Logitech, Creative, NVIDIA driver disgrace

Send to a friend Print

Help more people find out about this story

Del.icio.us
StumbleUpon

James Bannan01 February 2007, 1:22 AM

Thinking of upgrading to Vista? Be prepared for the rude shock that a triumverate of the most common hardware manufacturersstilldon't have final-release Vista drivers available.


OK, time to rant for a bit. Vista is out and I’d like to be able to upgrade my main home computer. I’ve got the software – all I need to do is throw in the DVD and I’m away.

Why do I want to upgrade? Well, I’d like to be able to put forward loads of cogent arguments as to why Vista is such an incredible operating system for home users, but I’d need to ingest a few mind-bending substances before I could.

To be honest, other than some nice extra applications and a new look, I can’t think of a single, substantial reason for any home user to spend the bucks and move away from Windows XP.

I’m only considering it myself because I’d be letting myself down as an IT journo and desktop administrator not to.
And yet, I can’t upgrade. Why not? Well, I have this embarrassing problem of owning a Creative Audigy 2 ZS soundcard and a Logitech MX3000 keyboard/mouse combo.

They’re great products and I love using them, but apparently both vendors approach new operating systems with the same amount of trepidation as you’d approach a cobra.

The final, shipping version of Vista has been out for two months now to business and hardware vendors and now every version of Vista is commercially available.

And yet, Creative is still only offering beta drivers. Still, that’s better than Logitech, who aren’t offering ANY Vista solution for current devices using SetPoint at all. Actually, that’s not exactly true – there is version 3.3 of SetPoint available, which supports a couple of the very latest Logitech keyboard/mouse combos, but nothing for other, reasonably recent devices. Guess there’s little benefit to being a loyal Logitech customer.

Considering the sheer length of time manufacturers have had to get their drivers ready for Vista, it’s nothing short of disgraceful to find two apparent industry leaders caught in such a position – incapable of offering their customers a smooth transition to a new operating system.

Actually, make that three industry leaders – NVIDIA won’t have their final-release Vista drivers out for about another month. AMD had theirs out the same day Vista was released. Intel had the vast majority of their final release drivers out when Vista RTM was released. Pay attention the rest of you – it CAN be done! You’re just waaaaaay behind!

I’ve spent a lot of money on my system and I’m certainly not going to spend more on it just because a couple of manufacturers haven’t got their act together. Guess that Vista upgrade is just going to have to wait -- either that, or I upgrade my hardware to something compatible and vow never to buy Logitech, Creative or NVIDIA ever again!

Related stories

 
 

Post your comment



Comments

 RSS feed Email alert

James:

I can completely agree with this article, I have an HP Scanjet 3500c and a DeskJet 6122 that either don’t work at all - or partially do with Vista. I actually give credit to Microsoft that all my "Internal" Pc components (Motherboard, Video and Sound) were updated with the right updates that Microsoft did exceptionally well with. However Hewlett Packard has been incredibly slack, and particularly when I see ad's for HP advertising their new machines equipped with Vista and all the drivers that needed to be created to support all their "New" hardware. They couldn’t even get their act together when Vista's been in the making for 6 years. A disgraceful effort, and also to mention that I’m a loyal Hp customer, and to get a response email that didn’t really give me any answers except a kick up the rear end and a URL to a "Get Ready for Vista" page. That’s an insult of my intelligence!

Cheers



29 February 2008, 8:29 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Scott:

You can add "Asus" to the list of disgraceful vendors. Can't even connect to the Internet using a basic WL-138g WiFi card. I need to buy WL-138g Version 2 card for another 40 bucks. It worked perfectly under XP.

29 February 2008, 8:37 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

t4ct1c47:

You can obtain Vista wireless drivers from the manufacturer of the wireless to digital converter chip used by many manufacturers such as Asus, Belkin, LynkSys and NetGear.

www.ralinktech.com

29 February 2008, 8:37 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Spence:

And guess what, 200+ days later they STILL havn't addressed the issue with the V1 WL-138g xD

They suck, and i told them that on their deadly slow forum!

29 February 2008, 8:37 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

barrygil:

James,
I am not a Microsoft user, having been on the old Linux since 1999 - mostly on Mandrake/Mandriva now 2006-version, but Mandrake recommended a HP-6110 OfficeJet back when it was new, and Linux-drivers were everywhere for functions that only existed in Microsoft-drivers, but not for Mac at the time.
Similarly, I recently felt a need to buy a good HP-LightScribe (laser disc-labeling) DVD-burner, and though the better-specificationed BenQ-DW1655 was not HP, the HP/LaCie/LightScribe Linux-application performed magnificently. It would seem that Linux has been getting applications and drivers simultaneously with the release of current generation hardware at the time of release. HP redirected me to the LaCie page for the download, even though I had purchased a BenQ-burner! Change of policy, perhaps?

