!).

Like I started with, most arguments are completely dependant on MSFT being market leader and extremely hands-off on the hardware/software you can choose to use with it. It seems whenever MSFT tries to do something extremely helpful they get sued - sued multiple times by Apple in fact, as well as countless others. You're just an easy target when you are the leader.

I see OS's in a linear fashion. On one end of the spectrum is Linux - ultimately customizable, difficult to use for beginners but extremely capable for IT experts, much less commercial stable software and support, not for average user. Then comes Windows - very customizable, overhelming amounts of software both commercial and open source, tons of support and documentation, and runs on an overwhelming amount of hardware (which adds to the customizable part), easy to use for beginners, incredibly capable for experts. Then comes MacOS, extremely easy to use for beginners, but very lacking for IT experts; incredibly uncustomizable - very few hardware choices (and only 1 PC vendor on top of that!) and very few software choices (but the software that does exist tends to be towards the industry top - good but expensive).

If you don't like having choice (or can't make decisions) go the Mac route. Seriously, in the Mac store you only have 4 models to choose from (talking iMac here), beyond that choose whether you want wireless keyboard/mouse and you're done - simple and elegant. You got to admit the irony in the company and positions itself as targeting the creative/individual , you get the least amount of individualism/flexibilty/customization in their products.

Done.

20 November 2008, 7:07 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

mark.m (New user):

Great article, with good points throughout. As someone who lived in the PC world for (too) many years, I now absolutely "get" why I used to hear Mac owners saying "I love my Mac". I would like to add a comment on just two things:

1) Regarding the virus/spyware issue (12. Still no need for additional security software) - Yes, we Mac owners have been blessed for a long time with this wonderful advantage. There are several technical reasons for this (physically typing in a password to authorize installation of any app and admin does not equal root are just two examples), though I will not go as far to say that a Mac will never get a virus. But I think that a seven and a half year track record of zero viruses in the wild (not "proof of concept" code) is very impressive, in addition to being a money-saver insofar as not having to purchase all of the "anti-ware" and the annual subscription fees that is virtually a requirement on a Windows PC.

2) Regarding Apple's DRM (Whoah, hold up there, anonymous flamer) - Apple is currently REQUIRED to use their FairPlay DRM, based on contracts they have with the recording labels. Do you understand this is a legal issue that Apple simply cannot choose to arbitrarily ignore? You should be aware that a good number of independent labels (and also EMI as of April 2007) allow their songs to be sold on the iTunes Store without any DRM and at the higher 256kbps bit rate. The use of FairPlay is NOT Apple's choice or desire, as evidenced by Steve Jobs' call for an end to all DRM in February 2007. So why are you not attacking the record labels; THEY, not Apple, are the ones who need to be dragged into the 21st century (kicking and screaming, apparently). By criticizing Apple and not Universal, Sony, and Warner, you give the impression that you are just as sadly informed on the issue of DRM as that idiot Norwegian bureaucrat ( http://theappleblog.com/2008/10/08/norway-itunes-drm-war/ ).

21 November 2008, 5:35 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Samboc (New user):

Interesting comments. I fix PC's for a living. ( I know MAC's don't break !!). Had to help set up a home network the other day. 3 computers - a XP Laptop, XP desktop and the latest MAC ( Running on Intel with XP in a 4 GB partition?? ) I setup the XP systems and had a look at the MAC. ( Have only seen 2 or 3 in my life). It was faily intuitive to access the network area and set up network ID's and passwords and it worked in a minute or two. The similarity between the MAC and Windows 3.1 was remarkable and certainly helped my navigation.

After a bit more checking the XP desktop showed very obvious signs of spyware and IP Hijacking which is another problem. When I isolated the MAC it showed exactly the same symptons. I have seen this form of spyware many times. It can be fixed with a lot of effort - the quickest fix is to reformat the HDD and reinstall. What do I do with the MAC ??

22 November 2008, 9:42 PM (12 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Samboc (New user):

Interesting comments. I fix PC's for a living. ( I know MAC's don't break !!). Had to help set up a home network the other day. 3 computers - a XP Laptop, XP desktop and the latest MAC ( Running on Intel with XP in a 4 GB partition?? ) I setup the XP systems and had a look at the MAC. ( Have only seen 2 or 3 in my life). It was faily intuitive to access the network area and set up network ID's and passwords and it worked in a minute or two. The similarity between the MAC and Windows 3.1 was remarkable and certainly helped my navigation.

After a bit more checking the XP desktop showed very obvious signs of spyware and IP Hijacking which is another problem. When I isolated the MAC it showed exactly the same symptons. I have seen this form of spyware many times. It can be fixed with a lot of effort - the quickest fix is to reformat the HDD and reinstall. What do I do with the MAC ??

22 November 2008, 9:56 PM (12 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Samboc (New user):

PS - Did I mention I tried to scroll on the MAC - Ancient history

22 November 2008, 9:56 PM (12 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

HostingDude (New user):

Is it just me, or is this whole thing LAME as hell. I RESISTED updating from Windows 2k for YEARS because nothing was stable enough... point surrendered. BUT, now, after installing Vista Ultimate 64 on a quad core, well f*ck it, I'm a believer again. Keep in mind I'm 45 years old and my FIRST PC was an Apple II. Yes, we called Apples PC's back then... hell anything was a Personal Computer. Then I had a II+ Then a IIc. Then a IIe. Then a 386. Then a 486. You see, I switched when the bulk of software switched. And cost went down. And ease of connecting a hard drive without ripping a hole in my wallet to buy a cider or bCider. Look, Apple, I was with you in college, and you screwed me then. Steve Jobs can't win me back now with 3 percent of the market. You HAD the lion's share of the market in 1984/85/86 when the Apple II had more software written for it than any computer on the market. And you PISSED IT AWAY. Don't expect me to feel sorry for you.

Hey, when I want to play with something UNIXish or LINUXish, I can log into my leased CentOS 5 server, or my other server running RedHat Fedora Core, or my other server running FreeBSD. But don't shove that crap onto my own computer at home. Here, I want to load stuff everybody else uses, and I can use too. Stuff that I can EASILY find fixes for because it's used by EVERYBODY, not just some Steve Jobs-adoring freakazoid with no income.

Get a life, dude. Get Vista Ultimate on a Quad-Core processor, and give up the Windows-bashing. You'll always be number 3. (Note, not number 2 -- Linux holds that crown. Number 3.) Dumbf*ck.

24 November 2008, 7:28 PM (12 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

HostingDude (New user):

Is it just me, or is this whole thing LAME as hell. I RESISTED updating from Windows 2k for YEARS because nothing was stable enough... point surrendered. BUT, now, after installing Vista Ultimate 64 on a quad core, well f*ck it, I'm a believer again. Keep in mind I'm 45 years old and my FIRST PC was an Apple II. Yes, we called Apples PC's back then... hell anything was a Personal Computer. Then I had a II+ Then a IIc. Then a IIe. Then a 386. Then a 486. You see, I switched when the bulk of software switched. And cost went down. And ease of connecting a hard drive without ripping a hole in my wallet to buy a cider or bCider. Look, Apple, I was with you in college, and you screwed me then. Steve Jobs can't win me back now with 3 percent of the market. You HAD the lion's share of the market in 1984/85/86 when the Apple II had more software written for it than any computer on the market. And you PISSED IT AWAY. Don't expect me to feel sorry for you.

Hey, when I want to play with something UNIXish or LINUXish, I can log into my leased CentOS 5 server, or my other server running RedHat Fedora Core, or my other server running FreeBSD. But don't shove that crap onto my own computer at home. Here, I want to load stuff everybody else uses, and I can use too. Stuff that I can EASILY find fixes for because it's used by EVERYBODY, not just some Steve Jobs-adoring freakazoid with no income.

