Wanna design your own netbook?

Alex Kidman19 February 2009, 7:00 AM

Kogan plans for Netbook include community consultation.


Despite the well publicised setbacks with the Kogan Agora, it seems you can't keep an Aussie tech battler -- well, we're sure that's how they'd like to be described -- down. As previously reported at APCMag.com, Melbourne-based Kogan Technologies is in the planning stages for its entry into the netbook field.

But instead of taking the by-now virtually standard netbook recipe (take one Atom processor, apply 1GB of RAM and XP home, shake well until slightly undercooked), they're taking the unusual step of checking to see what potential consumers might want in a netbook.

In a blog posting on the Kogan Web site, company founder Ruslan Kogan is inviting community comment on what form the Kogan-branded netbook should take. Some specifications, it would seem, are set in stone -- Kogan notes that "the 10.1" screen size is the sweet spot between screen real estate and portability" and that "an Atom processor looks to be the best balance of computing power and energy consumption", although he tellingly doesn't reveal which Atom processor; it could be the rather standard N270 that most systems use, or the Z530 that Sony's sleek-but-expensive Vaio P uses. Except, of course, that Sony would prefer people not to call the Vaio P a netbook.

What is up for grabs then? Well, for starters Kogan's curious to know whether 1GB of RAM is enough, or whether consumers would rather pay more for a 2GB system. He also wants to know if consumers would prefer Linux (and which flavour) or Windows XP. Based on APC's understanding of Microsoft's licensing terms for XP on netbooks, if he sticks 2GB RAM into a netbook, XP would be out of the question, although that could make for a capable enough Vista or Windows 7 system. The question of pre-loaded software also comes up, with Kogan name checking OpenOffice, Firefox, VLC, GIMP and Messenging software as critical, as well as the always interesting issue of netbook colour. Black would seem to be the obvious choice.

Naturally, given Kogan's general mantra of buying cheaply from what are claimed to be the same suppliers and manufacturers that the "name brand" models, they may well be constrained by either what they can get or the price that they can sell it for, so all this consultation may come to naught. If you want to have your two cents worth, comments can be added at the Kogan blog.

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Hemma (User):

Seems like Kogan is just being lazy to me. Rather than doing R&D like everyone else, they just want to setup a forum for any person to do their designs.
Ruslan, if I want something manufactured to my liking, I'll go to China myself, thankyouverymuch.

19 February 2009, 11:27 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

plutonium210 (Advanced member):

Strikes me as a fly-by-nighter company.
Saw his interview on Channel 9 the other night and could swear he was selling used cars !

And as for keeping the price down, he won't have any choice other than having Linux pre-installed. But I'm sure the Linux Fanboys will be posting this recommendation on his blog by the thousands.

19 February 2009, 11:27 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Your Average Joe (Cornerstone member):

Quoting plutonium210:
Strikes me as a fly-by-nighter company.

Found the guy very 'shifty' and quite annoying !
And as for quality ? Did anyone else notice the 'Kogan" badge on his plasma tv was stuck on crooked ?

I Think Mr Kogan is having illusions of grandeur. He wants to produce and market a product that is saturated on the market this late in the game for about 20% less ? ....... Good luck !

I'll take Gerry Harvey's advice on this report ..........
" Spend a little extra and get a reliable name brand " .... The least you'll save is a hundred phone calls later to the tech/support/refund department.

........... OK ! Rant over !




19 February 2009, 11:35 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Tin (Regular user):

Quoting Your Average Joe:
Spend a little extra and get a reliable name brand



Which is better? One product that lasts 4 years, or 4 products that last 1 year?
Considering the rate technology is improving, I know which I'd prefer...
And a major vendor of brand name rubbish is hardly impartial on what brands to buy...

19 February 2009, 11:48 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Me In Oz (Cornerstone member):

Quoting Tin:
Which is better? One product that lasts 4 years, or 4 products that last 1 year?

Not too sure about your argument here Tin !
Lets see ...
1 x Panasonic plasma for $2000 or 4 x Kogans for $4800 over 4 years ..... Hmmmm , this is a tricky one !



19 February 2009, 11:55 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

Quoting Me In Oz:
Not too sure about your argument here Tin ! Lets see [rediculous and fabricated comparison here]..... Hmmmm , this is a tricky one !



Not wanting to comment one way or the other on Kogan Quality here, but I would like to offer you the opportunity to clarify your particular price comparisons. Come on squire state your claim. With some factual confirmation this time, if you please. Like you said won't be tricky at all.