29 February 2008, 8:37 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Easy Speed:

Funny there is a driver for my old HP990cxi but not for my new Epson photo R230 or my old Canon scanner 5000F.

The Windows Vista Upgrade Advisor stated all should be well with my nVidia 7600GS but I not so sure now with all the bad reports about nVidia drivers.

A special thanks to all the new Vista testers who have paid Micro$oft for the privilege and I hope that by the time I upgrade when service pack 2 is out that you have got it right for me.

29 February 2008, 8:37 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

raindog:

Why should there be an expectation that every vendor of every peripheral has an obligation to instantly support Microsoft's latest indulgence?
Each of these companies has their own suite of priorities and obligations to decide when and for what OS's they'll do development. It's their business model and the need for any vendor to be ready for a Vista release faces the same set of parameters, as does the decision to, or not to, develop a driver set for OS2, Beos or Throbbing Porcupine linux, particularly when you are talking legacy hardware support.
As of Feb 1 I'd hazzard a guess that the total number of operating Vista installs in real world homes and offices would be less than almost any other operating system, yes I am sure that situation will rapidly change and with it will likely come better driver support.
I am sure Microsoft's general contempt and attempts to keep a stranglehold on the industry apply to independant component vendors in the same way they apply to the end user. How much real support, finance and incentive has Microsoft provided to these vendors to ready drivers for launch day 1?
Curiously James you state you see no real need for a home user to upgrade to Vista and with that I can only concur, it would however be arrogant to assume that applied to every user and every home situation.
You state the need to stay up to date as an IT journo and that I can well understand. But once the release fanfare is over and the Ferrari Notebooks and free copies are all loaded and configured I do hope that the journos bloggers etc manage to stay in touch with the actual type and diveristy of machines, hardware and software that will be actually be doing the slog in all those offices and homes. They wont all be shiny new copies of Vista, no sir-ee.
Early adopters, go for it, you save the rest of us a fortune in cash, time and energy and bring the mature driver sets and discounted pricing closer to reality, but please dont bitch to us about the pitfalls. Fearing angels have little time for thse who jump in first.



29 February 2008, 8:29 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Hugh:

But it definitely colours perceptions. Right now it just looks like nvidia, creative and logitech are just lazy. For anyone burned by their slackarse methods when they tried to upgrade to Vista, you can just about count on them going to a competitor next time they make a purchase.

Its not just Microsoft that can lose customers because someone else is doing it better.

29 February 2008, 8:37 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

James Bannan:

Raindog - I think you're making more than a few sweeping statements here. No, I don't think there's an obligation for every peripheral vendor to have Vista drivers out so quickly, but bear in mind that the vendors we are criticising here are mainstream industry leaders who live and die by how well their products interact with popular operating systems.

Yes you are correct that the world won't be flooded with Vista machines just yet, but that's just a convenient fact for those vendors who haven't got their act together.

The whole point of the article was to highlight that vendors have had a huge amount of time to get the products working on Vista - some have done a great job and some have dropped the ball in a big way. If they were relying on a slow take-up of Vista to minimise the inconvenience, then I believe that's truly pathetic.

And in any case, it's a double-edged sword. They are actually now slowing down the rate of transition to Vista through their lack of hardware support.



29 February 2008, 8:37 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

raindog:

Point taken that your article was aimed at two or thre major vendors, but I cannot agree with all of the statements made. Vista may have had a 5 to 6 year gestation period but for much of that it was a moving target and in reality vendors have had months not years to ready themselves for it. The fact these vendors are offering limited Vista compatibility with only their very latest product releases bares this out.
Looking at things from a vendors point of view slowing the frenzy of uptake to a new OS may not be against their interests at all, quite the opposite. It hopefully will see a reduction in hastily released buggy drivers where the paying customer becomes the de facto beta tester.
How vendors play the game of development cost versus customer perceptions will decide who will gain and who will lose out.
An upgrade path to Vista will make much of the hardware and software we currently, and quite effectively use, redundant. So sourcing new hardware drivers may not factor much in the equation when for many migration to Vista will equate to an entire new system. I thing we may see a lot more of a most of the people, most of the time approach taken by vendors in what is a very low margin game. The rate of Vista uptake may not be as rapid as its predecessors. Only time will tell.