Get a life, dude. Get Vista Ultimate on a Quad-Core processor, and give up the Windows-bashing. You'll always be number 3. (Note, not number 2 -- Linux holds that crown. Number 3.) Dumbf*ck.

24 November 2008, 7:30 PM (12 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

HostingDude (New user):

Is it just me, or is this whole thing LAME as hell. I RESISTED updating from Windows 2k for YEARS because nothing was stable enough... point surrendered. BUT, now, after installing Vista Ultimate 64 on a quad core, well f*ck it, I'm a believer again. Keep in mind I'm 45 years old and my FIRST PC was an Apple II. Yes, we called Apples PC's back then... hell anything was a Personal Computer. Then I had a II+ Then a IIc. Then a IIe. Then a 386. Then a 486. You see, I switched when the bulk of software switched. And cost went down. And ease of connecting a hard drive without ripping a hole in my wallet to buy a cider or bCider. Look, Apple, I was with you in college, and you screwed me then. Steve Jobs can't win me back now with 3 percent of the market. You HAD the lion's share of the market in 1984/85/86 when the Apple II had more software written for it than any computer on the market. And you PISSED IT AWAY. Don't expect me to feel sorry for you.

Hey, when I want to play with something UNIXish or LINUXish, I can log into my leased CentOS 5 server, or my other server running RedHat Fedora Core, or my other server running FreeBSD. But don't shove that crap onto my own computer at home. Here, I want to load stuff everybody else uses, and I can use too. Stuff that I can EASILY find fixes for because it's used by EVERYBODY, not just some Steve Jobs-adoring freakazoid with no income.

Get a life, dude. Get Vista Ultimate on a Quad-Core processor, and give up the Windows-bashing. You'll always be number 3. (Note, not number 2 -- Linux holds that crown. Number 3.) Dumbf*ck.

24 November 2008, 7:30 PM (12 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

HostingDude (New user):

P.S. You're just copying the concept of "10 reasons that an iPhone is no Blackberry." There is a difference. That comparison is EXACTLY RIGHT. The iPhone is indeed a lame piece of eye-candy-trash that can't do a damn thing businesslike. Here, you're trying to argue the opposite -- that a piece of goof-off hardware is better than a real business machine. Your head is seriously up your arss, dude. Seriously.

24 November 2008, 7:37 PM (12 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

InformationOverlord (User):

A few points I disagree with...

2. My Vista PC boots to a desktop in 50 seconds and my 2 year old xp PC (E6600) in 35 seconds (No av though), not the minutes suggested. Although this is NOT a laptop, the article title suggests macs are better in general including desktop PC's

3. Im sorry, but this is just not a valid point. There is only one producer for macs, and yes, they do use good parts. However, there are many PC manufacturors that will too - you cant just generalise.

6. Its pretty easy to troubleshoot windows too - and if you dont know your way around, there are plenty of free apps and/or support communities to help you out.

7. Im sure you could find apps similar to visual hub, onepassword and transmit. As for Adium, GAIM or Trillian.

8. Vista has an integrated stickynote app for sidebar, Windows Media Center which can replace iPhoto, Windows Calender to replace iCal and TimeMachine is a waste of space in my personal opinion. Thats not to say I cant appreciate that some people would find it useful.

9. Apart from the registry, all those apps are contained in the control panel - whats wrong with that?
And, in any case, the access to the registry gives a flexibility to tweaking programs that you dont get on a mac.

10. *cough iTunes cough*. And the key is just that - Brand name PC's. Thats not Windows Dan, thats the PC manufacturors.

11. Look on sourceforge for a screencapture utility. Get RKLauncher (from sourceforge), its a better version of the mac dock for windows. As for quicklook, I must be odd in that I can wait 8 seconds for Word or acrobat to Open. And windows can view most images.

12. As for this, Viruses that target Macs have existed since 2006 (http://www.sophos.com/pressoffice/news/articles/2006/02/macosxleap.html) All macs do is lull you into a false sense of security. And you dont have to pay annual subscription on ZoneAlarm, Spybot and Avast!.

13. Hey ive got a point for mac? How about the MacBook Air, with its whole army of ONE USB port. Or OSX's inability to play any decent games? Thats pretty lame to me.

14. You say that OSX has a better command shell than Windows. Right after saying that average users [i.e. not power user's] cant even download 3rd part apps. Well im sure these users will harness the power of the OSX command shell. And Windows users have free development languages in programs like SharpDevelop, VB.net Express etc which is much more powerfull that the apple command line. And windows has Photoshop CS4.

15. And Windows is harder to share files with?



26 November 2008, 4:51 PM (12 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

InformationOverlord (User):

A few points I disagree with...

2. My Vista PC boots to a desktop in 50 seconds and my 2 year old xp PC (E6600) in 35 seconds (No av though), not the minutes suggested. Although this is NOT a laptop, the article title suggests macs are better in general including desktop PC's

3. Im sorry, but this is just not a valid point. There is only one producer for macs, and yes, they do use good parts. However, there are many PC manufacturors that will too - you cant just generalise.

6. Its pretty easy to troubleshoot windows too - and if you dont know your way around, there are plenty of free apps and/or support communities to help you out.

7. Im sure you could find apps similar to visual hub, onepassword and transmit. As for Adium, GAIM or Trillian.

8. Vista has an integrated stickynote app for sidebar, Windows Media Center which can replace iPhoto, Windows Calender to replace iCal and TimeMachine is a waste of space in my personal opinion. Thats not to say I cant appreciate that some people would find it useful.

9. Apart from the registry, all those apps are contained in the control panel - whats wrong with that?
And, in any case, the access to the registry gives a flexibility to tweaking programs that you dont get on a mac.

10. *cough iTunes cough*. And the key is just that - Brand name PC's. Thats not Windows Dan, thats the PC manufacturors.

11. Look on sourceforge for a screencapture utility. Get RKLauncher (from sourceforge), its a better version of the mac dock for windows. As for quicklook, I must be odd in that I can wait 8 seconds for Word or acrobat to Open. And windows can view most images.

12. As for this, Viruses that target Macs have existed since 2006 (http://www.sophos.com/pressoffice/news/articles/2006/02/macosxleap.html) All macs do is lull you into a false sense of security. And you dont have to pay annual subscription on ZoneAlarm, Spybot and Avast!.

13. Hey ive got a point for mac? How about the MacBook Air, with its whole army of ONE USB port. Or OSX's inability to play any decent games? Thats pretty lame to me.

14. You say that OSX has a better command shell than Windows. Right after saying that average users [i.e. not power user's] cant even download 3rd part apps. Well im sure these users will harness the power of the OSX command shell. And Windows users have free development languages in programs like SharpDevelop, VB.net Express etc which is much more powerfull that the apple command line. And windows has Photoshop CS4.

15. And Windows is harder to share files with?



26 November 2008, 4:51 PM (12 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

InformationOverlord (User):

A few points I disagree with...

2. My Vista PC boots to a desktop in 50 seconds and my 2 year old xp PC (E6600) in 35 seconds (No av though), not the minutes suggested. Although this is NOT a laptop, the article title suggests macs are better in general including desktop PC's

3. Im sorry, but this is just not a valid point. There is only one producer for macs, and yes, they do use good parts. However, there are many PC manufacturors that will too - you cant just generalise.

6. Its pretty easy to troubleshoot windows too - and if you dont know your way around, there are plenty of free apps and/or support communities to help you out.