19 February 2009, 12:44 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Me In Oz (Cornerstone member):

Quoting Raindog:
Come on squire state your claim. With some factual confirmation this time, if you please

I have yet to see any of your comments substantiated Raindog.
But to amuse you, here goes ... As you obviously did not see the report on Channel 9 you will have to contact them to confirm.

Kogan suggested that his TV's were 30% - 40% lower than the name brands.
I know the 106 cm Panasonic sells for about $2000 ... so 40% of $2000 is $800, which makes his TV's $1200.

I hope this has clarified things for you !
I have no further concrete proof other than to suggest you get a copy of the report from channel 9.

Now how about reciprocating and providing some substantiation of the comments you make !



19 February 2009, 1:16 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

As you obviously did not see the report on Channel 9 you will have to contact them to confirm.



Again assumption on your behalf, but as it happen for this time at least your assumption is correct. I seldom watch 7:00pm advermertial journalism.





Quoting Me In Oz:
I know the 106 cm Panasonic sells for about $2000 ... so 40% of $2000 is $800, which makes his TV's $1200. I hope this has clarified things for you !



Well not really, do you know that that same television will cost $2000 for each of the next four years? That would unlikely be the case so already your suggested figure becomes rubbery, given that likely both Kogan and Panasonic pricing is likely to vary markedly.



And your simplistic comparison fails to take into account the value of having the latest and assumed greatest model each year. New features, better performance etc. A basic comparison of today's numbers goes no way towards refuting Tin's suggestion.



19 February 2009, 2:27 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Me In Oz (Cornerstone member):

Quoting Raindog:
do you know that that same television will cost $2000 for each of the next four years

I think you have misread Tin's post.

"Which is better? One product that lasts 4 years, or 4 products that last 1 year?" - Tin

I'm saying that I would prefer to spend $2000 for a Panasonic to last 4 years rather than the 4 x $1200 for 4 x Kogans (1 x each year) .... That was Tin's argument

"A basic comparison of today's numbers goes no way towards refuting Tin's suggestion." - Raindog

Well I can't compare numbers from the future ......... Can I ?


19 February 2009, 2:40 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

Quoting Me In Oz:
That was Tin's argument



No that was your assuming Tin's argument was restricted solely to financial comparison.





Quoting Me In Oz:
Well I can't compare numbers from the future ......... Can I ?



Wasn't that a mooted feature for Windows 7 :>




19 February 2009, 2:56 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Me In Oz (Cornerstone member):

Quoting Raindog:
Wasn't that a mooted feature for Windows 7

It's not in the beta ! Hopefully it will be in the RTM :)




19 February 2009, 2:58 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Tin (Regular user):

Raindog is correct... It was not restricted to financial comparisons. Newer cheap products will far outperform the older "better" brand.

Even on financial grounds, if credit is required, the final outcome could be that the 4 cheap ones over 4 years is cheaper than the 1 expensive one.

19 February 2009, 3:57 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Me In Oz (Cornerstone member):

Quoting Tin:
if credit is required, the final outcome could be that the 4 cheap ones over 4 years is cheaper than the 1 expensive one.

Credit ? ...... You're starting to clutch at straws here Tin !




19 February 2009, 5:14 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

Quoting Me In Oz:
Credit ? ...... You're starting to clutch at straws here Tin !



Clutching? hardly! The credit thing is right there on the money, and I'd hate to think just how many of the nations stock of $1K+ plasmas are being paid off on the never never.



If people can afford the snob value of a brand name that's fine. And you have to remember that purchase price while giving a fair indication of value is not a universal indicator. As I'm sure any of the owners of play nothing region locked DVDs will attribute.



That $2K plasma on the plastic will cost over $9K for the good majority still owing the lot when Mr Harveys interest free has expired.



Sony was a bit player in the marketplace one offering medium grade transistor radios, many of the other small players of its ilk have long since vanished as have many of the big name established brands.



Be critical of the quality by all means but don't dismiss small players like Kogan out of hand, because every so often some of then become very big players. And odds on there are plenty of bargains to be had along the way.

19 February 2009, 8:58 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Your Average Joe (Cornerstone member):

Quoting Tin:
I know which I'd prefer...

It's not just monetary value here, it's also peace of mind.
10 months after your purchase and the TV goes 'bung' !!!
I know that I'd rather deal with Sony's warranty/service than Kogan's ! ............ If he still around, that is !