29 February 2008, 8:37 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Potoroo:

Am I the only one feeling a sense of deja vu?

"But missing drivers has left many Windows 2000 customers with software and hardware incompatibility problems"

http://archives.cnn.com/2000/TECH/computing/09/15/windows.me.drivers.idg/index.html

"Lack of drivers is going to slow down adoption unless Microsoft prods these vendors into action."

http://www.samspublishing.com/articles/article.asp?p=24038&rl=1

The latter article was written in Nov 2001 about XP (a month after its launch). And writers of drivers for XP didn't even have to contend with a completely different driver and security model to W2000, unlike writers of drivers for Vista who had to start everything from scratch.

Of course it's annoying when Microsoft releases a new OS and drivers are missing but it's par for the course. What I don't understand is why APC isn't focussing on the really evil bits of Vista like DRM and the polling of tilt bits. Unlike this temporary glitch they actually matter in the long run and are worth worrying about.

29 February 2008, 8:29 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Simon:

I recently purchased a NETGEAR storage central SC101. It seems the best NETGEAR can do is advise owners that Vista drivers with be made available "in the first half of 2007" and they do not even appear to be developing the new driver, I am running a dedicated box to access the network drive now ..... again!

29 February 2008, 8:29 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

tin:

It sucks big time when APIs change and your hardware doesn't get updated drivers...

Not sure if Vista will run on my desktop, but if it doesn't, I don't care. Probably won't even try for some time.

29 February 2008, 8:29 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

rhY:

You're pissed off for all the wrong reasons. There are a myriad of people who would happily make drivers FOR these companies. They just need to release the source. The problem is an extension of DRM, but it's EVEN WORSE. You bought some hard ware, and YOU CAN'T USE IT, because they won't give you the information to use it. If there was a REAL free market, and not a handful of cooperative monopolies (cooperative with each other, not with us, the consumers), then another video card maker would have a decent product out and also have NO EULA, and OPEN SOURCE DRIVERS so that anybody who PAID FOR THEIR HARDWARE could use it. The fact that there hasn't been a media shit storm over this already just shows you that there is no free media. Not in Australia, not in the US, and not anywhere. We are all corporate slaves who have no choice but to work and purchase from a handful of corrupt monopolies that would gladly rip out our individual organs if it helped them make a buck, which in the case of pharmaceutical companies and the Chinese military, is actually fucking happening. You're right to bitch. You've got every right in the world. Now that you have the power to bitch (as part of the media), use it for good, and make sure that EVERYONE should know that selling hardware without FULLY RELEASED SPECS AND DRIVER INFO is a crime. An anti-competitive, corrupt crime that should ensure that any real democracy did not allow their business within their borders. I doubt you'll say that though. Mainly because you want to keep your job, and journalistic integrity doesn't exist anymore. Which is really, really, really sad. So yeah, enjoy Windows, and Logitech, and Creative, and Nvidia. I mean it's not like they're the ones selling organ anti-rejection drugs to the Chinese military so they can harvest body parts from falun gong members who shouldn't be in jail anyway. I'm sure the international banks that own those corporations aren't the same ones that also own Nvidia, Creative, and The US and Australian governments as well. Give 'em all your money, and be happy to do it!  I hope computers DO supersede our intelligence and replace our immoral, evil, and cowardly pathetic lives.

29 February 2008, 8:29 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

McBanjo:

Well look on the bright side, at least the world isn't going to end.

Opening drivers to the public would suck and there is a big reason for not doing it. Imagine finally installing your brand new $1000 graphics card and then it failing because of some fake driver you found on the net which you thought would work didn't. I can't imagine the extra security risks and holes that could be put into these things aswell.

I agree profoundly that the hardware manufacturers have no excuse for taking this long, but I would rather put up with a one or two month wait for a stable driver release from the manufacturer than a buggy, crappy one from some random person on the net. The driver writers know their hardware better than anyone else can.

And when you are refering to 'our pathetic lives' I think you are trying to express your own pathetic life. Don't bring me into this.

29 February 2008, 8:37 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Aubrey:

McBanjo, you seem to have confused Open Source with something else. Many hardware manufacturers - Intel included - open source their software and contribute to its maintenance. I personally think they have an obligation to do so. Others may "improve" on their coding and even exploit aspects of the hardware not enabled by the maker's drivers. That doesn't make the OS driver either "fake" or flakey and users have the choice of the manufacturers driver or the one/s built by other people.