7. Im sure you could find apps similar to visual hub, onepassword and transmit. As for Adium, GAIM or Trillian.

8. Vista has an integrated stickynote app for sidebar, Windows Media Center which can replace iPhoto, Windows Calender to replace iCal and TimeMachine is a waste of space in my personal opinion. Thats not to say I cant appreciate that some people would find it useful.

9. Apart from the registry, all those apps are contained in the control panel - whats wrong with that?
And, in any case, the access to the registry gives a flexibility to tweaking programs that you dont get on a mac.

10. *cough iTunes cough*. And the key is just that - Brand name PC's. Thats not Windows Dan, thats the PC manufacturors.

11. Look on sourceforge for a screencapture utility. Get RKLauncher (from sourceforge), its a better version of the mac dock for windows. As for quicklook, I must be odd in that I can wait 8 seconds for Word or acrobat to Open. And windows can view most images.

12. As for this, Viruses that target Macs have existed since 2006 (http://www.sophos.com/pressoffice/news/articles/2006/02/macosxleap.html) All macs do is lull you into a false sense of security. And you dont have to pay annual subscription on ZoneAlarm, Spybot and Avast!.

13. Hey ive got a point for mac? How about the MacBook Air, with its whole army of ONE USB port. Or OSX's inability to play any decent games? Thats pretty lame to me.

14. You say that OSX has a better command shell than Windows. Right after saying that average users [i.e. not power user's] cant even download 3rd part apps. Well im sure these users will harness the power of the OSX command shell. And Windows users have free development languages in programs like SharpDevelop, VB.net Express etc which is much more powerfull that the apple command line. And windows has Photoshop CS4.

15. And Windows is harder to share files with?



26 November 2008, 4:52 PM (12 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

InformationOverlord (User):

A few points I disagree with...

2. My Vista PC boots to a desktop in 50 seconds and my 2 year old xp PC (E6600) in 35 seconds (No av though), not the minutes suggested. Although this is NOT a laptop, the article title suggests macs are better in general including desktop PC's

3. Im sorry, but this is just not a valid point. There is only one producer for macs, and yes, they do use good parts. However, there are many PC manufacturors that will too - you cant just generalise.

6. Its pretty easy to troubleshoot windows too - and if you dont know your way around, there are plenty of free apps and/or support communities to help you out.

7. Im sure you could find apps similar to visual hub, onepassword and transmit. As for Adium, GAIM or Trillian.

8. Vista has an integrated stickynote app for sidebar, Windows Media Center which can replace iPhoto, Windows Calender to replace iCal and TimeMachine is a waste of space in my personal opinion. Thats not to say I cant appreciate that some people would find it useful.

9. Apart from the registry, all those apps are contained in the control panel - whats wrong with that?
And, in any case, the access to the registry gives a flexibility to tweaking programs that you dont get on a mac.

10. *cough iTunes cough*. And the key is just that - Brand name PC's. Thats not Windows Dan, thats the PC manufacturors.

11. Look on sourceforge for a screencapture utility. Get RKLauncher (from sourceforge), its a better version of the mac dock for windows. As for quicklook, I must be odd in that I can wait 8 seconds for Word or acrobat to Open. And windows can view most images.

12. As for this, Viruses that target Macs have existed since 2006 (http://www.sophos.com/pressoffice/news/articles/2006/02/macosxleap.html) All macs do is lull you into a false sense of security. And you dont have to pay annual subscription on ZoneAlarm, Spybot and Avast!.

13. Hey ive got a point for mac? How about the MacBook Air, with its whole army of ONE USB port. Or OSX's inability to play any decent games? Thats pretty lame to me.

14. You say that OSX has a better command shell than Windows. Right after saying that average users [i.e. not power user's] cant even download 3rd part apps. Well im sure these users will harness the power of the OSX command shell. And Windows users have free development languages in programs like SharpDevelop, VB.net Express etc which is much more powerfull that the apple command line. And windows has Photoshop CS4.

15. And Windows is harder to share files with?



26 November 2008, 4:53 PM (12 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Papa-Raboon (New user):

@Information Overlord

"A few points I disagree with... "
Good for you IO we are all entitled to our opinions on the web so lets see what you wrote that I disagree with :-)

"6. Its pretty easy to troubleshoot windows too - and if you dont know your way around, there are plenty of free apps and/or support communities to help you out."
I would wholeheartedly disagree with you on that. Registry troubles are something you would need a very experienced Windows tech to sort out and if you get it wrong you need to format and re-nstall everything including windows and that requires a phone call to MS WGA team to re-authenticate. What if it happens out of working hours with a tight deadline to get finished.

Macs rarely go wrong software wise. They used to with OS 9 and you used to have extension conflicts to deal with but not with the OS X UNIX 03 core. I really cannot remember a time when I had to troubleshoot OS X except for when I bought some cheap RAM that didn't show up. The Mac still worked though. It just didn't show the RAM. And I have had two hard drives that wore ou. The first was a pig and I lost loads because I wasn't using a backup utility. The second was completely recoverable due to using Time Machine. I restored from it and voila! I was back up and running.

"TimeMachine is a waste of space in my personal opinion. Thats not to say I cant appreciate that some people would find it useful."
Thank you, I certainly did. Good luck when your drive goes down :-)

"9. Apart from the registry, all those apps are contained in the control panel - whats wrong with that? "

Yeah, the author wasn't very clear on one point here which is obvious from your comment. To add and remove programs on Windows you have to use installers and un-installers or the "Add and remove programs" utility and it generally sprays stuff all over your hard drive .dll files, additions to the registry. Now that's fine if done properly but if the un-installer is badly coded (it happens more often than people admit) you still end up with fragments of code and registry additions which eventually cause issues and turn your once speed demon into a dog slow PC. I know many people who format and re-build their hard drives either every 6 months or every year.

To install Mac apps you just have to drag them to the Applications folder and to un-install then you just have to drag them to the trash and empty it. Occasionally you get an installer which gives you an App in the Applications folder and folder of libraries in the "Application Support" folder that is clearly named and easily removed but they are for code that is commonly used by a suite of programs like Adobe CS3. It's not system level stuff and therefore doesn't affect system performance. And there is no registry to bugger up. Mac Apps are pretty much self contained. So you really don't need to troubleshoot OS X in the sense you need to troubleshoot Windows.

"And, in any case, the access to the registry gives a flexibility to tweaking programs that you dont get on a mac."

You need to tweak Windows registry in order to make it work properly? OMG

"10. *cough iTunes cough*. "
*cough Media Centre cough" your point is?

"And the key is just that - Brand name PC's. Thats not Windows Dan, thats the PC manufacturors. "

If we're talking about Mr or Mrs average's first PC buying experience then the author's comment here is valid. You do get a lot of crapware to remove with a brand name PC. Demo apps etc.

Now back to iTunes. It's a fine piece of software and don't let anyone tell you different without explaining why they think that. iTunes is not a demo demo application. I use it every day and it works perfectly and is easy to use too. I'll go as far as saying it's integration with airtunes, the iPod and the AppleTV are amazing. I can totally control my Mac's iTunes upstairs over WiFi with my iPhone and hear the tunes on our Hifi which is plugged into the audio output of our Airport Express router that communicates with our Airport Extreme router upstairs again over WiFi. It was a synch to set up too. I can stream movies seamlessly over WiFi from iTunes to our AppleTV plugged into 1080i on our 42" LCD TV. And do that with all the Macs in our house. All with a tiny little remote control. It's very transparent to use. iTunes is awesome! Do all that with WinAmp!!!


