w7-wordpadq
Word up: in Windows 7 WordPad sports Office 2007influences such as the context-sensitive ribbon toolbar and, tucked down the bottom right corner, a zoom slider

Windows 7: gets the ribbon, cloud replaces email

David Flynn24 September 2008, 4:35 PM

Leaked screenshots show Windows 7 looks more like ‘Vista revisited’ and while some apps get an Office 2007-style ribbon, others are ditched altogether!


As Windows 7 heads towards its first beta release, leaked copies of the current M3 (Milestone 3) build 6780 edition of Microsoft successor to Vista are showing an OS which takes two steps forward and one step back.

One small step forward is the appearance of new apps such as Sticky Notes for desktop plus a slimmed-down Media Player designed for fast load time when all you want to do is listen to music or watch a video –which is, let’s face it, 90% of the time. If you want to rip content, manage your media library or access online content then the full-blown Windows Media Player (which will, in Windows 7, be updated to version 12) remains waiting in the wings.

Then there are minor cosmetic tweaks. The Documents master folder becomes the Library, which contains folders for Documents, Pictures, Music, Movies and Downloads. The Calculator gains Programming and Statistics modes, along with unit conversions (the latter has likely been ported across from Microsoft’s own Calculator Plus freebie).

Most noticeable is the expected arrival of the Office 2007 ribbon as part of the Windows 7 user interface. In M3.6780 both Paint and WordPad swap pull-down menus for a morphing context-sensitive toolbar (the ribbon-esque UI element itself is rumoured to be called ‘Scenic’, as opposed to Office 2007’s ‘Fluent’ architecture). The ribbon is of course the handiwork of Julie Larson-Green, who lead the radical overhaul of Office 2007’s UI before being made head of Windows 7’s UX (User experience) team.

Ironically and controversially, while some of Windows’ most anaemic and least-clicked applications get a facelift a trio of far more practical applets have been ditched. Windows Mail (formerly Outlook Express), Photo Gallery and Movie Maker will all be scrapped from the Windows 7 codebase. In their place, users will be asked to download the equivalent package from Microsoft’s Windows Live suite.

The risk is that this makes a fresh out-of-the-box Windows 7 PC less immediately useful than a Mac – or for that matter a Windows XP or even Windows 9x machine. Microsoft’s gamble is that sufficient users have the necessary broadband Internet connection and incentive to click a link on their Windows 7 desktop and not just download those programs but start using these and other Windows Live services for email, sharing photos, calendaring, instant messaging, blogging and the like.



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Your Average Joe (Cornerstone member):

You just can't win when you're MS !
Put 'bloatware' in and people say we don't need the large footprint, take it out and it won't have the same usability as the Mac !

Ribbon - I have gotten used to Office 2007 so no problems there.
Faster MP - YAY !
Cloud - meh !
Calc Plus - Could be useful, but I'm guessing not as good as dedicated maths apps.
Movie Maker - Boo ! I like it for the simple tasks it does very well !

*** NB !!!
This is a leaked beta release report ! So my comments are just opinions based on heresay :)

25 September 2008, 9:19 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Tin (Regular user):

Quoting Your Average Joe:
You just can't win when you're MS !
Put 'bloatware' in and people say we don't need the large footprint, take it out and it won't have the same usability as the Mac !


Actually they could win quite easily... Do exactly what Win3.1 and Win95 installers did: Have a page asking which parts to install.
Has it really been that long since "Average Joe" installed a program that asked the user what they wanted?

25 September 2008, 11:06 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

CBR1100XX (Advanced member):

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO !!!
Not the Ribbon !

Cloud has promise though :)

25 September 2008, 9:26 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

I'd always thought any major release would involve more that just another shuffle of buttons and toolbars.

I guess that's why I'm not an MS marketing type. The drip feed releases do nothing to indicate anything much will be an improvement rather than a shiny and expensive re-skin. I wish they'd be able to prove me wrong.

The two stage approach to media player is a good idea however, someone was actually thinking and/or listening on that one.

25 September 2008, 9:35 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

plutonium210 (Advanced member):

All you Vista Fanboys must be in a right frenzy of excitement ... LOL !!
Don't forget there is an alternative if it doesn't work out !
It's cheaper, faster, stronger, better .............. It's SUPERMAC :)

25 September 2008, 9:39 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Hemma (User):

Quoting plutonium210:
Don't forget there is an alternative if it doesn't work out !
It's cheaper, faster, stronger, better .............. It's SUPERMAC :)

Yeah and Mactards keep trying to sell what is essentially the same product to the rest of us. Stop it! If we want alternative, we can go Linux / Openoffice, thankyouverymuch!