19 February 2009, 12:03 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Tin (Regular user):

I've dealt with Sony's warranty services... Took months of stuffing around for them to listen to the repairer who told them repeatedly it was a specific part... 3 months and a whole replacement device, and it finally worked for me.

19 February 2009, 3:59 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Me In Oz (Cornerstone member):

Quoting plutonium210:
and could swear he was selling used cars !

In think his words were "we even sell our tv's on ebay for $1.00" ............ Not much more needs to be said really !




19 February 2009, 11:44 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

Quoting Me In Oz:
Not much more needs to be said really !



I'd have to agree with you on this, neither the "too good to be true price" or the distribution channel are screaming quality. Then again quality isn't always the motivation.


19 February 2009, 3:00 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Tin (Regular user):

Quoting plutonium210:
But I'm sure the Linux Fanboys will be posting this recommendation on his blog by the thousands.





Fanboys, or customers just pissed off they can't get a Linux or No-OS netbook in Australia? Either way, there already are hundreds of requests for Ubuntu over there, and few for Windows...

19 February 2009, 12:00 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Your Average Joe (Cornerstone member):

Quoting Tin:
there already are hundreds of requests for Ubuntu over there, and few for Windows...

Yep ! Looks like Linux world domination has started ;-)




19 February 2009, 12:05 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

Quoting Your Average Joe:
Looks like Linux world domination has started



Sounds more like a gob full of fan boy bigotry. Ever considered the rest of the planet may not want, need or desire an over priced vista driven solar flare games-master pro.




19 February 2009, 12:25 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Truckasauras (User):

Quoting Your Average Joe:
Yep ! Looks like Linux world domination has started ;-)

Oh yeah. This is even more proof:
http://www.itnews.com.au/News/96636,brazil-carries-out-world%E2%80%99s-largest-desktop-virtualisation-project.aspx

19 February 2009, 4:41 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

Quoting plutonium210:
And as for keeping the price down, he won't have any choice other than having Linux pre-installed.



So what does that tell you?





Quoting plutonium210:
But I'm sure the Linux Fanboys will be posting this recommendation on his blog by the thousands.



And what do you suggest? Calls for inclusion of OS-X? At least those requesting Linux had thought things through before making comment.







19 February 2009, 12:33 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

CBR1100XX (Advanced member):

More pie-in-the-sky !
Aren't we all still waiting for his phones ?

19 February 2009, 12:08 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

Quoting CBR1100XX:
Aren't we all still waiting for his phones ?



Fair comment. While Kogan products are out there, the phone debacles suggest this is really conjecture until an actual Net-book becomes available.




19 February 2009, 12:54 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Tin (Regular user):

Yes, although they are being flogged off on ebay de-badged if you really want one.
They do exist.

19 February 2009, 4:00 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Me In Oz (Cornerstone member):

Quoting Tin:
they are being flogged off on ebay de-badged if you really want one.

No thanks !
This company reeks of bad business !




19 February 2009, 5:38 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

plutonium210 (Advanced member):

Quoting Me In Oz:
This company reeks of bad business !

If it looks like crap and smells like crap ................



19 February 2009, 5:50 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

Quoting plutonium210:
If it looks like crap and smells like crap ................



Then you should seriously consider a clean pair of trousers. :>




19 February 2009, 6:08 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

plutonium210 (Advanced member):

Quoting CBR1100XX:
Aren't we all still waiting for his phones ?

Nope ! My iPhone is going great guns now that I have removed certain restrictions ;-)




19 February 2009, 5:57 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Hemma (User):

I'd say that a lot of people are still waiting for a revision of the Agora because its "Designed" by an Australian. It's good to be patriotic... but the quality from the photos of the previous version leaves me thinking that not only Kogan has cut out the middle man, but also cutting out the QA department.

19 February 2009, 6:49 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

funnybluehat (New user):

I suggest that if you are planning to run Vista on your machine, you should go with three gigs of RAM. Learning from other companies who made the transition to Vista, two gigs of ram as opposed to 3 gigs of ram dramatically decreased overall performance. One thing that ive personally always wanted to see in a netbook, however, would be a touchscreen substituting a dedicated keyboard and mouse. If you were to do this, it would be a groundbreaking design that would set you apart from all of the competition. This would adversely affect price, but it would be well worth it publicity- wise. The question of what software to use to control this complex solution would cause CPU usage to be largely be dedicated to dual screen. In addition, battery life would be drastically decreased but it would at least be an interesting idea to research.

03 June 2009, 10:53 AM (9 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

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