"11. Look on sourceforge for a screencapture utility. Get RKLauncher (from sourceforge), its a better version of the mac dock for windows."

I thought we were talking about Windows here. Is RKLauncher included with Vista?
Don't see the point here, you are saying they copied the OS X dock and that in some ways makes Windows better? I'm sure if you think there are better features in RKLauncher that someone could make the same or an even better app for OS X. In fact there have been many dock extensions made by third party devs over the years. What's your point?


"As for quicklook, I must be odd in that I can wait 8 seconds for Word or acrobat to Open. And windows can view most images."

Quicklook is instantaneous. So lets say you were going into a meeting in five minutes and needed to quickly review a bunch of media that you only got a few minutes ago off a colleague on a USB stick. You have an audio file (any format) a spreadsheet, a word document a couple of images and a movie all in the same folder. In Leopard you highlight the first document (an image) and click the quicklook button at the top of the finder window. Your image instantly appears. You can press your down arrow (or use your mouse) and your spreadsheet appears. It's multipage? No problem you can view them all in full screen if you want. You arrow down to your Word Doc, same thing, just appears. You go down to your audio file and it starts playing through your speakers. You arrow down to the movie and it starts playing, with sound. You also have a full set of standard controls for movies and audio and can bring a bunch of thumbnails up of any type in a folder if you want to use that as well. All instant. Your Windows using colleague in the meantime is waiting for all of those Apps to load and has a memory issue (not enough to run all of those apps on his laptop). So he has to close each app after he has loaded it to open the next one. He gets 2 - 3 minutes to review and you get the full 5 minutes in Leopard. Quicklook not that useful eh? I use it all the time!

12. As for this, Viruses that target Macs have existed since 2006 (http://www.sophos.com/pressoffice/news/articles/2006/02/macosxleap.html) All macs do is lull you into a false sense of security. And you dont have to pay annual subscription on ZoneAlarm, Spybot and Avast!.

Well please can you tell me of an OS X user who has actually had this virus or any other virus in the wild. (0 - 49 users apparently and it caused no damage). It's as easy to catch as a flying wet bar of soap in a shower, as dangerous as a common cold and as prolific as a "penny black" stamp. And contrary to popular belief it is not technically a virus as a virus requires zero human intervention. You want to read a true recount of the Leap-A "virus"? Here is one and links to a few more are at the bottom.
http://www.creativetechs.com/tips/quicktips_83-special.html

Just because XP and Vista are as virulent as a whores drawers doesn't mean other OS's are so full of holes they need virus checkers. On OS X you don't even need a firewall but you get one free with it anyway. Just in case you are used to using windows and have become neurotic because of it.

13. Hey ive got a point for mac? How about the MacBook Air, with its whole army of ONE USB port.

Macbook Air is thin, very light, well built and perfect for a road warrior who needs to travel light. And USB ports. I never use them with laptops. I do with desktops. I have 5 Macs and there is plenty of choice. Sometimes extra ports are a waste of space, weight and time. My Mac Pro has 5 USB ports and I can make it 6 when I plug my keyboard into one of them as it has two USB ports itself. Weak argument. You get two USB ports on the other Mac Laptops. Not that I ever use them.

"Or OSX's inability to play any decent games? Thats pretty lame to me."

Emmm. That's down to the manufacturers of the games isn't it?
If you spend all of your time playing games then you may as well get a console. How about an XBox 360. I hear they've so far made several $billion loss on that they need to sell more. You love Microsoft that much, go buy one!

"14. You say that OSX has a better command shell than Windows."

It does, it's UNIX 03 certified!

"Right after saying that average users [i.e. not power user's] cant even download 3rd part apps."

What on Windows do you mean? Because these third party apps might contain malware? Good point, finally talking sense. When you getting your first Mac then? :-)

"Well im sure these users will harness the power of the OSX command shell."

Well my 69 year old father won't that's for sure. But I log into Linux Boxes at a data centre in London every day using the Terminal app on my Mac and I also occasionally install and configure PHP, MySQL and Apache on various OS X boxes as well and it helps to have a good command shell if you want to perform custom configurations. ./configure, make, make install. It's UNIX. And to a power user like me it's useful. If I had to do the same things on Windows I would have to slum it with a DOS like command prompt Uuggghhh!

"And Windows users have free development languages in programs like SharpDevelop, VB.net Express etc which is much more powerfull that the apple command line."

Uuh! Command line terminals and IDE/Debugger environments are totally different things. Apple gives you Xcode Free on a Mac. You can develop with a ton of languages out of the box and code for the iPhone and iPod touch too. A lucrative market by the way.

"And windows has Photoshop CS4."
So does Mac, What's your point? And I've been using Photoshop since version 1.0. You haven't (unless you had a Mac) Photoshop 1.0 was released in 1990 for Macintosh exclusively.[5] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adobe_Photoshop (Last sentence of second paragraph).

How much did MS pay you to write this FUD anyway IO?

26 November 2008, 9:25 PM (12 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

InformationOverlord (User):

@Papa-Raboon:

"I would wholeheartedly disagree with you on that. Registry troubles are something you would need a very experienced Windows tech to sort out"

You are embarrassing yourself here, Papa-Raboon, with your obviously limited knowledge of windows. How you can say you need an experienced Windows tech to double click on a .reg file and hit OK I dont know. And if that fails, www.crossloop.com will get the problem sorted.

"Macs rarely go wrong software wise"

Maybe they don't. I dont use macs very often so I wont comment (obviously a view you dont subscribe to). But I can say that my windows PC very rarely has a problem too.

re TimeMachine "Thank you, I certainly did. Good luck when your drive goes down :-)"

Well, I have a RAID 1 setup so I can easily restore data if any problems occur. So thanks for wishing me luck, but I wont need it.

"Now that's fine if done properly but if the un-installer is badly coded (it happens more often than people admit) you still end up with fragments of code and registry additions which eventually cause issues and turn your once speed demon into a dog slow PC"

And that is the fault of Microsoft how? Add/Remove programs just executes the uninstaller script bundled with the program. Macs can have that problem too - its up to the developer.

"You need to tweak Windows registry in order to make it work properly? OMG"

Did I say that? I said it gives you more flexibility, which it does. You only have to look at tools like tweakXP to realise that. The apps will still run fine, but power-users can excercise a greater level of control.

"*cough Media Centre cough" your point is?"
At least media-centre doesnt load on startup and waste PC resources. It also isn't plastered with advertising.

"If we're talking about Mr or Mrs average's first PC buying experience then the author's comment here is valid. You do get a lot of crapware to remove with a brand name PC. Demo apps etc."

Well we are discussing windows and OSX, not Dell/HP/Compaq and Apple.

" I can stream movies seamlessly over WiFi from iTunes to our AppleTV plugged into 1080i on our 42" LCD TV. And do that with all the Macs in our house. All with a tiny little remote control. It's very transparent to use. iTunes is awesome! Do all that with WinAmp!!!"

I can use my $249 D-Link DSM-320 to do the same thing for $100 less

"I thought we were talking about Windows here. Is RKLauncher included with Vista?
Don't see the point here, you are saying they copied the OS X dock and that in some ways makes Windows better?"

I personally dont use it - what I am saying is that its an option for those who find it preferable.

"Quicklook is instantaneous. So lets say you were going into a meeting in five minutes and needed to quickly review a bunch of media that you only got a few minutes ago off a colleague on a USB stick. You have an audio file (any format) a spreadsheet, a word document a couple of images and a movie all in the same folder... Your Windows using colleague in the meantime is waiting for all of those Apps to load and has a memory issue (not enough to run all of those apps on his laptop). So he has to close each app after he has loaded it to open the next one. He gets 2 - 3 minutes to review and you get the full 5 minutes in Leopard. Quicklook not that useful eh? I use it all the time!"