25 September 2008, 9:44 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

plutonium210 (Advanced member):

Quoting Hemma:
If we want alternative, we can go Linux / Openoffice

Linux ? An alternative ? ........ Linux will always be a compromise !
And as for OpenOffice, Even a 'Mactard' like me will give kudos to MS here (eek !). Any serious user of an office package will scoff at the suggestion that OO is a superior product to MS Office !




25 September 2008, 10:24 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Tin (Regular user):

Quoting plutonium210:
Linux will always be a compromise !


Ummm. How exactly?
And in what way isn't it compromising to hand over truckloads of cash to MS/Apple/Google/ only to have them more or less own your data in some proprietary format?

Quoting plutonium210:
Any serious user of an office package will scoff at the suggestion that OO is a superior product to MS Office !


I'm now wondering if you actually used any of these products for more than 2 seconds... Every time this topic comes up, I ask 1 question... Name one thing you can do in MS Office that can't be done in Open Office. I rarely get an answer.

25 September 2008, 5:23 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

Quoting Tin:
Name one thing you can do in MS Office that can't be done in Open Office.

Use the packaging as an emergency vase - there's one :>


25 September 2008, 5:29 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Me In Oz (Cornerstone member):

Quoting Tin:
hand over truckloads of cash to MS/Apple/Google

I don't want to get into a Linux vs the world slanging match here but I do get miffed when people constantly think that paying for something is evil and 'Free' Linux is the 'saviour' of the computing world.
Free does not mean good !

Quoting Tin:
Name one thing you can do in MS Office that can't be done in Open Office. I rarely get an answer.

Data analysis in Excel is far superior to OO ! Try doing analysis of variance in OO .......... Virtually impossible. Try importing text data into a spreadsheet in OO. Powerpoint is far superior, especially importing and resizing diagrams. Animations are better.




25 September 2008, 8:02 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Tin (Regular user):

Or totally without paying anything for new hardware, you could download Ubuntu (or get it sent to you for free on a CD).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cldeHjFig_c

25 September 2008, 11:11 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Me In Oz (Cornerstone member):

Everyone is missing the obvious story here !
I think what this leaked beta is saying is that MS is slimming/scaling Win 7 to suit mobile devices like net pc's ! XP won't be availible for the likes of eeePC for ever.
And thank goodness my biggest gripe about WMP has been dealt with :)

25 September 2008, 10:00 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

tim2hawkes (User):

yeah
i have the original beta and it has everything that vista has and more
because of this i will cherish my beta

25 September 2008, 10:13 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Me In Oz (Cornerstone member):

Quoting tim2hawkes:
i have the original beta

.................. Huh ?

".. As Windows 7 heads towards its first beta release .." - APC

I'm with YAJ here, let's wait until RTM before we all roundly condemn this product !




25 September 2008, 10:46 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

tim2hawkes (User):

SOME OF US GOT TO TRY IT EARLY

25 September 2008, 9:26 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Me In Oz (Cornerstone member):

Please expand on your reply for the rest of us laymans.
What and why are you special enough to get a pre-beta test from MS ?
Or are you testing a 'dark' version ?

25 September 2008, 9:35 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

tim2hawkes (User):

If u want a copy just ask
its half n half its a legal version that works
but every time it will only lanst an hour
so a crack will fix it
I want to try win 7 but havent got to it yet more important things to do
so any way give me a buzz if you want to try it

27 September 2008, 11:46 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

AndyCee (Advanced member):

Quoting Me In Oz:
MS is slimming/scaling Win 7 to suit mobile devices like net pc's !


That's an interesting point.

Microsoft would have missed out on a large part of the ultraportable market had they not extended the life of XP. Designing a new Windows with the capability of running 'lite' would be a good way to ditch the requirement for XP, which is showing its age.




25 September 2008, 1:13 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

TV Bis (User):

I am sticking with Vista as it's the best OS so far. I personally don't want to download programs that I would expect to come with the OS. I for one do not have a ton of download time and due to the price I never will, so to say they think everyone has the necessary broadband is just plain arrogant presumption. If I pay for a product I expect the works for my money, not a cut down version which will cost me more money in the end to download. This is what happens when people complain too much about software getting too big (which is only natural when you add more) - you get less! I have used Microsoft OS from the start and all I can say is this release is rushed and stupid and it has come about all because the media killed a perfectly good OS from the start, then every Tom, Dick and Harriet got on the band wagon and made things worse. Now the normal everyday happy Vista user will suffer with less if he or she wants to upgrade to a later product. Last but not least "The Ribbon idea sucks"

25 September 2008, 10:33 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Me In Oz (Cornerstone member):

Quoting TV Bis:
I am sticking with Vista as it's the best OS so far.

You're preaching to the converted here :)
Vista has no peers when it comes to gaming and entertainment !




25 September 2008, 10:47 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

Quoting Me In Oz:
You're preaching to the converted here :)


Quoting plutonium210:
Don't forget there is an alternative if it doesn't work out !
It's cheaper, faster, stronger, better

hmm looks like contention, and barrows to push. by all means have your favorites, but please gentlemen dont presume what suits you is right for all humanity.