But the fact that these "major" hardware vendors have failed to yet deliver drivers for the "latest and greatest" operating system does not auger well for those who may rely on their support for legacy devices or, heaven forbid, non-Microsoft Operating Systems.

29 February 2008, 8:37 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Chico:

You have interesting - and possibly valid - points, rhY, but your presentation, if I can be so bold, simply causes your audience to mistake your passion for you being a raving lunatic (though I'm sure you most likely are not).

Nothing hurts any social justice movement more than making its proponents look like, well, like how you appear. As for rebuttal, I find myself at a loss; I got lost somewhere between the Chinese fear-mongering and DRM. That and us ending our lives so that we can be more moral? I mean, where are you going on this?

I think the best question of all is: how is it that the movement of this generation is 'open source software' and 'free music'?

Maybe I'm just too old to understand...

29 February 2008, 8:37 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Aubrey:

that Richard Stallman reads APC!

Welcome Richard!

Apart from the political rant, he's right about these companies and their closed source drivers. Of course Linux users have to deal with this every day, not just when a new version of their fave OS is launched (without the hoopla, I might add).

Maybe all the disappointed wannabe Vista users should download Sabayon Linux or Ubuntu and try them out until the capitalists get their act together and rip everyone off in a coordinated way.

29 February 2008, 8:37 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Lachek:

Ah, but that's not true - Linux users deal with the opposite problem, NEW hardware having problems (for a while, until someone figures out how they work or the manufacturer gets their act together) in existing systems.

This problem is the opposite, OLD hardware having problems with a new OS release. I can't imagine a situation where a new version of Ubuntu, or Mandriva, or SuSE, or Slackware, or what have you, would not install and work just fine on a system currently running an older version. Linux has an incredible track record for backwards compatbility, both for hardware and software (a friend of mine is still running a window manager that was abandoned and deprecated many years ago on a brand new install of Slackware with the latest kernel, bells and whistles).

Despite this fact, people seem prepared to cut Microsoft an inordinate amount of slack because they need to "drop their legacy support" and "get with the times". They need to get with the times, alright - the times that demand a constant flow of new features and functionality, without any sacrifice in security or performance, and where everything I didn't upgrade continues to function like it did yesterday. All the "features" in Vista have been available in various forms for various Linuces for 6 months to a year, and we're able to run them on 5 year old hardware. We've moved on. Are they coming?

29 February 2008, 8:37 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Phill:

nVidia has just released a new driver for their 6, 7 and 8800 series of cards and what a piece of cr@p these have turned out to be. No SLI for the 6 and 7 series but limited functionality for the 8800's. (I own 2x7900GT's btw) After approximately half an hour of dicking around with black screens and code 43 errors I decided to go back to 100.54, at least these work to some extent. nVidia should be embarrassed over this mess. They had a good year to get these drivers right for release but have failed miserably. How can it be that my sons PC with dual ATI X1650's works wonderfully well in Vista??

29 February 2008, 8:29 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Rich Richmond:

I agree. I just installed the latest drivers from nVidia for the 8800 series cards. There is no way to adjust anything. Every time my computer starts up it says it can't find the graphics driver although it is evidently there. On the plus side for nVidia, my games run superbly!

29 February 2008, 8:37 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

midnightrider:

OK. Creative's driver suck even when they "work" with XP, so what do you expect.

On Logitech, I am sure the basic mouse and keyboard functions will work with the standard Vista drivers for HID devices. What you might not get is the extendded keyboard/mouse controls. It's not like your keyboard and mouse won't work, so perhaps that is the reason the Logitech has not rushed out Vista drivers.

Further, the testing required to roll out new drivers is extensive and time consuming. Microsoft is not exactly forth coming on details of their operating system before launch, even with their "partners." Once you have new drivers and software, you have to do regresion testing with all the supported hardware, software, and OS to make sure you didn't break anything witht he updates. It's complicated and not a trivial task if you want to release something quality.

So get your panties out of a wad and be a little patient. You don't want these companies rolling out drivers that have not been thoroughly tested.

29 February 2008, 8:29 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

ATI_Guy-TeamATI:

The question is really about Microsoft. It's Microsoft that sets up the WHQL standard and it's their test you have to pass to get the signature.

So the question is why won't nVidiot hardware pass but AMD hardware does? And this coming hot on the heals of nVidiot talking all that trash about their DX10 card. Pfffft!

29 February 2008, 8:37 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Doug Cox:

Having just had a look for Vista drivers for my system, this is the result.