I just pulled out a stopwatch. Picture/Fax viewer - 0.4 seconds. Word - 1.1 seconds. Media Player - 3.8 seconds. Excel - 1.3 seconds. Last time i checked that doesnt add to 2 minutes.

"Just because XP and Vista are as virulent as a whores drawers doesn't mean other OS's are so full of holes they need virus checkers. On OS X you don't even need a firewall but you get one free with it anyway"

You get a firewall with windows too. And I have a windows PC, used it for 2 years with no Anti-Virus (i'd prefer not to have the performance impact) and have not got a virus yet. As long as you dont download dodgy torrents etc, Windows systems are fine.

"Macbook Air is thin, very light, well built and perfect for a road warrior who needs to travel light. And USB ports. I never use them with laptops. I do with desktops. I have 5 Macs and there is plenty of choice. Sometimes extra ports are a waste of space, weight and time"

Perfect for a road warror? I would think that Wireless Broadband would be nice? Oh well, there goes your single USB port. And a slow 4200RPM iPod drive as a system drive with a measly 80GB? Not going to fit too much on that. Of course, you could take an external harddrive but oh wait - that sort of ruins the point of a small notebook and you cant have your broadband and your external HDD at the same time. As for extra ports being a waste of space, weight and time, They use maybe 1 sq. cm for 2 (1 on top of the other), they might add a gram or two and just how do they waste time?

"If you spend all of your time playing games then you may as well get a console. How about an XBox 360. I hear they've so far made several $billion loss on that they need to sell more. You love Microsoft that much, go buy one!"

I dont spend all my time playing games. I would just appreciate being able to load a decent looking game when I feel like it. As for loving microsoft, I dont. I have a PS3, not a 360. I can just appreciate that they have a good OS, much better than Apple fanbois would have you believe.

"What on Windows do you mean? Because these third party apps might contain malware? Good point, finally talking sense. When you getting your first Mac then? :-)"

At least I dont have to misinterpret comments to come up with a 'retort'.

"But I log into Linux Boxes at a data centre in London every day using the Terminal app on my Mac and I also occasionally install and configure PHP, MySQL and Apache on various OS X boxes as well and it helps to have a good command shell if you want to perform custom configurations. ./configure, make, make install. It's UNIX. And to a power user like me it's useful. If I had to do the same things on Windows I would have to slum it with a DOS like command prompt Uuggghhh!"

Thats what registry scripts (.reg files) are for. Custom configurations.

"How much did MS pay you to write this FUD anyway IO?"

Nothing. All I can say is that at least I dont have to resort to off-topic attacks to get my point across.

27 November 2008, 5:27 PM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Papa-Raboon (New user):

@InformationOverlord
"You are embarrassing yourself here, Papa-Raboon, with your obviously limited knowledge of windows."

Of course it's limited. I only use Windows for testing web dev work in IE 6 & 7. I mainly go by what I hear from the Windows users I know and what I find with a google search. You'd have to pay me to regularly use Windows and even then I would boot up a Mac or Ubuntu box once your back is turned :-)

"How you can say you need an experienced Windows tech to double click on a .reg file and hit OK I dont know. And if that fails, www.crossloop.com will get the problem sorted."

Went to www.crossloop.com Seems you have to pay to join and you get to chat to people on the net who can help you. Sounds great but lets say you were installing a ton of software on your PC and you get a power failure half way through. You re-start your PC and get a blue screen. You try to hit F8 0n startup to choose the option to go back to your last working Windows configuration and you're the unlucky 1 out of 10 that it doesn't work for so you are left dead in the water. (if you actually know to hit F8).

So you can't boot up and it's your only computer. How can you get onto www.crossloop.com to ask for advice?

Regarding the Windows registry. Here is a website (one of many) that says putting the configuration settings for everything in one file is a dumb idea. http://www.codinghorror.com/blog/archives/000939.html
If you search for Macs and OS X in the comments you will see nothing but praise for the way Apple implemented application preferences and nothing but disgust for the way Microsoft implemented the registry. These are mainly Windows programmers commenting.

"Maybe they don't. I dont use macs very often so I wont comment (obviously a view you dont subscribe to). But I can say that my windows PC very rarely has a problem too."

Fair enough. But you commented negatively on Time Machine and quick look! Things you know either little or nothing about. But my point is, once you have a problem with Windows it can mean you're down for the count. It's fairly easy to break if you tinker and don't know what you are doing. A friend of mine is a self employed PC trouble-shooter and he is always going out fixing people's Windows boxes for a fee. He makes a fortune because of the issues people have with Windows. OS X is a cleaner tighter more secure OS so it's harder harder to mess up. EG, you need to know the root password to get edit or delete the system files like any UNIX or UNIX based OS.

"Well, I have a RAID 1 setup so I can easily restore data if any problems occur. So thanks for wishing me luck, but I wont need it."

Good for you, but your original comment was that Time Machine was a waste of space in your opinion. So how is this different to implementing RAID 1. They both use a big chunk of external drive space. Thing is, Time Machine is a no brainer to set up and restore from. Your granny could figure it out. Just plug in an external drive and OS X asks you if you want to use the drive as a Time Machine backup drive. You say yes and you're done. It backs up everything unless you go into the preferences and select things you don't want to back up. That's it. Good luck to the PC newbie who has just bought their shiny new dell box and a RAID 1 system setting it up. Might need to ring a techie for help (at a cost).

"And that is the fault of Microsoft how? Add/Remove programs just executes the uninstaller script bundled with the program. Macs can have that problem too - its up to the developer."

Really? to uninstall 99.9% of software on a Mac you just have to drop the App in the trash and empty it. And on the other .01% you can do that too but you might be left with a folder in Application Support which you can either trash or not. It doesn't affect the system if you leave it.

"You need to tweak Windows registry in order to make it work properly? OMG"

Did I say that? I said it gives you more flexibility, which it does. You only have to look at tools like tweakXP to realise that. The apps will still run fine, but power-users can excercise a greater level of control.

On a Mac you go 'Application menu -> preferences' and set the preferences to give you more control. It amends the applications preferences file to new settings. If the application fricks up for some reason you can trash that file and a new default one is created. Been like that since Macs were created.

"*cough Media Centre cough" your point is?"
At least media-centre doesnt load on startup and waste PC resources. It also isn't plastered with advertising.

Neither does iTunes on the Mac. I presume that it loads Apple software update on Windows at startup so you know whether there is an update for iTunes, Quicktime or Safari.

"Well we are discussing windows and OSX, not Dell/HP/Compaq and Apple."

But can you run Mac OS X on anything other than a Mac (not legally anyway) and also can you run Windows on your toaster or Doovde player? Nope, so Windows is useless without a PC and if you buy a cheap one your Windows experience is marred with the inclusion on your shiny new Acer of a ton of crapware. Which is often hard to delete. And it's Microsoft's fault for their business model. It's an OEM OS and the PC manufacturers have to pay a licence fee for it so to make any decent profit on their cheap and cheerful lines they have to offset the cost of the 'doze licence with the cash they get from crapware suppliers. If they used Linux they would make enough profit not to have to install stupid demo software.

"I can use my $249 D-Link DSM-320 to do the same thing for $100 less"

But can you use your phone to view your albums, artists, playlists etc and turn the volume up and down, play pause etc over your TV and HiFi viewing stuff on your PC's WMC from your bathroom over Wi-Fi. For no extra fee? Quickly, and easily with multi-touch?