25 September 2008, 11:01 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Me In Oz (Cornerstone member):

Quoting Raindog:
gentlemen dont presume what suits you is right for all humanity.

That's presumptous, don't you think ?
I have not advocated in any of my posts that 'humanity' should go and purchase Vista. Our company will sell you a copy of OSX if you like. What 'humanity' does is of no interest to me (other than they should spend their money in our store). I have always stated that "I LIKE VISTA".




25 September 2008, 11:09 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

AtticusFinch (User):

Trimmed down, I hope the upgrade path is a little cheaper this time. But knowing M$, it won't be !


25 September 2008, 10:58 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

Quoting AtticusFinch:
Trimmed down, I hope the upgrade path is a little cheaper this time. But knowing M$, it won't be !

You've got it in one AF, it is a good thing that MS is considering that their products may be used in places other than the latest & greatest high horsepower desktop, and as a response are considering slimmed down options. But all of this will be of little value if the buyer still gets hit up for a grab bag of useless junk they never load.

Many Linux are also guilty of the same application cram, but it's nowhere near the same problem when you are not having to shell out cash for stuff you will never use.




25 September 2008, 11:07 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Your Average Joe (Cornerstone member):

'bloatware' has always been a bugbear of mine !
Let's keep in mind Win 7 is designed to run on today's and tomorrow's computers, not yesterday's !
So here is a bit of perspective .........
1 Terabyte HDD = $150.00
4 Gig DDR2 RAM = $85

Thus, so what if Win 7 takes up to 20 gig to install !
So what if it's operating footprint takes up to 500 Meg of RAM !

Tin,
And as for the last time I had a choice on what to install from an app ? ..... Never bothered me, and I usually perform the 'Recommended' install :)

25 September 2008, 11:35 AM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

Quoting Your Average Joe:
So here is a bit of perspective .........
1 Terabyte HDD = $150.00
4 Gig DDR2 RAM = $85

Thus, so what if Win 7 takes up to 20 gig to install !
So what if it's operating footprint takes up to 500 Meg of RAM !

That is a somewhat personal perspective. For a home gamer with time to burn and a hobby to be had I can see how it appears entirely reasonable.

But take those same numbers and multiply them by 25 to 100 seats, then factor in the labour to modify or replace the same number of PCs, and equate that against a zero return on investment.

No productivity increase, in fact it will actually go down while 25 to 100 desk droids all bemoan they have not had training on ribbon interfaces.

Not everyone sees a computer as a hobby, from my perspective they are just a tool to achieve a task. If achieving the same old tasks require ever more hardware and software then it is hardly progress.




25 September 2008, 1:02 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Your Average Joe (Cornerstone member):

Quoting Raindog:
But take those same numbers and multiply them by 25 to 100 seats, then factor in the labour to modify or replace the same number of PCs, and equate that against a zero return on investment.

Win 7 is designed for Today's and Tomorrow's computers, not Yesterday's !

And yes ! My perspective is a personal one where I enjoy the leisure side of computing and also the importation and wholesaling of hardware





25 September 2008, 1:32 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

Quoting Your Average Joe:
Win 7 is designed for Today's and Tomorrow's computers, not Yesterday's !

Is that why Win 7 addresses the problems of climate change, CO2 emissions. landfill and dumping of toxic materials. by requiring even more resources and obsoleting functional hardware, all to simply achieve a given task with a new skin.

Sounds like a real solution for the future.



25 September 2008, 5:10 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

tfacter (User):

Its as i expected it to be.. An extremely tweaked out grown up edition of vista

25 September 2008, 1:41 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

McBanjo (User):

"The Ribbon" was a fantastic feature in Word 2007. However, just because Microsoft did something good in one program doesn't mean it'll translate well into a whole operating system.

For a simple program like WordPad or Paint, the benefits are in the small footprint and simple interface and the Ribbon is freaking huge! Remember the Office Suite has a million options, settings and features. So I'd like to see them implement a mini-ribbon that takes half the space, rather than just trying to find/create options to fill the excess space. (Insert Date and Time? Seriously.) Think smart Microsoft. Do you really need a massive icon on the screen that says "Paste" when most people just Ctrl+V anyway?

25 September 2008, 4:22 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

jake (User):

why take out windows movie maker or windows photo gallery
if Microsoft take anything else out i'm sticking with vista, why because i don't want to have to download things that should already in windows and waist my download limit, each time i install windows i already have to download heaps of things so i can do my work

25 September 2008, 5:04 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

Quoting jake:
why take out windows movie maker or windows photo gallery

Umm because they are arguably nothing more than half baked apps that have open source replacements freely available, and because they are nothing but a hindrance for those who wish to load decent video or graphics programs.