No drivers for my Lexmark E220 printer.
No drivers for my Epson 830U printer
No drivers for my Wacom Artpad II.
No drivers for my TrackIR Pro 3.
No drivers for my Audigy Value.
No drivers for my NForce 4 motherboard.
No drivers for my Logitech joystick.
No drivers for my Canon Lide 80 scanner.
No drivers for my Dvico Fusion HDTV card.
No 64-bit software for my Logitech G5.
Only beta drivers for the nVidia 8800.

Few items in the list above even have 64-bit XP drivers available. Given that 64-bit Vista is required for full HD-DVD playback, I'll be sticking with XP and linux and buying a PS3.


29 February 2008, 8:29 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Nicholas:

There are drivers for the dvico fusion hdtv card. the latest 3.5 something works with vista. You have to install it then when you have the menu that it brings up when installing you browse cd and copy the extracted drivers else wheree on hard disk and tell update driver to look there. (I have it working on mine.)

29 February 2008, 8:37 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

T:

Hey everyone bleating about the lack of Vista Drivers, the Journos included - that means APC staff.

I've been around pcs long enough to know that NO new operating system implementation is seamless.

You take the risk with a newbie, accept the shortcomings.

It was the same with win 95, 98, 2000, Xp ... need I elaborate .. or are the young gun journos and bloggers here too young to remember?

Live with your existing distro till all, well, most, of the flak has fallen to the ground.

29 February 2008, 8:29 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Phill:

Yes it was the same with 95,98 and XP. But why do we as consumers have to put up with that? Don't you think that these large multinationals would have learnt from the past? I really feel for the mums and dads that go out and buy a new component for their PC but have no idea on where to go or what to do to get it running at a reasonable level.

What really gives me the shits tho is the total lack of client (customer) service from these companies. Hopefully people will now vote with their wallets.


29 February 2008, 8:37 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Muzik-wally:

i agree with you 100% there .. these young bloggers who have to go and download vista from the torrent sites so they can go to school and tell all their friends "i got vista" ... what they forget is they are trying to run a 2007 system with 2002 hardware ... wake up peeps they invented the wheel now... if you want to run 2007 computer systems then make sure your hardware is also up to it ... i have a keyboard by logitech which requires i-touch to run it and there is no way on gods little planet i am going to get a driver ... do i whine and b*tch on about it? .... no ... it's 3 years old which in computer terms is accent i cant complain who wants to support three year old equipment when newer and better equipment is coming out every day... get with the program young bloggers and quit trying to look good at school saying you got vista ...!!!!!!

29 February 2008, 8:37 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

azs:

Well luckily I diddn't have to pay for my version of vista. (I have access via MSDN).

All I can say is ultimate ho-hum. Aside from all the devices that wont work I could not see any compelling reason to move from WinXp.

I could not see anything of value that couldn't be done with XP.

So I suppose I'm on the fence with Vista and couldn't recommend an upgrade to anyone.


29 February 2008, 8:29 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Malfunctions:

Here here!

i have a similar setup here, Logitech mx3000/mx1000 combo, creative Audigy 2 and Nvidia 7600gt - All brands that up until now I've been so happy to use for years and brands that i felt where the leaders in their respective areas.

I can not believe how much all three companies have @#$@ up. Wasn't there a beta for over a year? hasn't the release date been known for ... ages? Did they all go on holiday for a year or something?

I've never had to join so many forums in my life! To make the lack of preparedness worse, pretty much all support channels are quiet from the respective company sides - no ones got answers.

The whole thing has been launched so poorly I don't know who to blame, M$ or the peripheral/component companies...I don't care really i just want it fixed he he.

As much as i vehemently dislike Apple and their communist approach to technology deployment their model really stands when the partners that are openly invited to Microsoft's table fail to hold up their ends of the bargain.

i know early adopting/first gen always has its 'price', and I'm almost always one to grin and bear it because the gadget or new toys worth it... but when you can't do basic things parts of your job like - ctrl+alt+shit+s to save a file in web format in Photoshop because the drivers are so buggy it launches the keyboard security wizard every time you press the left ctrl + shift together you really start to loose your ability to think sanely... Go crazy? don't mind if i do!

I could go on and on about the other bugs, lack of drivers, missing functions and how stupid i was to attempt to upgrade my mobo bios from vista lol..but i think i probably said enough 3 paragraphs ago.

There's always tomorrow's, another day to check for new drivers right?...Could have been worse - i could have installed the 64bit version!

29 February 2008, 8:29 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Not signed in
anonymous user Anonymous user


Tags