"Quicklook is instantaneous. So lets say you were going into a meeting in five minutes and needed to quickly review a bunch of media that you only got a few minutes ago off a colleague on a USB stick. You have an audio file (any format) a spreadsheet, a word document a couple of images and a movie all in the same folder... Your Windows using colleague in the meantime is waiting for all of those Apps to load and has a memory issue (not enough to run all of those apps on his laptop). So he has to close each app after he has loaded it to open the next one. He gets 2 - 3 minutes to review and you get the full 5 minutes in Leopard. Quicklook not that useful eh? I use it all the time!"

"I just pulled out a stopwatch. Picture/Fax viewer - 0.4 seconds. Word - 1.1 seconds. Media Player - 3.8 seconds. Excel - 1.3 seconds. Last time i checked that doesnt add to 2 minutes."

I can do that on y Mac but you're missing the point. You still have to navigate the apps and their different interfaces. If you're in a bit rush it can be flustering. Especially if you're under pressure or a client is looking over your shoulder and wants a quick answer or you are on the phone and someone wants the same from you.

I used to do it your way on my Mac before Leopard and it feels less stressful now. You're just being stubborn on this one. You know jolly well it would be useful if Windows had an equivalent. My PC using friends are always impressed with it.

You don't even have to use Quick Look either. If you are in cover flow view in a Finder window you can peruse the stuff with virtually as much control in a smaller (resizable) area at the top of the window.

"You get a firewall with windows too. And I have a windows PC, used it for 2 years with no Anti-Virus (i'd prefer not to have the performance impact) and have not got a virus yet. As long as you dont download dodgy torrents etc, Windows systems are fine."

So how do you know if a torrent is dodgy or not?
I download torrents with impunity. TV progs mainly. Never worry what might be contained in them. So without a virus checker on Windows you either avoid torrents completely or play Russian Roulette with your system.

"Perfect for a road warror? I would think that Wireless Broadband would be nice? Oh well, there goes your single USB port. And a slow 4200RPM iPod drive as a system drive with a measly 80GB? Not going to fit too much on that."

You get either a 120Gb SATA drive or a fast 128Gb SSD. 80Gb? That's old news. And if that's not enough for you you can get a MacBook or a MacBook Pro. And I thought we were talking Windows and OS X. You brought up the MBA first. Breaking your own rules here me thinks!

"I would just appreciate being able to load a decent looking game when I feel like it."

And you can on a Mac. You can get a lot of good games apparently. I don't play games as I use my machine for serious work and web surfing but here is a list: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Mac_OS_X_games. Not sure how up to date it is.

If you can't get what you want on that list then you can always boot into XP with Boot camp and play them on Windows if you are that desperate.

"As for loving microsoft, I dont. I have a PS3, not a 360. I can just appreciate that they have a good OS, much better than Apple fanbois would have you believe."

See, that's what pisses me off. "Apple Fanboys"!!!

We use the Mac because we choose to. Most of us have used Windows or have to use it at our place of work. Many of us know both systems equally well because we have to but 99.9% of us prefer the Mac. And around 50% of New Mac buyers are Windows switchers.

Most Windows sufferers have little or no experience using Macs and still comment negatively against the Mac and OS X. Even though they don't know what they are talking about. I build websites and every day I have to test my sites in IE6 and IE7. I don't use a website to do it as I need to do it right away so I use VMware and XP. So I do use Windows to an extent every day and I have reasonable experience with it from Jobs I have had in the past. I'm so glad I don't need to use that crap all the time.

"What on Windows do you mean? Because these third party apps might contain malware? Good point, finally talking sense. When you getting your first Mac then? :-)"

At least I dont have to misinterpret comments to come up with a 'retort'.

Witty retorts aside. You suggested that Mac users in general won't know how to download software. Most Mac users happily download whatever they like. Many Windows users hold back as they are afraid as to what way the software they download will affect their system. I know several Window users that have their system carefully set up working optimally and will not consider downloading or installing anything else just in case it slows down or buggers up their PC. That is a typical mindset of the average Windows user. Mainly indoctrinated by draconian rules set down by their IT departments at work.

As for the typical Mac user who uses Macs atwork. Well all the graphic design companies I have dealt with over the years are happy to let their employees install any shareware or open source software on their Macs that they like if it will help them get their job done more efficiently and quickly.

"But I log into Linux Boxes at a data centre in London every day using the Terminal app on my Mac and I also occasionally install and configure PHP, MySQL and Apache on various OS X boxes as well and it helps to have a good command shell if you want to perform custom configurations. ./configure, make, make install. It's UNIX. And to a power user like me it's useful. If I had to do the same things on Windows I would have to slum it with a DOS like command prompt Uuggghhh!"

Thats what registry scripts (.reg files) are for. Custom configurations. I know that but if the registry gets corrupt you have a chance that you will have to do a re-install.

"How much did MS pay you to write this FUD anyway IO?"

Nothing. All I can say is that at least I dont have to resort to off-topic attacks to get my point across.

What way did I attack you. You just called me a fanboy!

Anyway. I have much work to do.

I bid you good day and hope that one day you will get the chance to experience computing free from the bonds of Microsoft.

28 November 2008, 12:34 AM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Truckasauras (User):

I don't really see how anyone can ultimately prove that one is "better" than the other. It's like trying to justify why Strawberry ice-cream is better then Chocolate ice-cream. Ultimately it's a matter of preference.

27 November 2008, 9:13 AM (12 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

Quoting Truckasauras:
It's like trying to justify why Strawberry ice-cream is better then Chocolate ice-cream.

Now you've done it, wait for the chocolate fan boy to come out and defend their honour, while branding you a heretic and self appointed forum moderator.


27 November 2008, 9:18 AM (12 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

joey blades (New user):

Your 14th point touches on it, but doesn't capture it fully. Maybe it's just the engineering geek in me and doesn't apply to the mainstream, but...

One of the main reasons I like the Mac OS is that, behind all the glitter and gold, there's unix and all that comes with that. People that care about such things appreciate that you don't have to install cheap and flakey imitators of things like grep, emacs, perl, c, X11, ssh, find, diff, curl, etc., etc. ...

05 December 2008, 5:42 AM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

shrike (User):

I just wanted to say well done to Dan for a well researched and objective article, and while most Windows devotees won't understand it I definitely share your point of view. I have been using a mac for the last 2 years, and after a lifetime of Windows experience I now couldn't bare the thought of running it at home again.

06 December 2008, 11:06 AM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

lawrencemach8er (New user):

My pc OS came clean no trial software, My mac came with ilife 30 day trial, 1 year mobile me. My mac has beachballed and crashed comming out of sleep, anyway i prefer hibernation on my windows laptop it does not use any battery. You need virus protection on a mac i use etrust which is very primitive and count not clean an itunes virus. At a hacking convention they hacked the mac in 5 minuets and it took 2 days to hack vista after they installed 3rd party apps and one had a back door. I boot vista in 5 seconds my mac will take at least 12 seconds to get to log in screen. I love leds my custom computer case it lit with blue leds looks way better than that steal mac pro. You can run OSX on pc but there is no need, you would not want to, and if apple found out they would search and destroy you with lawyers that will cost more than the case. File sharing over a network is easier on my pc i have one shortcut no need to connect to servers or any other rubbish you just drag and drop files.

07 December 2008, 1:05 AM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

UbiquitousGeek (User):

Lie much?

PCs only come clean when you install plain old Windows from scratch. iLife is not a trial. It's free, on every Mac. The difference between the trial of iWork and the trials that come on a PC is that all you have to do is drag iWork to the trash. With PCs, shovelware throws files all over your hard drive.