Quoting jake:
i don't want to have to download things that should already(?) in windows and waist(?) my download limit

Things like a spelling and grammar check?


Quoting jake:
each time i install windows

There is the concept of backup media, why do you have to download everything?

MS had a better solution previously when windows contained less toys and trinkets for those who did not require them, and had on off Plus pucks for those that wanted the stuff, all for a combined cost less than that for of the current bloated offerings.

25 September 2008, 5:22 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

jake (User):

Quoting Raindog:
why do you have to download everything?


because i like to start over from floor 1 i just need to download my must have programs

25 September 2008, 5:55 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

Quoting jake:
because i like to start over from floor 1

And re-running the application installer doesn't do this?


Quoting jake:
i just need to download my must have programs

yes but only once, to USB stick, writable Cd, Writable DVD, pocket hard drive, another PC, NAS, zip drive, even a stack of old floppies if your brave.

You don't purchase new trousers every time you walk to the fish shop, so why would you need to download the same applications over and over again?


25 September 2008, 6:04 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

jake (User):

your missing my point the point is you shouldn't have to waist your time, money and download usage on something that should already have the basic things you need

25 September 2008, 6:23 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Raindog (Senior Forumologist):

Quoting jake:
your missing my point

No I'm suggesting it is a viewpoint that takes into account very only a single parameter with complete disregard to all other requirements of an OS.


Quoting jake:
you shouldn't have to waist your time, money and download usage on

How is it a waste of time? If you want something you download out it, or purchase it with the money you'd have saved if your OS was not bloated with giggleware apps.


Quoting jake:
something that should already have the basic things you need

That WHO needs, most people don't NEED this garbage at all, why do I need to pay for garbage I'll never use because you wish to save your download allowance? It makes no sense at all. You are aware you are paying for stuff you could have replaced with an open source equivalent?


25 September 2008, 7:19 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

jake (User):

Quoting Raindog:
That WHO needs, most people don't NEED this garbage at all, why do I need to pay for garbage I'll never use because you wish to save your download allowance? It makes no sense at all. You are aware you are paying for stuff you could have replaced with an open source equivalent?


you don't pay for it, it is FREE you can download it from microsoft but thats costs money, windwos 7 will cost more than vista, i NEED the extra stuff thats why i said microsoft should put the custom install back in, end of argument please

26 September 2008, 12:02 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

jake (User):

why can't microsoft re add the "custom install" "recommended" "portable" "full install" and the other button back into the installation then if you picked full install you would get everything vista has and more and if you picked portable you would install a trimmed down windows 7

25 September 2008, 5:12 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Julius (New user):

Joe what is mac os x doing in this, its just a brand, Apple cant be the next windows....



25 September 2008, 5:17 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Julius (New user):

joe how is apple even in this topic?

Apple is a brand, LIke sony

Macs arnt windows macs arnt the future



25 September 2008, 5:18 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

jake (User):

Quoting Julius:
Macs arnt windows macs arnt the future




your right an apple is something you eat and windows is something in your wall that lets you see outside. lol
but u right

25 September 2008, 5:22 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Julius (New user):

lol :P

Apple will die in 50 years or so, i see no future than them bringing new ipods every year... if they bring there os to pcs then im wrong

25 September 2008, 5:28 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

McBanjo (User):

People have been predicting Apple's death for the last few decades. Still hasn't happened, and they keep gaining market share.

If you knew anything about Apple, you'd know that they're not going to just sit around and die. I came across this article which gives a very insightful look to the inner workings of Apple:

http://www.x-plane.com/iPhone

Scroll down to "The Story of the X-Plane on iPhone."

25 September 2008, 5:50 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Julius (New user):

yea yea Market share

Apple Lost some Today

HAHAHAHAHAHA

30 September 2008, 5:42 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

Julius (New user):

but the article link you sent me is good

30 September 2008, 5:43 PM (1 year ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

DWornock (New user):

"Windows Mail (formerly Outlook Express), Photo Gallery and Movie Maker will all be scrapped from the Windows 7 codebase. In their place, users will be asked to download the equivalent package from Microsoft’s Windows Live suite."

Claiming Windows Live Mail is equivalent to Outlook Express is like saying Mother Teresa is like Madonna. For each email account Outlook Express has one folder. Windows mail creates about 250 folders. And in outlook express you could Name, create, and specify different folders for each account. Windows live will not allow you to specify but one folder. All accounts go in that one primary folder.

With Outlook Express it was easy to import and read messages. In Windows live you can import, but until you exit Windows live and use My Computer to locate and move all the imported mail to the folders with the new mail, you cannot read imported mail.

Outlook Express was simple and easy to understand. Windows live never heard of KISS. Windows live is very complicated to set up and use.

26 May 2009, 1:04 AM (9 months ago)report abuse Send to a friend reply

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