Crashed coming out of sleep? Horse crap. I never shut down my Mac, I only put it to sleep. Haven't had a single problem. Vista, on the other hand, has crashed on waking up.

Virus protection is primitive because we don't fricking need it. The jackasses at the convention had plenty of time to prepare for this "hack" ahead of time. Not only that, but they weren't using the stock drivers that are used by Apple. I can bust into a Windows PC in less than two minutes. It's stupid simple.

What the hell is the point of LEDs? Somehow that makes a PC better? Anyone can mod a Mac, same as a PC.

OS X will never be licensed for PCs. If there weren't such an interest in running OS X on PCs, OSX86 wouldn't exist. Unfortunately for you're ignorant argument, there are a lot of people who'd love to run OS X on their PCs, more so than there are people wanting to run Windows on their Macs.

File sharing is easier!? Now I know you're a lying sack of crap. With Leopard, I don't even need a shortcut, it just connects to all of my networked machines automatically, without my needing to tell it to. You don't have to connect to servers? Really, genius? How the hell can you access servers without connecting to them? Some sort of PC fanboy magic? Get real. Vista is nowhere near as "drag and drop" as OS X.

It's painfully obvious that you're an idiot. You're either a pathological liar or you've never spent more than ten minutes on a real Mac.

07 December 2008, 11:55 AM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

lawrencemach8er (New user):

Mac's are slower yet more expensive. Macs still need to run virus but still fail to clean itunes virus's you pick up in .mp3 files. I boot vista in under 5 seconds on a Hot day. I book OSX in 12 seconds on a cold day. I get ilife 30 day trial on mac. I get only the drivers and a kick ass media center which is better than iphoto and all the mac crap. CMD still better than terminal, terminal is only good on linux, mac OSX has restricted a lot of features in the terminal. I can install OSX on my pc but linux/xp/vista is the best combo mac OSX is a waste. It is no easier to troubleshoot macs they will suddenly crash and you are like WTF happened, I have only ever once crashed a PC because of the wrong graphic card driver so i used the generic intel graphics and installed the correct driver as the blue screen told me it was the driver that was stuffed.

MACS are not better

07 December 2008, 1:13 AM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

UbiquitousGeek (User):

More lies?

Slower? Rubbish. Macs don't get viruses from MP3 files, that's a Windows thing. Only Windows and it's ignorant users can be fooled into mistaking an executable for an MP3. Vista does not, under any circumstances, boot in five seconds and it certainly doesn't boot faster than a Mac, especially from sleep mode. Again, iLife is not a trial! It's free on every Mac. Plain and simple. It's been that way for years. Media Center is better than iPhoto? iPhoto, for one, isn't for presenting media. It's for collecting, organizing and editing photos, as well as ordering prints, photo books and making slideshows. The terminal is "restricted"? WTF? You've never heard of SUDO!? Easier to troubleshoot!?!?!? ROFL! Never heard of the console? It tells you everything that's happened, in a human readable form, not some coded gibberish like Windows. Saying that you've never had a crash in Windows is like saying that you've never had to breathe. We don't have to wait for a kernel panic before we know what's wrong.



07 December 2008, 12:08 PM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

NetR@nger (Cornerstone member):

Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
Only Windows and it's ignorant users

Ok,first of all its a windows world,deal with it.And WHO are you calling ignorant,you stupid fool?.Do you hold a PHD in astro-physics??,I do.Do u hold a diploma in I.T??,I do.I work on and fly machines that would turn your town into a ash cloud in less then 10 minutes.We have hundreds of computers around here and not a mac in sight,so it would seem that at the pointy end of things,you dont really have any idea at all.So please engage your brain before posting your fanboy mac garbage here,because when the crap hits the fan in this country,your going to be glad that windows has the stick.


10 December 2008, 7:13 AM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

UbiquitousGeek (User):

It's also a George W. Bush world (for the moment), but that doesn't mean we have to like it. For someone who holds a P.H.D., you're sentence structure is terrible. Punctuation missing or in places it doesn't need to be...

Yeah, I always knew a Windows machine would destroy the planet.

After seeing how Windows can leave me sitting at the B.M.V. for five hours, I really don't want a Windows machine to be responsible for national security. I bet Windows "had the stick" on 9/11, too, right?

10 December 2008, 10:59 AM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Truckasauras (User):

Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
I bet Windows "had the stick" on 9/11, too, right?

Mate you're just a tool. Yes, we're all thinking this.

11 December 2008, 1:51 PM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

UbiquitousGeek (User):

I'm sorry, but what was your argument? What's with this "we" crap? Do you have a mouse in your pocket? Did you have something to say about Windows' security?

Yeah, when I hear "security", I think Windows. (That's sarcasm, in case you're a little low on grey matter.)



11 December 2008, 2:33 PM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Truckasauras (User):

Quoting UbiquitousGeek:
I'm sorry, but what was your argument?

There is no argument. It is a statement of fact, you're a tool. Your using of the 9/11 tragedy to support your argument on which is a better OS was stupid, plain and simple.

11 December 2008, 3:49 PM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Bradley Anm (New user):

I love my Mac. I dont want to go back. Its so sexy. And Light. And Little. And Simple

09 December 2008, 11:04 AM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

InformationOverlord (User):

Well im sure a Mac could a saved the Twintowers on 9/11... not

10 December 2008, 3:31 PM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Truckasauras (User):

Here's a well written piece on the Mac vs. MS flame wars:

http://www.smh.com.au/news/digital-life/laptops/articles/whats-so-great-about-macs/2008/12/09/1228584827312.html?page=fullpage#contentSwap1

Well writtten imo.

11 December 2008, 12:06 PM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

germloucks (New user):

I think you missed the bullseye on a lot of your points.

1) Viruses. XP- HUGE problem. Vista? Not really. Reason? Vista default user accounts dont have administrative rights, via the user account control. Very similar in function to Linux. I've had vista for about 1 year now, and have found about 10 viruses total. Most virus infections come from ignorant users INSTALLING viruses from emails, or browsing porn. No more magical "where the hell did that come from" virus infections with Vista. (XP, it happens all the time)

2) Neat and contained settings manager. You mentioned the registry, and hardware manager as things that arent centralized. 99.99% of windows users never mess with that crap. Messing with the registry is a death wish in the first place.

3) Easier to troubleshoot MACs. I disagree. For the expert MAC user perhaps, but MAC OS has nowhere near the same capabilities for OS troubleshooting that Vista does. (I used to train tech support on vista troubleshooting, i AM an expert on this.)

4) Software/Hardware compatability. the Number one reason people dont buy MACs. For the MAC power user this wont be a problem. But can you imagine Grandma Daisy trying to tweak her windows emulator? I think not. Oh it so easy! Not when you just learned how to use a mouse! With PCs being as cheap as they are, we've seen a huge surge in first-time computer purchases. Most see the MAC as intimidating, and cumbersome.

5) Screenshot abilities? Come now, thats a bit overreaching there. What possible function do you absolutely NEED a well made screenshot tool? If you have gone to all the trouble to learn the commands to make a screenshot the way you want, you could have pressed PRNT SCRN, pasted into paint, and cut the portion out you needed.

6) Blinking lights? Come on now. Thats only a factor with laptops, and most laptop models ive seen have 8-10. Including caps/num/scroll locks. I DOUBT that is intimidating to anyone.

7) Boot times. Yes a problem with Vista users with bare-bones systems they bought for 500$ that has 1GB of crapRAM. My system boots to an operational desktop in 30 seconds flat. Its simply a matter of hardware requirements.... NOT a deficiency of Windows Vista.

8) The differences between MAC OS command prompt and the Windows one is a matter of PREFERENCE, nothing more. And tell me how often you use your command prompt? I cant think of a single example of why an average user would ever use their command prompt. I can guarantee most don't even know they have one.

9) Apple uses quality parts. I believe you were discussing Windows VS MAC, not PC manufacturers VS Apple. Microsoft does not manufacture PCs. This goes for your "blinking lights of doom" argument also.


The rest i pretty much agreed with. Although some of your points were embellished a bit. Perhaps out of a bit of fan-boy-ism.


My main gripe with MACs are the lack of software support, combined with the total inability to upgrade your hardware. The 1200$ investment you make is permanent... MACs also don't have a very high resale value. The reason for that is, where do you go for repairs? PC users can take their PCs to any number of local repair shops present in almost every small town. MAC users have to get Apple to fix it.

Some of the main reasons i like Vista, is the vast ability of the operating system to repair itself. Microsoft made a lot of automated tools that fix software incompatability, boot problems, registry problems, and offer data backup/recovery options.



You might label me as a windows fan-boy, thats okay. I just want to make sure to represent the "other side" of this argument.

11 December 2008, 3:12 PM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

nippi (New user):

In my office, we buy dell laptops, and install osx on them.

all the power of a mac, for 2/3rds the price

its the operating system thats good, hardware is just hardware

18 December 2008, 3:50 PM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

nippi (New user):

i agree mac software is better, but hardware is just hardware, and being restricted by mac specs is crap.

in my office we buy pc hardware, and install mac software on it.

simple, cheaper, better

18 December 2008, 3:55 PM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Felicity (New user):

I can't believe Mac ppl are still trying to find stupid reasons to say Mac's are better. They are not - end of story. I converted to PC when Windows came on the market although I did have the old IBM 86 before my Mac. There is no going back to Mac now for me. I have a lot of friends with Macs and they always ask for help - sorry. I just buy good Toshiba's and run Microsoft products and don't have a worry.

26 December 2008, 8:39 AM (11 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

zoots (New user):

I have to admit that I am amazed by the self serving and fatuous posts contained herein. I hear many posters who love the sound of their own keyboards...they seem lonely, frustrated and....angry? Why so aggrevated? Why so petulant? What do you have to prove? I have used Windows, I have used MACs, I am very much happier with MACs.....everything else is dross...Be sure to keep up the good work...I prefer to enjoy the sunshine, a good aperatif and the smooth skin of a woman

03 January 2009, 2:17 PM (10 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

YourWorstNightmare (New user):

That was hilarious. I can give you one reason why Windows is better than Mac.
Steve Jobs, thats all that Mac has he goes and the empire crumbles. Mac is a cult not a corporate outfit. And might I ask where are the bloody games on the Mac. If it can't game it's worthless to loads of people.

09 January 2009, 4:34 AM (10 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

gamebuster (New user):

[/end of writer's flame]
[my flame]
Most of the reasons are just "windows-hater-pronouncements".
The reasons are no facts.

Example 1:
"Rebooting a Windows PC can be such a painful experience that you really procrastinate doing it. Unless you're running on the highest spec hardware, Vista can take minutes to start up.

Mac OS X starts up from a cold boot in about 25 seconds on a current-gen MacBook Pro. As another journalist contributing to the discussion observed, this is not a faked boot speed, where the operating system maker has rushed to get the login window on screen, but delayed loading the rest of the OS. It's a genuine boot-to-usable-desktop time."

Windows Vista boots in no-time here, and YES, i have great hardware. If you have a crappy PC with tons of trash, it can and will take minutes to boot. But that is user-error, no windows vista "error". Mac's have their problems too.

Also,
it's just a fact: there is much, much, much more software available for use on windows than apple mac os. Also, if i want to run windows, i can run it on any PC. If i want to run mac os, i MUST buy an apple (or use hacks), not even mentioning the prices of apple's.

Windows is far from perfect, so is apple mac os.
windows is NOT better than apple's mac OS, but neither is mac OS X better than windows. Both windows and mac OS are UNIQUE in features and users. If you want to do boring money-making things, you'll probly use an apple, since its more "basic". Do you want a PC for the whole family with games etc, you better buy a PC.

Your 15 reasons are just "mac is better than windows and i will think up some reasons to convince you"-reasons.

The only reason that is absolutely true and valid is no.: 1. The sleep mode.

Btw, DO NOT COMPARE hardware with an OS. ALL reasons where you put in user-errors, variable environments and hardware are just useless. You should compare purely the Operating Systems itself.

You can't say: windows is worse than mac os because third-party hardware has blinking lights
that is the WORST reason i've ever read. I can install windows on an apple: no blinking lights.

PC != windows
APPLE MAC BOOK != MAC
SOFTWARE != HARDWARE

conclusion:
14/15 reasons are just rubbish.

You say "Whoah, hold up there, anonymous flamer.", but i think the only flamer here, is you.

example: the end: "On balance, though, Macs just let you get stuff done, whereas Windows computers constantly find ways of annoying you."

tssss

[/end of my flame]

12 January 2009, 12:40 PM (10 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Troels (New user):

I don't feel like this review or what you wanna call it, brings justice to the Windows 7 platform. The sleep mode works as good as on the Mac and boot times has decreased a lot. Quality of parts depends on the brand and model of your computer, but unlike the Mac, you can choose between a whole range of different types, shapes and sizes. The fact that you can upgrade all of your hardware in a desktop computer is a big plus and you don't have to spend two months salary to get a Mac Pro.
I'd still say, to all the Windows hates, they have to try out Windows 7.
If I won a million dollars, I'd go buy a Mac, but if you look at Cost vs. Specifications - the Mac would never be a good choice.
I love the design of the Mac and OS X and I love the user friendly applications included in iLife and the fact that the Mac has some solid software applications you can't find on the Windows platform like; Apple Logic (music production), Final Cut Pro (movie production) and more.
But then again, too expensive for my taste... I'll stick with my rock solid and fast Windows 7 laptop, I bought a year ago for about 700 dollars and it has the specs of a new 1299 dollar Macbook!

19 January 2009, 12:17 PM (10 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

MacsDoHaveViruses (New user):

13. Macs do have viruses.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/12/02/apple_mac_av_advice/

This is nothing new. It is just the first time Apple have finally admitted it. There has been commercially available Mac virus software around for years.

30 January 2009, 5:57 AM (9 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Jack Lim (New user):

I can't see any screw in iMac notebook, It is juz so cool!!
Until, I think, what happen if the iMac is faulty and I have files contain confidential information which I can't afford it to be exposed to anyone?
So well.. nahhh...let's go for other notebook. I juz need to choose it carefully out of so many vendors. Ohya.. I can choose, that's great.



06 February 2009, 2:36 PM (9 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

MacsAreBad (New user):

In my opinion a lot of your argument is based around Mac's being more user-friendly, not stuffing up and the occasional time when they do its easy to find out whats causing it. For people who are useless with computers your argument is very strong and for complete computer dummies i suggest getting a mac. But for people who have half a brain and know what to do your argument is just crap. Get a good anti-virus protection (it isnt that bloody expensive). Ive been using my new custom-made PC for about a year now, i use Windows for the operating system, i have Bullguard AntiVirus protection and i've gotten 1 virus. I simply ran a scan and what do you know it fixed the virus. Also i was having certain graphics issues, grabbed a screw driver, unscrewed the tower took out the graphics card and had a look at it .. found out i had overused it and then bam replaced it and my graphics are working fine

MACS SUCK

13 April 2009, 8:30 PM (7 months ago)report abuse